blonde poker forum

What do you think of my play?

What would you do differently?

I will post my thoughts and the results  later...


8 players left in the $215 Sunday night on Stars. First prize $162,000.

I am fifth in chips with just over a million (The average is about 1.5 million) Blinds are 30-60k with a running 3k.

Play is generally tight, but the guy in the sb is by far the loosest player seeing many flops and playing quite passively but he seems hard to get rid of once he's in a pot.

I pick up TT in second position. I raise to 180k. Everyone passes to the sb who has 2.2 million. He calls. Bb passes. There is 444k in the pot.

Flop comes Qh Jd 9d.

He bets 60k.

I call.

Turn comes 7h.

He bets 60k.

I raise to 240k total. (A raise of 180k)

He calls.

River comes 6d.

We both check.


What do you reckon?

Hmmm, first thought is to reraise the flop.
60k into a 444k pot looks like a tester or just trying to stop you betting big, just flat calling would tell me you haven't gotten too much of the flop so the turn reraise doesn't look too daunting.
Though once he called the turn raise i would have given up on the hand too.

So basically a reraise on the flop would have been stronger (looking) than on the turn.

Looks as if he has AJ here , he's not sure if you have the Q, and has now found out that you dont have it, also a flush draw on board keep it passive

Thanks for posting this here Keith...likely to be a range of opinions on this one!

I think the key here is your action on the turn. I think I flat call on the flop too.

Why is your raise so small relative to pot size on the turn, he has to call a raise of 180k into a pot of 804k (correct me if I am wrong) so exactly what hand do you expect him to pass here getting those odds? Are you just pot building for when you hit?

You say he is difficult to get rid of and I would be interested to know if you think you are ahead  on the flop? his range of hands must include flush and straight draws, any Q or J or 9 etc.

once he has checked on the river I would be sorely tempted to bet.

I would be all in on the flop. If you had deep stacks I would prob call flop and turn and fold to a big river bet, but you ain't so I shove it in.

I agree with IFM that the reraise the flop with your hand is the correct decision.

With you flat calling on the flop i think you are either saying i have a 10, a flush draw or an AK that hasnt hit. IMO with a board that scary any hand that has hit that flop will be reraising to get rid of straight/flush draws.

I think if i were to play the hand then i would probably reraise the flop to find out where i was maybe to 280-300k then if called check the turn.

I think your reraise on the turn was perhaps on the low side as its only another 180k into a 880k pot( i think if my adding up is ok). If you had been betting into someone with an average stack then this raise could have worked as you are putting their tourney lives at stake. I think the turn raise of that size into Mr CallerMcallerson with a 2.2million stack hes going to be callling with any part of that board.

I think on the river check has to be the right option, unless you have some seriously large bollcoks and pushing it all in.


Congrats on the result!!

His flop bet looks weak and I suppose the push all in with a view to getting him to fold or having good outs to win the hand if he calls is an option.

I am looking at the turn from his view, if you were really strong I think you raise on the flop as my flop bet looks like I am drawing or info betting. So your raise on the turn doesnt strike me as a protection raise on what is now a quite scary board.(tho it could look like a   K 10 raise) If I was raising there I might have pushed because I think thats what you would do with a strong hand here given the draws that are around as he bets bigger on the flop with top pair good kicker and two pair. Obviously I am hoping for a fold. Im not sure I raise there tho.

I think I  move in on the end thinking I may be behind but he has bet small on two streets and then checked when the diamond drops on the end but by raising on the turn im not sure you have enough chips to put him off his hand if he is prone to making loose calls....sorry I havent done the exact math but I think you have around 500k left.

Calling his bets on two streets would have given you cheap shots at your draw and kept the pot smallish and the hand would have ended as it did with a check check, which is no bad thing. I think there were spots that you could have possibly taken the hand off him.

Keith, I would like to hear what you think on this reply, cause if I am talking bollox I would like to hear it from one of the best.

How the hell can we tell Keith what (if anything) he did wrong, he's THE man! But fascinating hand.

Me? I'm into "finding out where I am", so I'd have put a big bet in on the flop, then no more if he called. But I'd have been out way before the Final!

I watched this hand and didn't know what you had at the time was gonna pm you to ask.

I either move all in on the flop OR just call on the flop and 4th street.

But the best play is what you did I think I just personally wouldn't at this stage. Raising the turn gives you a chance to take it down and you suspect you might be winning, also you are gonna check the river if a K or 8 doesn't fall.

Good play just the wrong result. (This was picked up from playing limit Keith?)

Just what i was thinking!

Allin on the flop and he is only calling with a hand thats got you beat. I like the reraise on the turn (semi bluff after all) and because you didn't push to many chips in it looks like you are milking him- from your brief analysis of the player this play me be to advanced against him. I cant raise on the flop as I am asking for action I don't really want and by raising small on the turn you made him check the river. Think you played the hand as good as it can be played and you lost the minimum by the sounds. Great result btw.

I posted my response before reading anyone elses but now I have I am amazed how many of you will still fall for a weak lead- this bet is common in big tournaments and you had all better learn to stop reraising flops like this. If a good player flops a monster he regularly leads out begging for a reraise, I'm not saying this was the case in this hand but if you gonna reraise here after a small probe looking bet you going to be left with lots of tricky decisions. What if you reraise the flop and I go allin? Obviously I have the monster and have duped you into reraising ( or do I have rags and am just pretending i ran a weak lead into you?). Calling is not always a weak play and is certainly for me the correct play at this stage of the tournament.

I like just calling down here, once the flop is called

Stewart Reuben talks about a Mortons Fork principle in his omaha script, and it seems to apply here. If he is ahead, the raise by you (potentially) lets him bet you out the pot, and he is laying you a real good price to draw even if you just had a naked 10,  and if he is behind, there arent many improving cards for him on the river, and just calling mite get him to bet into you again on the river.. so you (seemingly) gain either way.

As for the play on the flop, I'm quite torn. I generally dont like raisin in spots like this as I'm not confident enough in my opponents ability to fold weak Q's or J's, so it would feel too much like raising hoping to get best hands folding in a spot where I dont trust their ability to fold (because AK missed and people always put you on AK online) so i'd probably just call down cheaply and see if we can hit or get a real discounted showdown

nice result in the tourney

Nice post Russ, the raise leaves you with the tough decisions but the all in takes that away, what is your view on making these big all in raises with drawing hands like the one above, I dont like it but see it done many times and on this occasion he needs a big hand to call and the fold equity is pretty good.


I know you play a lot of cash, how do you play these drawing hands in cash games and tourneys?

tourneys and cash is like comparing rugby union to rugby league- may be the same shaped ball with plenty men trying to kill each other but its completely different.
In a cash game you would probably make the raise on the flop to define your hand or try to get a free card on the turn presuming he calls then checks. In a tourney an allin raise here is only going to be called by a hand that has you beat and a small raise is only going to make the pot bigger and worth stealing. Sure if he calls with a hand that beats you you may still have outs- I say may because what if he has KTds here- you are drawing very thin for a chop. I do not like the allin semibluff on the flop here at this stage of a comp, earlier I can justify it but now we are getting towards the real money and I dont like putting my tournament life at stake betting to lose (ie he can only call you if you are screwed). By raising the turn he has also taken away the opportunity to bluff the change on the river imo as an astute player would be able to put you on that bluff (very few players have the game or the balls to reraise the turn on a flush draw)

Thanks, Im having some problems playing these kind of drawing hands, I read about and see so many people pushing on the flop and I see the sense as you have two ways to win, I just dont feel comfy doing this myself. In the cash game I am happy to raise the flop when in position with the view to taking the hand or getting a free card  but play them very(too) passively when out of position and tend to check call when getting the odds to do so.

As for the bet on the end, it could look like a bluff but its a big call for the other guy to make after your second show of strength. I am looking at the 1.5 million stack I would have if he folds instead of the 500k if I think I am behind but might move him.

If keith bets the river here he is called with anything that beats him. I can call him there with as little as JT to be honest and I would put him on either TT or AT. I can deffinately rule out the flush anyway. He does not get the bluff through on the river - if the other guy folds his tens were good anyway. Tricky hand this but imo Keith played it as well as it could have been played no matter what the outcome was.

Thanks, I agree that if he gets called he is behind and as I said Im not sure that the bet would be enough to move the other guy off his hand and if he is as good as you guys he may see the bet the same as you and correctly call.

sometimes you have to accept that you cant get a guy to throw away any hand that beats you- this for me is one of those examples. Just check it back and if your tens are good then they are good.

I like the way this was played, all except the size of the raise on the turn. Maybe slightly bigger.

Raising on the flop vs this type of player does not appeal to me at all.

haven't been on this board before, looks good tho!
tough hand,
nasty flop but has potential.
i prob just call him all the way, terrified of getting moved-in on if i dare to raise him....
that's my play in a live environment anyhow,

online tho,
I BREAK IT OFF IN HIS ASS ON THE FLOP
(to quote the rookie)

hee hee.It will be great to see the Camels thinking along the streets.

Do you not think that at this stage of the tournament that the SB would be willing to just flat call with so called monster hands out of position. Wouldnt a reraise be likely from AA-QQ maybe JJ aswell along with AK and AQ. The only hands that he could be leading out with are K10/99 but even with a set/two pair on this flop wouldnt you bet more to protect your hand from a potential flush or straight draw. I just cant see how anyone would want to milk anything from this flop unless they had the stone cold nuts. He has a big stack why potentially risk getting outdrawn and going from relative chip saftey to being right back in the pack.

What do you do if you just call the flop bet and you then face a 250k bet on the turn?


But i have never been in such a final table situation with such sums on offer so i could be talking utter nonsense

I think he could be weak on the flop, and with him being our resident at-it merchant he could have a hand such as  8h 5h... bluffs the flop then makes some sort of hand on the turn and don't want to go away!

I probably reraise the flop here ( so everyone weak lead into me!) If he does have the hand or the courage to reraise again then i bow out kicking and screaming with my 600k

OK by your reasoning the reraise on turn fell for the weak lead......
I don't claim to be all knowing and i certainly am not in the same class as Camel et al but...
I still think if the semibluff reraise is the move then it is stronger on the flop.

on the turn it cant be a weak lead as you have already shown you may be drawing by calling flop. If he has very strong hand he has to protect it on turn by betting stronger. This is why the reraise semi on the turn is good as he probably only has a weak draw or a rag jack/queen himself.

whats wrong with flop call turn call and then take a view on the river then?

I'm a big fan of taking the lead in this hand, reraising the flop sends a message, if he bets big on the turn he HAS to have a hand, if not then i am a non believer and am gonna stick a big bet in here.
I do get the weak bet thingy, i do it a lot myself but not on a board like that without the straight, a reraise will force him to reveal how strong he is.

Jam the river imo.

Its unlikely he has donk led twice with a fl draw.
Its v unlikely he has a st draw as you have TT.

So therefore he has you beat but I watched the hand and was convinced he had no clue as to where he was and would 100% have passed to a river jam.

He passes plenty of big hands to a river jam on that board and passes AJ in a heartbeat. You had an extremely tight solid image and he would have respected that.

and because of that I will bet small on the flop and when you reraise me I will jam it allin- obviously I have the str8? I will also do this with rags because I know a good player will be trying for information so I will give it to him. The only way of stopping me making this play on you is to jam it allin but there are obvious risks in that play too. The call on the flop and raise on the turn is correct imo- it almost guarantees a check on the river meaning you will have lost the minimum. If Keith checks the turn and numpty bets big on the river where are you now? He would have to bet big on the river with a busted flush draw so you are tempted to call with your TT- in this instance i feel calling the turn costs you chips as your opponent should bet the river. reraising the turn also leaves you to bet allin on the river as Dubai would have but I make the call on you because of what i said earlier in this thread (although I know you do also reraise on the turn with the ace ten of diamonds etc so I would have to dwell a while first lol)

I understand what you say and it makes sense but surely if jamming the flop is inherent of risk then so would a move by the oppo too?
With that flop you would jam the flop to a reraise??
I can't see the justification for it, as you say you are only getting called by a winning hand.

Gotta say i love this stuff!!

In reply to Arison, I think that min bet move either does show major weakness or major strength but with a board like that would you be min betting a made straight or a set.

If he has nothing what would be the point in reraising all in. At this moment in time he has 2million chips and is still in a very strong position to go on and win the tourney. If he loses hes down to 1.2million in chips which would put him below the average and 8 people still to go. To reraise someone all in that has already shown pre-flop strength at a tight table, he would then be reraising the flop bet of someone who has said i have a big hand im willing to play for chips and take it down.


that probably doesnt make any sense little tired!

Thats how I saw it on the river, I think I am behind but he is weak so its a case of check check or move in.

I think this is a fold on the flop.

I don't fancy T's on that flop regardless of the fact that the guy is playing loose.  A 60k lead out on that flop is either an idiot who doesn't know what he is doing (60k into a 444k pot ???) or a bet inviting a reraise as Ariston pointed out.  He could have flopped a straight with a K9, 2 pair with JQ, etc..  Either way I don't think I would continue after the flop given that after my preflop raise I am down to 800k and any attempt to take the pot with a significant bet would put me in a bad way. 

However given he only bet 60k I would probably call the flop bet assuming I am behind and drawing to 6 outs for the straight.  I don't like a raise here because if he is unlikely to fold what is the point ?  If he checks the turn do you fire again, or check and then face a river bet into you.  His turn bet is very strange but there are still 2 overcards and a flush draw on the board.  I would call the 60k turn bet rather than raise because a) I don't believe I am ahead at this point b) mateyboy has already shown he is difficult to get off a hand c) if he re-raises what do you do ?  d) I have pot odds for my straight draw  If I miss the straight I fold to any river bet (unless he bets 60k again).

All things considered I would like to think I would fold to the flop bet, weak play as it is.  There are 2 overcards and a flush draw on the board and any defence of this hand is going to cost a significant amount of chips.  If you call the flop and turn bets, the pot will be nearly 700k by the river and it would be difficult to fold to any modest sized river bet given the size of the pot.  It is a passive play and is probably a weakness in my game but I would still play safe in this position given my stack size.

Did you misread the hand??

He has an open str8 draw. TT on a QJ9 board.

IMO I'd say your opponent has unsuited AK and was betting for value in case the Ace, King or Ten hit. As none hit by the river he now doesnt know where he is and all he has is the nut Ace high. Either that or he has the flush and is trapping you. Either way I'd bet out and see what he has if he calls.

Great thread.

I think the thread proves it was a pretty difficult hand to play..

Anyways, here is my thought process during the hand:

My raise was a standard 3 time the BB job.

The caller was pretty loose/passive and I didn't mind playing a pot with position against him.

The weak lead bet signifies one of two things usually. Either he has flopped a huge hand and wants me to raise or he is trying to see the turn card cheaply. I didn't raise on the flop because I felt he was the sort of player to call with a draw and with so many possible draws there I didn't want to risk my tournament when the chances of me being a big favourite (him having a bare ten or T9) were seemingly very small. It seemed likely to me it was either going to be about a coin flip (Him having Axd, Kxd) or he was a big favourite (Txd, QT, JT). So I called.

Now, I have rarely, if ever seen a weak lead on the flop, followed by a weak lead on the the turn. Now this convinced me he was drawing.

I tried to raise enough to make it expensive but keep enough back to jam the river. Perhaps I should have raised 60k more.

When the diamond fell on the river, I did feel like he would have checked anything other than the nut flush to me and called if I pushed. I felt like he would have folded a jack on the turn and called with a queen. He couldn't put me on a flush draw due to my raise on the turn (although I do raise on flush draws on the turn if I feel I can get my opponent off his hand). The only hand which I could get him off with a river push that I wasn't beating already was TJ. So I checked.

He showed AJ and won the pot. Obviously I will never know if he would fold on the river for my push. But I suspect he would have made a crying call.

In retrospect, I think I should have check called all the way against this opponent (That Thew boy knows his stuff). The thing to remember about the semi bluff is it only worth doing against an opponent who is capable of folding. I don't think this guy was the folding type...

Lovely run through of the hand Camel.

If you had just called his turn bet would you have done anything different on the river?

One of the best I have read on Blonde so far Camel, congrats on the result 8)

I think I would have pushed on the flop, but i agree 100% that you need to find the right player that will lay the hand down.  :goodpost: :ironside: :respect:

Maximum pressure as I would say :blonde:, thats why I would have pushed :D

dunno about Thewy, I think Tighty and JP both said the best play was to check call all the way (depending on the size of bet on the river & possibly passing on the river)
I agree and think the re-raise was probably a small mistake (as it would have probably gone check check on the river)
The most probably hands here for your opponent are KQ or AJ and it doesn't sound like he is likely to pass either, so all those who say go all-in on the flop should go to the bottom of the class....in my opinion

What do you think the cons of the reraise on the flop folks?

what do you wanna achieve by raising? you have a pretty tough job getting better hands folding.. so you are almost in the position of betting in a spot where better hands call, and worse hands fold, and given your hand, its not overly likely that a second best hand will improve, because a) your 10/10 are blockers to gutshots b) one of the two overcards that comes makes your straight and c) you are being laid a really pretty price to draw even if you had just a naked 10

Re-opening the betting in this spot is gonna put you in a world of hurt if he comes over the top, as you have just jazzed away the chance to play the pot small with (hopefully) quite a few outs, and given the stage of the tourney, I'd expect it to be the case that calling here is better then raising. You can also represent the flush if it comes on the river and poooosh, which would be hard to do if you raise and get 3-bet out the pot.. and if you raise and he folds? awesome, you just made him fold a worse hand a real high % of the time. Maybe its the case that you dont get another chip out of him unless he improves, so you are glad that he folded a worse hand, but when you weight it all together, I think the pro's of just calling outweigh the minus' by a pretty high %

cheers, all makes sense.
What about the reraise on the flop opposed to the reraise on the turn then?

Most of my comments were directed at the flop raise, hope that came through clearly.... as for the re-rai on the turn...

...I think they are much the same....once you call the flop, its hard to raise the turn and convince the villain that you are best (especially for such a small amount) , and it doesn't give you the chance to bluff the river if the flush comes as I think ariston alluded to earlier. It does buy you a free river a large % of the time, but the way the betting has gone, its unlikely that the villain is suddenly going to bet $400k on the river.. so you will prolly get the cheap river just by calling... and calling just lets you see the river, rather then risk getting blasted off the pot (although admittedly this is a small concern)

IFFFFFFF I did raise the river up, Id (typically) be doing it with the intention of bombing the river, not to get a free card.. as it feels like he has a weak hand that beats you, and bombing the pot seems like the only way to win it, (on the times you miss your hand)  and raising the turn sets up the river bet quite nicely. Its quite exploitable, and great players will prolly see rite through it, you just gotta hope you aren't facing a good player = )

Thats only an if though, calling the turn seems best

What a stonking Thread, more of these please.

Especially interested in the Posts by Totaliise, I'd not fancy playing him too often, but from start to finish, a quality thread.

How big a bet do you call on the river please Mr blondie Sir?

The way the hand played out I call a bet of any size on the river and I am sure Dave C does too. It is just too obvious that a guy is trying to buy the pot imo. I don't think many players would pass on the river after calling the reraise on the turn. They may be fish not good enough to fold AJ or they may be a good player who has worked out what you got- either way you are getting called I think.