blonde poker forum

Okay so a $24+2 45 man final table, and bear in mind they are a pretty top-heavy payout structure.

Villain has a 45% steal percentage (admittedly over a small sample, but fair to assume his range here is huge), and standard 3x's the button.

What's the best way to extract the most chips here?

***** Hand History for Game 13139838786 ***** (Full Tilt)
$60000.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, July 01, 02:00:35 ET 2009
Table 24  2 Sit  Go (97450674) Table 4 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: HakunaMatata74 ( $8750.00 USD )
Seat 3: Luzcache ( $16214.00 USD )
Seat 4: Boxed Canyon ( $11636.00 USD )
Seat 7: Fido7Dido ( $12640.00 USD )
Seat 8: PNBRAZIL ( $18260.00 USD )
Fido7Dido posts small blind [$300.00 USD].
PNBRAZIL posts big blind [$600.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Fido7Dido [  Qh Qs ]
HakunaMatata74 folds
Luzcache folds
Boxed Canyon raises [$1800.00 USD]
Fido7Dido ....

re raise to circa 4.6k - (make it look like you might have left a fold in there)

get em in on any non A flop

problem in the hand is you are OOP so dont want to get too tricky - im just commiting here

villian dependant

Agree, but what if we don't know much about villain except his stats after 69 hands?

how gutted will u be if you play slow and lose?

if not play slow!

minraise then type 'oops, misclick' into the chat box

type ooops then min raise

lmao, i like this!

I don't think it works so well if you type oops first George lol

Any arguments for flatting? I would usually do a 3bet in this spot which seems to be the general consensus, but is this a viable play or is QQ a little too vulnerable?

I don't mind flatting and leading or check/raising most flops

im not sure, i dont think 3-betting or flatting can be a big mistake. maybe i lean towards flatting, but only because on those finals people are so loathed to get it in. i donk like flatting then donk-leading though, as suggested by george. imo the reason we flat is to get the extra bet when he has junk and misses, if he hits i reckon he'll get them in almost just as much when you cr as when you donk lead

you cannot play this wrong, its almost impossible. Id rather see a shove than a small 3b though, as you will get more midpairs snapping you off....................

^^yeah man this was my thinking when I did this...


***** Hand History for Game 13139838786 ***** (Full Tilt)
$60000.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, July 01, 02:00:35 ET 2009
Table 24  2 Sit  Go (97450674) Table 4 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: HakunaMatata74 ( $8750.00 USD )
Seat 3: Luzcache ( $16214.00 USD )
Seat 4: Boxed Canyon ( $11636.00 USD )
Seat 7: Fido7Dido ( $12640.00 USD )
Seat 8: PNBRAZIL ( $18260.00 USD )
Fido7Dido posts small blind [$300.00 USD].
PNBRAZIL posts big blind [$600.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Fido7Dido [  Qh Qs ]
HakunaMatata74 folds
Luzcache folds
Boxed Canyon raises [$1800.00 USD]
Fido7Dido calls [$1500.00 USD]
PNBRAZIL folds
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jd, 4d, Kd ]
Fido7Dido ........................


Not the flop I had in mind! now what?....

No point betting here. When you are called you are either not that far ahead or way behind. Check call. Play it passively and fold to diamond or Ace on turn/river if he is betting them.

edit - just seen his range is huge. Not sure about folding to the ace or diamond unless there is a lot of action.

[ ] plan changed

100% crai.

I checked, wasn't sure what I was gonna do if he bet tbh, but...

***** Hand History for Game 13139838786 ***** (Full Tilt)
$60000.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, July 01, 02:00:35 ET 2009
Table 24  2 Sit  Go (97450674) Table 4 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: HakunaMatata74 ( $8750.00 USD )
Seat 3: Luzcache ( $16214.00 USD )
Seat 4: Boxed Canyon ( $11636.00 USD )
Seat 7: Fido7Dido ( $12640.00 USD )
Seat 8: PNBRAZIL ( $18260.00 USD )
Fido7Dido posts small blind [$300.00 USD].
PNBRAZIL posts big blind [$600.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Fido7Dido [  Qh Qs ]
HakunaMatata74 folds
Luzcache folds
Boxed Canyon raises [$1800.00 USD]
Fido7Dido calls [$1500.00 USD]
PNBRAZIL folds
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jd, 4d, Kd ]
Fido7Dido checks
Boxed Canyon checks
** Dealing Turn ** [ 6s ]
Fido7Dido .....

Bet pot,call any raise and check call any river letting him bluff/bet the J.

stacks?

is bet/fold really really weak here?

Is he really checking a big diamond or king on the flop from a steal position ? He may check 2 diamonds but i think we go broke the tiny amount of time this happens.

im not sure that i get where you're coming from, but my thinking is that the majority of hands that he jams on the turn with have us crushed

My thinking is that the hands we are worried about don't check the flop and therefore we can't fold the turn.

I don't like this line. We started the hand looking to stack villain but by crai we are trying to end the hand here most of the time, stack off to a better hand or flip against the Ad.

The hand gets lost on the flop. QQ no redraw on a all diamond flop next hand please.

nit

Villain steals lots. Why doesn't he try and steal this pot on a scary looking flop? Have we been 3-betting him lots? He could put some serious pressure on our stack and our random oop hand if he put out a good bet. But he checks instead? I would play this cautiously. Your flat pre is a mistake imo, but whatever, you slowplayed hoping for a much better flop than this, the trap hasn't worked, and I don't think jamming chips into the pot solves that problem.

i just blast in these things James

So you check turn then yeah ? Check/Fold or Check/Call ?

ZOMG - someone pass me a rope and a high ledge - Im in agreement with mantis!  ;)

Just check. If he bets small/regular prob fold, if he bets bigger maybe not. If we were deeper this would be different, but with these stacks any decent bet gets us having to answer an awkward question. We would see his bet in terms of our stack % not pot %...and we would still be oop. The bet, the board, the position, would pressure a large range of hands imo. What's the reason for him not to use his position to bet when the conditions are right for it? 

It will happen more & more frequently as you continue to progess ;)

Interesting thoughts.

I kinda thought I was in a spot where he had me crushed, or I was good anyway, so was happy to get to showdown. Obviously hoping to fade a diamond on the river incase he had something like 9dTc or of that nature. Perhaps gave up on the pot too easily, but I was of Mantis' way of thinking.

Anywayz, diamond on the river. No choice here but to check right, hard for me to represent any diamond based on my action?

Then he shoves. Anybody else here want to make a hero call? His line makes no sense to me. Obviously I didn't have the balls (plus he could be bluffing w/ the best hand?) and I folded having played the whole hand outta whack :(

***** Hand History for Game 13139838786 ***** (Full Tilt)
$60000.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, July 01, 02:00:35 ET 2009
Table 24  2 Sit  Go (97450674) Table 4 (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: HakunaMatata74 ( $8750.00 USD )
Seat 3: Luzcache ( $16214.00 USD )
Seat 4: Boxed Canyon ( $11636.00 USD )
Seat 7: Fido7Dido ( $12640.00 USD )
Seat 8: PNBRAZIL ( $18260.00 USD )
Fido7Dido posts small blind [$300.00 USD].
PNBRAZIL posts big blind [$600.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to Fido7Dido [  Qh Qs ]
HakunaMatata74 folds
Luzcache folds
Boxed Canyon raises [$1800.00 USD]
Fido7Dido calls [$1500.00 USD]
PNBRAZIL folds
** Dealing Flop ** [ Jd, 4d, Kd ]
Fido7Dido checks
Boxed Canyon checks
** Dealing Turn ** [ 6s ]
Fido7Dido checks
Boxed Canyon checks
** Dealing River ** [ 3d ]
Fido7Dido checks
Boxed Canyon bets [$9836.00 USD]
Fido7Dido folds
Boxed Canyon wins $9836.00 USD
Boxed Canyon wins $4200.00 USD from main pot

Thats blast pre btw just incase. Theres no play in the latter stages of these things. I hate flatting

Yeah man you're probs right, no real need to play so tricky, thanks for that...

If he wanted to steal this pot he would prefer to risk 2k on the flop rather than 10k on the river imo

I think this hand is bothering you because you realize he had nothing, right?

A high dmnd, flop flush, King or medium PP he's gonna put some chips in, especially if he's a stealer. He has nothing but weak ace at best, and knows you can't call when the 4th d hits.

It's hard init with a big PP in that situation. All depends how much you're willing to gamble to get into the top places. Like what's been said before, once you limp and see a horrible flop there's not much you can do except hope to check down or get away cheap.

u snapped his arm off right?

I don't like the check on the turn. If he calls and river is a diamond you can quite happily fold river knowing you are beat. By not betting at any point you just surrender the pot. He is more likely to be on a draw on the turn than have you beat. He can shove river wide here knowing you can't call as pretty much nobody does the Johnny Chan triple check with the nuts.

Lol @ Johnny Chan triple check

Yeah man, agree with this^^

Also agree with you Alex that I should call the river