blonde poker forum

$500k on Pokerstars, down to last 95

Av chips is around 90k

Blinds about to go up to 6000 12000


PokerStars Game #3503811224: Tournament #16654284, Hold'em No Limit - Level XVII (4000/8000) - 2006/01/01 - 21:09:47 (ET) Table '16654284 149' Seat #4 is the button Seat 1: Blue Maniac (53558 in chips)
Seat 2: AttackDog (87975 in chips)
Seat 3: RJGTJV (98808 in chips)
Seat 4: sputnik1 (47294 in chips)
Seat 5: M3boy (76970 in chips)
Seat 6: Zippiebear (101614 in chips)
Seat 7: westmenloAA (122294 in chips)
Seat 8: Mulligan17 (125848 in chips)
Seat 9: stallionh (73889 in chips)
Blue Maniac: posts the ante 400
AttackDog: posts the ante 400
RJGTJV: posts the ante 400
sputnik1: posts the ante 400
M3boy: posts the ante 400
Zippiebear: posts the ante 400
westmenloAA: posts the ante 400
Mulligan17: posts the ante 400
stallionh: posts the ante 400
M3boy: posts small blind 4000
Zippiebear: posts big blind 8000
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to M3boy [Tc Td]
westmenloAA: folds
Mulligan17: folds
stallionh: raises 65489 to 73489 and is all-in
Blue Maniac: folds
AttackDog: folds
RJGTJV: folds
sputnik1: folds
M3boy: calls 69489
Zippiebear: folds
*** FLOP *** [9s 4d Ah]
*** TURN *** [9s 4d Ah] [Ks]
*** RIVER *** [9s 4d Ah Ks] [2c]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
M3boy: shows [Tc Td] (a pair of Tens)
stallionh: shows [As Qd] (a pair of Aces)
stallionh collected 158578 from pot
M3boy said, "nh"
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 158578 | Rake 0
Board [9s 4d Ah Ks 2c]
Seat 1: Blue Maniac folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: AttackDog folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: RJGTJV folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: sputnik1 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: M3boy (small blind) showed [Tc Td] and lost with a pair of Tens Seat 6: Zippiebear (big blind) folded before Flop Seat 7: westmenloAA folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 8: Mulligan17 folded before Flop (didn't bet) Seat 9: stallionh showed [As Qd] and won (158578) with a pair of Aces

I must add that the guy came to the table with 35k and was all in quite alot. Two hands were seen , they were K J o/s and pok 5's

Paul,
I folded 10 10 in a similar situation in the Crypto 35k last night,  having said that the blinds were not such a problem, I dont like putting my tourney life on the line with 10 10 ot J J, I would much rather see a flop with this type of hand.
Can understand why you did though you were under 10 x bb and had to make a move, and you did go in in with the best of it and on another day it might have stood up

Just unlucky

Looking at the stacks too my left and this guys position i fold.

Stealing blinds of the 120k stacks shouldnt be a problem, they are not too short that they have to call. So you can make up for this hand later.

You cant really expect to be ahead of anything here.

James.

I am ahead of all hands except for JJ QQ KK and AA. With the blinds about to rise again, and the money not really that good till last 20, I will take ANY edge in a pot.

I think its one of those decisions that can only be made by the player at the table at that time, and for me I still think it was the correct move.

But ty for your opinion.

Another situation which you would of passed i think is this :

Just into the money 360 odd left and I had approx 35k. I had been hitting this one persons blind for well over an hour. I had AJ o/s and again made a standard raise on his BB. He instantly went all in for 27k.
My feeling was that he just got sick of me raising his BB and didnt have any hand whatsoever. So I called. Sure enough he had 7 2.

I make the call, like you say, a long way to go till the real money, you'll need the chips.

why cant he have JJ?

I am thinking JJ AK AQ.

I would rather take my chances on nicking the blinds, but thats just the kinda player i am, i like deciding me own fate not letting someone else do it!

 :goodpost: something to think about, I think DC has the same take on this, I like the "own fate" part of it, makes sense

With less than 10BB and 90 odd folk to go through your fate was decided when you were dealt the 10's, when you get the cards, you gotta play em.

Why cant i pretend i never got TT and move all in the next hand with 89s?

I think I can pass here you have enough bluffing equity to make blinds fold. You do have to win 50/50 shots but I would rather be 1st ionto a pot than calling an all in.

Each to their own..................

I dont think it is Right or Wrong to call when I did. It was just "right at the time" for me.

Yeah its a marginal situation , if it is folded to me here I am all in everytime . You made the call and you were ahead so fair play , with these decisions you really need to be there as the feel/read of the table and the player can mean so much.

exactly Jezza

From the hands that we saw of his "all in" method of poker, a King high and a pair 5's suggested to me that he was going to double up or go out - doesnt give you much reason to think he had a monster.

James,, you say you wouldnt call because he could have AA KK QQ JJ, thats good to know - EVERY time i play you I am all in on ur big blind. Of course you will fold because i "could" have Aces ?!?!?

;D ;D ;D

It's not very clear cut either way. If you fold and he shows 99 does that make it a bad play?

I like the "decide my own fate" theory as well but I cant say a bad word about anyone who calls here.

Where did i say that??

If you actually read what i say instead of posting a pre thought reply you will see i said AK AQ JJ. Not AA KK QQ.

For me this is a bad call, i have faith in my ability to build a stack without having to call all in, we dont have the same style.

So James, what hand would be your minimum hand to call here?!? I really am interested in this.

And stack build you say (I myself am VERY confident in stack building, but decided to take a shot here against someone who was an "all in" merchant who could of EASILY had an even lesser hand than he actually had),,,,, blinds are about to be 6000, 12000 with 600 ante's

You have left yourself with 6xBB and only one move - all in (within the next 5 hands before you are the BB)

I can remember being at Brighton for the 750 double chance last year (the one where my AA was beaten by KK with quads). DC was on the same table when down to 4 tables. He had a healthy stack, not sure how much but it was AT LEAST 30xBB. He was BB and this guy went "all in" on him (he was all in quite alot with slightly more chips than DC) - sound familier?!?!?!

Well DC said "do i want to gamble here" , "ok" he said and called

He flipped over 9 9

The other guy had A Q

99 held up.

So this was a "bad call"?? and DC only made it because he also lacks the ability to "stack build"?!?!?!?!?!?!?

I had a similar situation to this in the Barcelona 1000 fo , I was going alone nicely, building a stack that I was happy with.  One of the other players was starting to gain a huge stack by going all in on just about every other hand, usually having the worst of it but miraculously hitting constantly.

Well, a good hour this had gone on for, and everyone was staying out of his way when I looked down and saw TT,  he did the same large raise as usual, and I think, right you sod, I’m gonna take you on!  And I re-raised him all in.  He of course called in a flash, flipping over KK.  Was I right to take him on with TT?  I can honestly say IMO it was one of the stupidest plays I have ever made. I was by no means the SS, or a huge stack, but I didn’t have the goods to take him on, of course it was very bad timing and unlucky that he had a real hand,  if I had him well covered I think it would have been easier to take, and possibly the RIGHT move, but to put your tournament on the line with TT,  IMO is wrong.  A better spot was bound to come along.

This situation is entirely different. You are left with 6 x BB if you fold

So are you also saying that DC's move with the 9 9 was wrong?!?

I don't believe I made any comment on DC's move at all, and haven't given it much thought as yet. But, off the top of my head, would I call an all in with 99 with 30x BB? I doubt it,  And would i be happy seeing AQ? not a chance.

And apart from a few blinds difference, I fail to see how the situations are different. This guy was running over the table, and would continue to do so.

Jane/James

This thread is going off topic.

Poker is about "opinions" on how to play -

Yes it is true, I took offence to James's post saying my call was "wrong" and quoting "his ability"

I always see arguments both ways on "marginal" decisions. I will post an argument if I would of played a hand differently to someone else, but NEVER would I say someone was WRONG in a "marginal" decision.

So many decisions are based on "feel". And you can only get this from being in the situation, seeing how people have played before etc....

I CAN make an argument for folding here, but like i said, at that particular time decided to "take my chances"

I agree with james  :o I pass comfortably here. I think I'd put him on similar hands. he's a player for who there are hands he knows he should be playing but he doesnt know how. hands like that are JJ, AJ, AQ and the sort of stuff you've seen him show. If I pass and he flips a lower pair it doesn't bother me because I feel passing a middle pair from SB with a player already all in it the right thing unless I'm desperate and although thats round the corner, it's not yet.

I agree Paul, what seemed the right thing to do at the time, for me in my situation, turned out in hindsight to be wrong, the more I think it over, the worse it was. We can only ever base our decisions on that moment in time, and sometimes what is not normally the "right" move, at that moment in time is.

Every situation is different, and a textbook answer is not always correct when you are actually sat at the table, you get a feel for what is happening, and that can't always be explained in posts such as these.

I wasn't saying you were wrong as such, just that if I were in that same situation again, I would of VERY reluctantly folded. Purely my opinion, which is the idea of this hand analysis board.

Yes Jane I agree with you.

See my post on tikays thread on the BS fessie biggie. When I passed AK on the river on a k high board with 4 clubs and i never had a club.

I got a new toy an' I'm gonna use it

                 equity (%)     win (%)   tie (%)
Hand  1:   50.1849 %     49.99%    00.20%      { TcTd }
Hand  2:   49.8151 %     49.62%    00.20%      { JJ, AQs+, AQo+ }


easy call for me with the blinds as high as they are.

I'm with you Paul, I'm calling here.


I don't think that's true in this situation. If you have a player running over the table then you can't afford to just wait for aces unless you have a very large stack of your own.

I'd lump them in. But the biggest problem is that you're HOPING you're 50/50.

No, your hoping he has a rag Ace or a smaller pair. From his previously described play this seems likely.

That is why it is a great debate, I have heard alot of people second guess Phil Ivery for being to crazy w/ a big stack! Same thing, a judgement call based on the time at the table? Everyone will have a comment, take then all in and learn! AS the great Cupcake would say, " its just a silly game"

I said nothing about your ability to stack build....i am saying i am confident in mine, so i would pass, i probably move all in from the button and the cutoff the next 2 hands.

You say this guy was an all in merchant. He had come to the table with a shorter stack and was now in much better shape, he KNEW his folding equity was lower from the hands he had shown which does infact make his raising hand more likely to be a good'un.

You ask about DC's 99, yes i think that is a bad call. I am not sure of the circumstance of it, but i am suprised that he called if he had 30x bb, and if it was a random player i would go so far as to call him a fish! Hopefully DC is reading this thread and can let us know why!

You started the thread by asking would anyone fold, we answered ya!

Thx James

As for DC i think he knew the guy, and deduced he was at it. But DC will be better equipped to answer this

I started the thread to "learn" from other peoples opinions. Like i said, i can make an argument both ways.

To say someone is "wrong" though , in my opinion is wrong in itself.

We have different opinions, which always has been clear. Lets leave it now :D

I may have forgotten, lol, but where did i say you were wrong?

Still if the guy has moved in for 30 blinds i dont call with 99 :D AK maybe but not 99

key word " I dont" , its a debate, I just know if I was the raiser anyone would call, see my point 8) 8) 8) ;goodvevil; ;goodvevil; ;goodvevil;

thats what I count on in my game, give me chips :blonde:

I tell you now Brian, if we are ever on the same table and i have 30 bb's on the blind with 99 i will not call your all in. Free blinds for all.

i understand, but never say never 8), dont under estimate the power of the ROOKIE ;goodvevil;

I have to say that I don't like the call with TT. Sure there are not many hands that you are behind, but how many are you really in front of? A small pair is unlikely so a mid pair of probably 99, 88 or possibly Ax aith his position and style is about the best you can hope for. Even if he is at it with hands like KJ or QJ you are not a massive favourite for all your stack that you have no doubt worked tirelessly to accumulate. Why risk it all now on a marginal?

I am sure that your read on him was good, but I would rather get the chips in first on my terms not his (not that I am advocating an all in push on TT either, but I prefer it to a call).

With regards to him coming to the table on 35k and pushing all in on 55, remember that is only 3 of teh new blinds that you mention are coming and I can understand his push (dependent on position) with lesser holdings. Therefore the fact that he now holds a similar stack to you, the 55 push should perhaps not influence this decision too much.

Crazy to fold here in my opinion. Whatever edge u think u have, it's not big enough to justify a fold here.

No 1, you have less than 10BBs. In this situation u should not be passing up ANY +EV situations. The only reason u occasionally pass up +EV in tournaments is because u can find a bigger edge later. You won't here. Ok so u might get KK AA next hand. Highly unlikely.

The guy that raised allin is under pressure, the same as you. His range of hands is going to be fairly wide, rarely he will be dominating you with JJ or QQ(I think he plays KK or AA to extract a little more value usually). He is also likley to push many pocket pairs so there are a fair few hands u dominate such as 55-99. The hand he pushed you are a giant favourite over too.

This is a great spot. Folding here is an error. You dont have the chip leverage or stack depth to get fancy and make some postflop plays. Take this good situation and get some chips. Good call Paul.

this is a certain call imo, this would look to me like he had a middle pair or possibly a good ace, imo, it is very unlikely that you are behind here!!!, i think that if you didnt post the result, there would be less people saying its a fold,   what are these people waiting for soooooted aces!!   get it called man.  EVERYTIME

James one thing... this was a 3750 runner comp!

Your going to have to play a showdown, and with money in the pot and m3's description of the player i think he could move in with a huge variety of hands!!! Far more than the ones you quote!

A call as you need to make the move to the next level of chips to give yourself a chance at winning the comp... not just laddering and surviving!

I call here nearly 100% of the time at this stage of the tournament. The blind structure is fast in this game and you need to adjust.