blonde poker forum

Thoughts on this hand please.

Button is massive fish playing 42/25, f3b 29%, just stacked him in this hand.

***** Hand History for Game 63096407351 ***** (Poker Stars)
$100.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, June 08, 10:34:53 ET 2011
Table Altais II (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: KinzRGut ( $133.10 USD )
Seat 2: vilvon3 ( $34.35 USD )
Seat 3: hamsterli ( $40.00 USD )
Seat 4: epertxuntxur ( $56.05 USD )
Seat 5: fernanpaul ( $156.65 USD )
Seat 6: mondonewc ( $181.35 USD )
fernanpaul posts small blind [$0.50 USD].
mondonewc posts big blind [$1.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to mondonewc [  Qh Qd ]
KinzRGut folds
vilvon3 folds
hamsterli folds
epertxuntxur raises [$4.00 USD]
fernanpaul folds
mondonewc raises [$13.00 USD]
epertxuntxur calls [$10.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ As, Jd, 6d ]
mondonewc bets [$10.00 USD]
epertxuntxur raises [$42.05 USD]
mondonewc calls [$32.05 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ Td ]
** Dealing River ** [ 3h ]
mondonewc shows [Qh, Qd ]
epertxuntxur shows [8c, Jc ]
mondonewc wins $109.60 USD from main pot

Sb is reg playing 23/22, has a 3b% of just under 12% so pretty high and 3b% from sb is 14%. Unlikely to be 3b as a bluff in this spot when he knows buttons going to peel a lot.

***** Hand History for Game 63096518335 ***** (Poker Stars)
$100.00 USD NL Texas Hold'em - Wednesday, June 08, 10:38:15 ET 2011
Table Altais II (Real Money)
Seat 4 is the button
Seat 1: KinzRGut ( $129.60 USD )
Seat 2: vilvon3 ( $41.00 USD )
Seat 3: hamsterli ( $44.60 USD )
Seat 4: epertxuntxur ( $96.50 USD )
Seat 5: fernanpaul ( $158.35 USD )
Seat 6: mondonewc ( $234.40 USD )
fernanpaul posts small blind [$0.50 USD].
mondonewc posts big blind [$1.00 USD].
** Dealing down cards **
Dealt to mondonewc [  Td Th ]
KinzRGut folds
vilvon3 folds
hamsterli folds
epertxuntxur raises [$3.00 USD]
fernanpaul raises [$9.50 USD]
mondonewc calls [$9.00 USD]
epertxuntxur calls [$7.00 USD]
** Dealing Flop ** [ 3c, Qh, 2h ]
fernanpaul checks
mondonewc checks
epertxuntxur bets [$9.00 USD]
fernanpaul folds
mondonewc calls [$9.00 USD]
** Dealing Turn ** [ 9d ]
mondonewc checks
epertxuntxur bets [$15.00 USD]
mondonewc calls [$15.00 USD]
** Dealing River ** [ Jc ]
mondonewc checks
epertxuntxur bets [$62.50 USD]
mondonewc ??

I just fold.  No need to take such marginal spots against a fish where top pair will be the stone cold nuts!!!

This.

He might show up with worse occasionally, but we're having to make a bit of a hero call vs someone with a wide range when we could fold and wait for a better spot.

Also think there's a huge difference between the two hands. Mainly because in the first he's 56bb deep and shoves over your flop bet, whereas in the other he leads all 3 streets and shoves the river. I struggle to think of a hand he does this with other than a busted flush draw that we can beat. But is he the type of fish to 3 barrel bluff in this situation?

Have only been at the table a short amount of time, obv the 2 hands are different, first hand is just to show how wide he's calling a 3b and the fact he jammed with a pair, most fish would call/call.

Not sure I like calling pre here

I think it's fine when we are 150bbs deep vs the reg and are expecting the button to call a high % of the time.

pres def fine

easy river fold

pre is fine, fold the turn most likely/a lot, all rivers suck and its gonna be a horrible high-variance spot.

as played, meh, too timing/read dependant to give a view.

I would be much happier folding the turn than the river

This was my thought process as well.

disagree. As alex says timing+flow most important here, but doubt I ever fold the turn.

If we are calling turn why fold this river ? Gameflow is we've played the one previous hand vs villain where I bet/snapped flop to stack him. He thought for about 3 secs before shipping the river.

A donk writes:

Bet flop?

Check calling 3 times seem like a difficult way to play this hand. It seems unlikely that the pre flop 3-better has much once he checks on the flop. You're probably winning, and taking the pot down now doesn't seem like the worst result.

I realise the previous hand is relevant, but the textures of the board are different and its 3way not HU, which even to what appears to be a weaker player i think would tighten his flop leading range up, like if the flop was Q83 id have a much harder time folding the turn.

once we're at the river the range of hands he actually legitimately wants to VB is pretty small so I would call here.

This is how I saw it on the river also so I called.

not sure that a "massive fish" is concerned in the least with the legitimacy of their value bets.

Pre is good, rest i'd use aggression frequency stats for.  Main problem is that most fish are pretty passive in general so with no further read i'd fold the river even if he isn't repping a lot

Exactly my thoughts.

This hand is very read dependent. If he's an aggro spew monkey it's a sigh call, whereas if he's your standard fish it's a fold.

As I mentioned earlier itt most fish call/call/call so the fact in the earlier hand he jams the flop with J8 on the AJx flop made me lean more towards him being aggro/spewy where I'd expect the std fish to have just called flop and turn.

I understand and I don't disagree with your thought process. I guess this is just one of those pots where on the river if he has it fair enough, if not happy days. Either way we'll learn enough about him that a call is +ev for future hands imo - although at the same time I don't hate a fold.

Any chance you can give us the results?

I hero'd he had 85dd. I thought about the fact we could find better spots vs the fish to get it in but in most cases there's 4 other ppl at the table looking to do the exact same thing so I thought this was a good spot vs this villain. I was interested in opinions on my line though and the river spot as obv I'm more interested in the best play long term than the fact I got this one right.

"Better spots" isn't a legitimate excuse for making the right play unless this is the last cash game on earth or something.  There are plenty of better spots in the future vs other fish/this fish which is why we keep playing