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Poker Forums => Poker Hand Analysis => Topic started by: zerofive on July 12, 2011, 08:11:56 PM



Title: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: zerofive on July 12, 2011, 08:11:56 PM
This happened in a .50/1 cash game last week. Maybe I'm wrong in saying it's even semi-interesting, but I'm sure there's at least some potential discussion here.

The £2 straddle is on.

UTG folds.

+1 makes it £8. Raiser is considered by a couple of players to have a tight aggressive raising range, but a very wide calling range. I've seen him raise with all sorts of suited connectors, Ax hands, etc, but doesn't seem capable of having gears, so this leads me to believe he is a "feeling" player. Playing around £125.

+2 is playing around £50 and is a massive fish. Definitely doesn't mind getting it all-in.

The next three players all call.

We're in the big blind with Ad Qd playing £150~. We don't cover anyone else. How should we proceed?


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: SuuPRlim on July 12, 2011, 08:20:33 PM
calllllllllllllllllllll

we're strong vs the UTG1's range but unlikely to be in great shape vs his 4bets and our hand should play pretty well multi way cos of all the QT's, A6's people peel with

I reckon seeing as your >100bigs you could 3bet get it in but my experience is that people don't actually adjust their stack sizes with a straddle when the eff. stacks are halved, if you have £200 in there mind it's still £200 not 100bigs as opposed to 200bigs....


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: cambridgealex on July 12, 2011, 08:24:13 PM
Raise to £52.

This is a clear spot for a value raise, where you'll get called by worse from the OR as you described, the massive fish might get it in probably crushed. The only guy who can have us crushed is the OR and he's playing 125 and you said he raises all sorts of hands so QQ+ and AK is a tiny % of his range so really unlikely to get shoved on. If so, meh it sucks we call and have to get there.

It's pretty easy to play post flop from there too. Obv Q and A high boards play themselves as well as FD flops, Can profitably jam TJx, boards etc. Will be giving up on the 678 or K98.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: cambridgealex on July 12, 2011, 08:29:05 PM
Mbn to be in a 50/1 game where everyone has >150. Top up ffs and make it rain on dem hoes


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: pleno1 on July 12, 2011, 08:30:39 PM
48


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: paulhouk03 on July 12, 2011, 08:35:16 PM
44.50


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: Bully87 on July 13, 2011, 12:45:00 AM
Raise it up, bet sizing I dont know about, (massive fish
  • ), Alex is rarely wrong but would like to know the reasoning behind £52? I assume to try and get the fish to get it in?


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: EvilPie on July 13, 2011, 12:57:27 AM
I'd be making it £29 quid here just to re open the betting if £50 man decides to ship.

Also let's us get away pretty cheap if OR decides to 4 bet.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: DMorgan on July 13, 2011, 03:51:18 AM
Don't worry lildave I got your back

call >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>raise here imo


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: SuuPRlim on July 13, 2011, 11:59:45 AM
Hi five Morgan


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: cambridgealex on July 13, 2011, 03:36:49 PM
Raise it up, bet sizing I dont know about, (massive fish
  • ), Alex is rarely wrong but would like to know the reasoning behind £52? I assume to try and get the fish to get it in?
52 cos its pretty much a pot sized raise which is generally a good guideline. If it were pot limit, and you announced "pot", you would bet 3x8 = 24 plus the rest of the money in the middle which 8+8+8+0.50+1 = 24+25.50 = 49.50. Ok I was a few quid off, anywhere from 45-55 is fine raise sizing imo.

Could the sick ones please elaborate why calling>folding iyo.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: smashedagain on July 13, 2011, 05:48:11 PM
its a defo call for me. AQ oop in a fishy game were no one is folding then the call has to be the correct line.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: smashedagain on July 13, 2011, 05:49:09 PM
and if you think its semi interesting sean then its probably boring as hell ;)


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: cambridgealex on July 13, 2011, 05:52:20 PM
its a defo call for me. AQ oop in a fishy game were no one is folding then the call has to be the correct line.

we don't want em to fold. even in the fishiest of 50/1 games I've never squeezed to 50 pre and got 8callers. you'll get one, two or perhaps three callers and from then on its fairly easy to play cos you either jam or give up depending on flop.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: smashedagain on July 13, 2011, 06:20:23 PM
i dont like the build the pot and jam or fold line at all. far too swongy and high varience for me.
hope he did raise and we can see but would not expect more than 2 players to drop out.
fishy £8 callers generally have small pair or sooted semi connectors or raggy A
i cant think of many flops  that if we jam we are gonna get calls from people we crush or are in excellent shape against (obv exception being xdd were we ov/un flush)
much rather play smaller pot with AQ oop either saving £42 or milk the fuck out of the cows when we can play some poker with em.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: zerofive on July 14, 2011, 12:05:12 AM
I'm not sure if the dynamic makes much difference in this spot, but we've not been very active in this game. The same cannot be said for the rest of the table. Probably the most 3/4bets I've ever seen in a .50/£1 game. I lost a flip with JJ aipf about two hours prior to this hand and have been card dead since. Given this, I would expect anyone other than the OR or the shortstack to be savvy enough to know that I have a real hand here and definitely will not be peeling a decent raise.

This is the problem with Neil's suggestion of making it £29. This assumes that the shortstack will shove or the OR will 4bet, when realistically a raise that size in this game will yield five callers. Clearly there is merit to both calling or raising. Obv prefer raising as this gives us a shove/give up decision on the flop, which requires way less poker, and poker is hard sometimes. Of course we're in terrible shape against a 4bet ship from the OR, and I'm not going to 3bet-fold with all of that juicy dead money in there from the shortstack.

Also I feel like if we flat, we're defo not going to be playing a small pot anyways.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: EvilPie on July 14, 2011, 11:23:36 AM
Who the fuck's Neil!!


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: zerofive on July 14, 2011, 11:37:18 AM
Whoops. It's only 'cause it didn't seem like a brilliant idea, figured it couldn't have been you. ;whistle;


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: smashedagain on July 14, 2011, 12:33:56 PM
Who the fuck's Neil!!
yes you defo look more like evilpie than neilpie. so now sean is saying that Giblin never has a brilliant idea.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: DMorgan on July 14, 2011, 01:12:24 PM
its a defo call for me. AQ oop in a fishy game were no one is folding then the call has to be the correct line.

we don't want em to fold. even in the fishiest of 50/1 games I've never squeezed to 50 pre and got 8callers. you'll get one, two or perhaps three callers and from then on its fairly easy to play cos you either jam or give up depending on flop.

Putting in a third of your stack pre seems like a really bad idea when you're still having to flop decent equity to continue

Flatting pre keeps in all of the hands that you dominate and stacks aren't deep so you're not going to have a problem getting it all in by the river vs hands that you crush

Calling pre also happens to be a much lower variance line (not that this on its own is a reason for doing it) than pulling the old go and go.


Title: Re: Semi-interesting spot
Post by: smashedagain on July 14, 2011, 01:52:41 PM
its a defo call for me. AQ oop in a fishy game were no one is folding then the call has to be the correct line.

we don't want em to fold. even in the fishiest of 50/1 games I've never squeezed to 50 pre and got 8callers. you'll get one, two or perhaps three callers and from then on its fairly easy to play cos you either jam or give up depending on flop.

Putting in a third of your stack pre seems like a really bad idea when you're still having to flop decent equity to continue

Flatting pre keeps in all of the hands that you dominate and stacks aren't deep so you're not going to have a problem getting it all in by the river vs hands that you crush

Calling pre also happens to be a much lower variance line (not that this on its own is a reason for doing it) than pulling the old go and go.
yes this is what i think even if i dont make it clear... no need to panic tho coz i just noticed dan left gillingham 5 years ago so assume he is 22. probably almost gone at the game and over his peak now. did notice that moorman in his interview that he put his wsop success down to tightening up but his dad has been telling him this about live poker for ages.