blonde poker forum

History on player is a guy who has called my 3 bet with9 5 when i have  KK around 50 hands before...peeled on a Q 9 3 board and turned the 5, obv all goes in and he gives me the rub down(standard)



PokerStars Game #65400274482: Tournament #432010631, $8.00+$0.80 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level XIX (625/1250) - 2011/08/01 20:02:12 ET
Table '432010631 45' 9-max Seat #2 is the button
Seat 1: PioCowboy (37178 in chips)
Seat 2: Chum 0FF (85464 in chips)
Seat 3: powerhockey (28144 in chips)
Seat 4: topzozi (7068 in chips)
Seat 5: Mattis89 (23184 in chips)
Seat 6: yid_craig (44864 in chips)
Seat 7: wegwijspiet (6620 in chips)
Seat 8: JuniorJ77 (5929 in chips)
Seat 9: donald0404 (20771 in chips)
PioCowboy: posts the ante 150
Chum 0FF: posts the ante 150
powerhockey: posts the ante 150
topzozi: posts the ante 150
Mattis89: posts the ante 150
yid_craig: posts the ante 150
wegwijspiet: posts the ante 150
JuniorJ77: posts the ante 150
donald0404: posts the ante 150
powerhockey: posts small blind 625
topzozi: posts big blind 1250
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to yid_craig [Js Jd]
Mattis89: raises 21784 to 23034 and is all-in

Horrible spot in my opinion....opinions?

[ ] UTG

[ ] Tough spot

[ ] Horrible spot

[ ] Folding

[ ] the history helps
[X] take the rest and return the rub down

well it's not a fold.

Just get it in.

Simple call

Insta rr allin-never calling less we actually think this looks stronger-don't level yrslf and just iso jam.

It's not really a tough spot with JJ.

With something like 99/aqo you have a tough decision-now you gotta go with reads,dynamic, structure etc..

In this spot yr actually ahead of his range so fist pump jammage please as you would with ak.

Think tens i'd be getting it in without the fist pumpage and aqstd too.

The only thing that would be deemed tough in this spot is how hard you slammed down the mouse as you click call.

Don't want to be rude but this is a very easy spot. It's safe to assume that in an $8 tournament that most players are going to try and induce with a smaller raise with QQ-AA and even AK-AQ sometimes (although they are quite solidly in his range to open shove here). So JJ is a snap call. He's going to shove up with hands like 88-TT AK and AQ here quite a lot.

Sonic boom reshove.

lol mbn

threads like this go on far too long imo. download pokerstove, use a calculator and jobs done.

My play is very dependant on each and every different situation. One instance with the same hand is I will always c bet a rock if I miss becauSe he folds when he has not hit. Same hand and I miss I never C bet the idiot calling station because he calls. Now Dave if I down load pokerstove and use my calculator to learn what you think is the correct play in every situation, should I then be able to out play you because I know exactly what you think you should be doing so I act accordingly. Playing the opposite style to the rest of your table has always been profitable in poker. Sit with 8 tight players aggression wins, sitting with 8 aggros then tight is right. If I sit with 8 people who are stove/maths experts can I find a game/formula to beat them or is it as clear cut that stove says it's right so I can't beat it.

It's not a level just an interesting question because computers have not been able to beat chess grand masters too successfully which I assume would be down to the human being able to react better to each individual situation better than a computer

you're talking about when to/when to not Cbet, which is nothing at all connected to this thread, and I agree completely no pokerstove can tell you when you should cbet you use other poker knowledge like the things you suggested for that.

This specific hand is a case of X player jams Y range of hands. We have Z hand, we're getting X-1 odd, so need T% to call the bet. How do we find if we should have called or not?

yes understand. just wanted to get a quick question in and this was the first thread i opened and was un sure how long i would have been around for.

I really hope this is a joke Jason. Because this guy moves all in pre flop, it becomes a mathematical decision. Using your theory you should be able to do loads of stove and equity studies and beat Galfond hu at $1k/$2k PLO. But you can't, because that's not how poker works.

Get a job.

lol. yes might have to go on the bins. was in a bit of a rush and my statement had nothing to do with the hand but saw dave advocate stove and a calculator and wondered if you could beat someone who plays perfect mathematical poker.

if we play 500big blind deep nl holdem then you could easily out funk my mathematical approach - you always seem to think my approach to the game is to sit there ignoring everything that happens and just reaching my decisions based on a calculation or two because I always advocate solving hands mathematically on here, but these are usually in threads when we're facing 15big blind shoves

however if we're playing 11big blind holdem and I make perfect shoves/perfect calls and perfect folds then you cannot beat me unless you are doing the same even if you know exactly what i'm doing its completely optimal poker as in it is in-exploitable i.e no-one is able to exploit the way i'm playing

i know you play better poker than just doing a quick calculation and concluding that this is what i should do.

i just dont understand how you can say that you are in exploitable when if we also understand what you are about and we also know what you think are the perfect shoves calls  folds then how can we not exploit this as we know what you know. one of the first things i learnt is to study your opponent and his actions, establish what he wants you to do ie call or fold and do the opposite. i need to come round your flat one night while jamie is at yoga and chat to you in private to save myself looking any more stupid on here. ;)

obviously if you know exactly what ranges I am calling/shoving/folding to 11 big blind shoves you could then adjust slightly and prolly take a slight edge.

but the point is if for whatever reason im calling/shoving/folding perfectly vs your range then you can't exploit me + ofc in adjusting you might start making bad folds/shove or calls and therefore start making mistakes urself

its just a part of the game where zen like reading ability all the live guys have are redundant vs someone playing well and it becomes all about the maths - this obviously isnt true about all spots, but very true about this one. folding JJ is a mistake, calling with it isnt and it is literally that simple

totally accept that JJ is not a fold here but i was not really talking about the hand.

you will find that most of the zen like reading from live players comes after the cards are revealed and dumb ass goes "yeah thats what i thought you had". daniel negreanu has the ability and the only person i have seen personally do it with a massive degree of success is mike ellis.

i could name you players that play live and are mega consistant cashing/finaling for fun and would not even have heard of pokerstove.

are there online  guys that have made the transistion to live who totally understand the maths and also are mega consistent (jason mercier springs to mind)

meet chris bjorin

http://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/player.php?a=r&n=24

I'm not sure why you feel the need to reduce every thread to a "Old live guys vs Young online guys" Jason, but here we are again. If the success of the young (previously online based) British community hasn't shown you anything then you just need to open your eyes. But that's not the point of this thread.

The point is that we have a wired pair of Jack and should make the call 100% of the time. He has by far enough hands that we beat in his range to give us really good equity in the hand. But you probably don't "buy into" theories like equity or ranges or even that there are any jacks in the deck in the first place. Blockers? What's a blocker?

Also, why do you seem to think that the maths based online players who are killing live tournaments can't "zen like" hand read either? Jake Cody, James Keys, Matt Perrins etc. are all sick live hand readers. I honestly think you're just insanely stubborn in this subject. Not sure why you would want to take anything away from any of the young guys by mocking the maths side of their game considering they are all nice to you and all British. Get your patriotism on yo.

Jason - what is it you actually mean by this lol I can;t figure it out

it seems like the point you are trying to make is

because guys that have a ton of consistent live results don't use pokerstove which is JUST a piece of software lets not forget, that you don't necessarily need it to be a winning player?

I agree you could be a winning player and not know anything about equities.

A good example I think though - me and george have had a chat about some hands before and whereas I don't think george spends any time at home running equities on PPT lol - but the way he broke the hands down in his head showed pretty clear understanding of the principle and that he considers these things in his decision making.

I imagine he would have been near the top of your list of examples against the "theory"

guess you mean george dubya. should really face book ya coz am giving to much knowledge (or lack) of away here. wont be for a while tho

90% of what Jason says on this forum is BS. The other 10% he saves for Facebook

I am constantly confused as to whether smashedagain is leveling 100% of the time or not.

Sometimes I can see the merits in some of the things he says, but he seems determined to make it a live vs online thing, whilst berating online players. Bit weird.

I am either trying to learn everything I can and understand or just trying to piss you off. It's defo  one or the other. I am afraid that I have caught the bug that is being sad and arguing on Internet forums.

You had your mental game sorted with help george and having a positive attitude has never been my problem.  It's obv helped as you say the results are coming but I only follow you on here for monte/deepstack or stars blogs and what I read it was same old same old big stack to dust but your are obv a lot happier when that happens nowadays.

This site should be a place of learning not only about poker but life experience too. I like to take the piss as much as the next person but I am also here to broaden my knowledge. I love Toby and Jake more than anyone in poker and would not have named my twins after them. But tbh it was race/toss up with them two or tikay n doyle

am pleased no one responded to that last post. was bathing the kids at the time and did not want it to come over in the wrong way.  kids chucking jugs of water all over is quite stress full. this could easily be a case of trying to teach an old dog new tricks but here are a couple of examples of how my mind works.
1. i could not understand why winning players needed backing.
    this lead to jamie sykes dis owning me on facebook but it was not until dave explained to  me that you could be a winning player on the gukpt but did not have the roll for the ept but this was a way to play for this player.....fucking simple but i could not see it.
2. why someone would want to back a player because if they needed backing they were losers.
    once again lead to a mate telling me he had experienced a massive downswing/varience/table games and as it was a make up deal so effectivly little risk to the backer.
3. why is every ***** in make up and why would a player want to agree to be tied to this.
   .obv now know this is how it works. bink pay off then next comp you are back in again. i was thinking bordy puts me in the EPT london and i bink £1million. give him 50% so he gets £500k. next comp he puts me in a £500 ukipt i bubble say sorry but least you got half a mill last week .he just looks up at me, winks and says fuck you , you now owe me

sorry if my written word sometimes comes across badly but i laugh as much as i can in this life. we are here for a good time not a hard time ;)

and i did start by telling dave its not a level and got nowt to do with this particular hand. i love little dave as he has more patience than most and does not bully me

haha jason. you're odd

hey i will put you down but never ever let you down. tough times dave reckon 2 months max and getting worse each day. try to be positive tho.

My style of play puts me in difficult spots. It's easy for you to fold every hand cos you're a nit and you know when people play back at you they have it.

I'd much rather play my way, enjoy it, have the occasional blow up but ultimately win comps rather then finish 8th 8th 6th 4th 12th etc

I think the way you look at backing/people being back is in such a ridiculously simplistic manner. I'm not actually sure what your view is on it anymore as in your above post you say you have seen why people want backing etc so I'm unsure whether you agree with it or not anymore.

I'm sure you've been told all about the positives and negatives of backing/being backed before so it's not worth raking up old graves.

As for the EPT example you've posted, do you not realise that you would never have won 1 million unless he put you into the tournament in the first place? Plus if you binked 500k you are probably more likely to use that as your bankroll and sell off action rather than be backed...

Don't want to speak for him, but I'm pretty sure Rupert Elder sells off his action rather than being backed and I personally think that's the smartest way to go about things, but its not always an option for everyone.

sorry george its just your turn.....8th 8th 6th 4th 12th....good point well made 

http://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/player.php?a=r&n=84288

 ;booboo;

unless you meant me then good point well made

http://pokerdb.thehendonmob.com/player.php?a=r&n=134376


 ;stickaforkinme;

Few 1st's in there too mate

yes i know george. am just bitterly twisted atm and cant find another way to blow off . should go out for a run but that would kill me.

sorry solaris i'm not suprised you are confused as my views change all the time atm. people assume that because i wear blackbelt patches for the last 10 months that i am backed by them on their belt scheme. this is not the case as i hAve pointed out before 50% wife, 5-10% chinese mate/s 3-5% dealers, 1-3% charity/donations means i cant give neil or blackbelt 50%. it was a private aggreement between me and them as i was winning sats for fun on other ipoker networks and agreed to take a shot at winning a sat into a foreign site (hence the $5 into $24k in marrakesh story). i believe very much in karma and thought that neil was one of the guys putting something back into poker and i had enjoyed his company numerous times in ireland.

yes i defo see the you wont play events outside your roll unless backed arguement but i thought that having given him his cut of half a mill that i am back in make up next comp was a little harsh, but thats life aint it.  see i dont know if probably more likely to use my half to roll myself is ethical either. do we not owe our backer some loyalty to stay with him for a while longer. do people not agree a length of time for the staking contract to run. once again i dont know. people fall out over cash if things are not clear cut black and white, prime example is pete linton/sam trickett i dont know the full story (i am not sure anyone other than sam and pete know) but i just see two lads that were once tight as, no longer having the time of day for each other which is a shame.

Most staking deals are made in trust as far as I know. There's no written contract as such, you simply agree the terms and go from there. For arguments sake and to make things easy say you entered the EPT London as your first tourney under the deal and won 1,010,000 with the buying being 10,000. You'd pay them back the buyin then 50% of 1 mill. You decide to play on your own dime in future and walk away from the backer. Is it likely he's going to be annoyed at you having made him a cool 500k profit? Unlikely I would have thought.

I understand what you mean about it seeming ridiculous that you could make a guy 500k, then find yourself down 500 quid the very next week, but it's a business deal and the backer wouldn't be in the position he is were he to keep writing off tournament losses. It's why I couldn't possibly imagine being staked by a good friend. Could only imagine it has the ability to blow up in your face in the long run.

Then again I'm not expert on the subject.

Is there a thread about your Marrakesh story? Sounds like an interesting read.

Edit: Sorry for derailing your thread Craig.

yes sorry craig but welcome to blonde anyway....i think so that will be done by snoopy on blackbelt some where but i dont know how to find it. there is also some of my wedding stuff on stars but once again i dont have any . right step son jkust walked in so have to go pick the wife up from work

This is because I get put on monkey tilt when Lil Dave puts the Yorkshire Gold next to the Uncle Ben's.... I don't need anymore ammo for my tilt problems!

Lol. I did not even know you were on here. I also posted on here somewhere about despite out not seeing eye to eye I had hoped you listened about getting your roll of tilt