blonde poker forum

We have KK in the SB.

£1/2 Live
UTG+1 (competent player) opens to 10 (375~), MP calls (weaker 500~), HJ calls (seems ok 200~)

We make it 41 to go, covering all.

UTG quickly calls, MP calls, HJ folds.

Kh 2s 5c

We check, UTG tank checks, MP checks..

6h

We check, UTG tank checks again, MP tank bets 80, we take a little while and call, UTG folds.

7h

We quickly check, MP ummms nnarrrrhss and ships in the 360......


Wtf???


Sorry, edited.. Only bkdr hearts..

Why would you ever ever check the Turn?

Neither of them has Kx ever.. They won't hero with 77-JJ for two streets but will probably bet them.

They never bluff when we lead turn.

Hate line?

+1 to Lead turn for value.

As played its close but given that you've gone ape (yswidt) pre and then gone passive post your line to him will be confusing yet he decides to casually overbet ship river when all draws come in. Fold

Easy fold, only checking turn to check raise.

I prefer to bet/bet/bet. But if you want to trap then bet flop and if get 1 caller check turn to disguise your hand and give him chance to fire entire range.

FPS seems to have taken place here when keeping the line simple probably yields a better result

If you're gonna check flop then bet turn. As played I probably call river given that we're at least perceived to be pretty capped here.

we are so underrepped so I do a cawl

defo bet turn though.

JB in FPS shocker

Barrels with 24o. Checks top set

Snaps Ace high here. Folds top set.

i'd be way way way too tilted to fold here ever, if the man can show me a better hand, then he's winning the money!

and chk flop chk turn I dont like.

its not fps to flop absonizzles with very little chance of being outdrawn vs two aggressive opponents (relatively).

I dont see enough value in bet flop myself.

Turn seems similarly bricky, obv leaving anything other than 2-7's I think..

In retrospect I dont like river because this particular player probably doesn't bluff shove, much, if ever.

It is true that you are reasonably unlikely to get three streets of value from your hand if you bet. However, you are even more unlikely to get three streets if you check.

This flop (King small small rainbow) simply hits your range as the 3bettor much harder than your opponents' ranges, which means they are 'allowed to' fold a lot by the river. This is even more true when you have two blockers to them having Kx hands. First world problems etc.

Obviously, anything at all can be justified exploitatively if you have the right read. However, you have not given any strong read on how your opponents will likely react to a bet (or a check) on this flop. Perhaps they will give you a ton of credit on this flop and fold too much, but it is also possible they will hero call you down for two or three streets with a hand like 99 since they (correctly) think you'd cbet this flop with almost all your air. Given that you have no idea of their likely tendencies then you should start off by just 'playing your range'. Your range is strong on this flop, so you should usually be betting. Let them make a difficult decision on how to play against your range, and hope that their decision ends up being the wrong one against your exact hand.

Also, I'd imagine that with your likely 'sickest mofo in the room' image villain's will be more likely than usual to call down with a wider variety of bluff catchers than they might against other players. But you gotta give them the chance to do so!

Once the flop has been checked through you should definitely bet the turn. Same logic as above.

River... lolololol. GL GL GL.

THIS,THIS AND THIS SO HARD

Honey badger in crushes thread shocker.

Even by Honeybadger's standards, his Post was a stunner. Such simple logic, so well explained.

This, in retrospect the competent villain in question actually had floated a lot.

He can't do that if I check...

Sigh John, sigh.

At least your modest enough to take the advice on board, or at least accept there's more than one way to play a hand. So many people get stubborn when posting on PHA and just believe they are right and are closed to any suggestions

he's like the mystical gate-keeper of knowledge.

I shall buy him a mystical gate-keepers hat.

It is just basic, Level One stuff, such as I do next door, & in truth, that is the maximum level I can help newbies with, but lines like this are golden....


It is true that you are reasonably unlikely to get three streets of value from your hand if you bet. However, you are even more unlikely to get three streets if you check.

I think the only exploitive adjustment you're generally going to want to make in small stakes live games is to bet your value hands more frequently in these spots. I remember years ago watching a hand where Sauce 3b AA and cc 3 streets on a dry K hi board. That really fucked me up for a few months when I didn't really know what I was doing. Not saying you don't know what you're doing but just remember this isn't 40knl and you're not Sauce. So yea, bet flop.

Melissa ITT!

honeybadger is too good@pokes; also i was given a present in the form of the bbc's AFRICA book, i must have missed the honeybadger episode on tv but was reading about them the other day. what cool critters- even lions stay well clear.

I don't mind the flop check personally but once no-one bites and a draw pops up on the turn I go ahead and lead. If I check it's to check-jam. As played I'm calling the river because screw you if you got there.

However I defer to honeybadger who knows nlhe through and through.

Yeah tbh the flop check is ok occasionally as a variation play. It could also be good in a live game if you had some sort of read/tell that one of your opponents liked the flop and was intending to bet. But note that this is something that should only be done very occasionally.

Also just to qualify what I said about ranges - in full ring live poker it is not quite as true that Kxx flops hit the preflop 3bettor a lot harder than the preflop caller(s). This is partly because many live players will regularly call 3bets with stuff like KJo. But it is mainly because they will not always 4bet AK and will flat the 3bet instead - this is often correct play BTW. Kxx flops still do hit the preflop 3bettor much harder than the caller of course, it's just that the effect is not quite as extreme as in, for example, aggressive 6max online games with 100bb stacks.

Those caveats aside, JB should always bet his hand on the flop. The reason for this is that - at the moment - he simply cannot allow himself to ever take tricky or clever lines, because he will massively overuse them.

I have literally no idea what I just read.

I need to invent a phrase specifically to describe what I think happened here, as I bet the proverbial cajones off the flop and the turn, slathering myself in value juice and basting nicely for the river. I'm so confused, I'm mixing metaphors like an imagery fruit machine.

Back to the summary phrase...

I'm feeling:

Triple salchow self-level


Also, honeybadger did all the helpful stuff. I just wanted to play. Hope that's OK.

You okay Tal? All this crazy talk... I'm worried about you.

One crazy person at a time, Dr Freud, please.

In plain English:

1. Bet flop
2. Bet turn
3. Fold river
4. OP is a much better player than I, so knows all of this
5. I suspect OP played too trickily for his own good
6. Honeybadger owns

Even owns when he doesn't use his articulate and wide variety of vocabulary..

fml.

all of above is correct except for the bolded.  This should be edited to:

- Op can play decent nlhe at this level sometimes but gets in his own way, I hear this is becomming less frequent though.

Cheerfully withdrawn