FML with KK this week

[outragous76]

i was going to c/r turn all in.......................

what now?

PokerStars Game #49328771177: Tournament #329011253, $150+$12 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level II (20/40) - 2010/09/08 20:18:46 UTC [2010/09/08 16:18:46 ET]
Table '329011253 61' 9-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: diegomn (3000 in chips)
Seat 2: I_M_ICM (2320 in chips)
Seat 3: Minesony (2820 in chips)
Seat 4: cwp394 (2940 in chips)
Seat 5: petjen27 (2640 in chips)
Seat 6: KANY0N (2835 in chips)
Seat 7: BadgerPro (3725 in chips)
Seat 8: outragous76 (2950 in chips)
Seat 9: mlagoo (3410 in chips)
KANY0N: posts small blind 20
BadgerPro: posts big blind 40
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to outragous76 [ ]
outragous76: raises 80 to 120
mlagoo: folds
diegomn: calls 120
I_M_ICM: folds
Minesony: folds
cwp394: folds
petjen27: folds
KANY0N: folds
BadgerPro: folds
*** FLOP *** [ ]
outragous76: bets 185
diegomn: raises 295 to 480
I_M_ICM is connected
outragous76: calls 295
*** TURN *** [ ] []
outragous76: checks
diegomn: checks
*** RIVER *** [ ] []
outragous76: bets 666
diegomn: raises 734 to 1400

??

[Murph1984]

Thoughts behind flatting OTF? I think I def 4bet/get it in there and then,he has a fair few holdings where a lot of turns are going to slow him down in giving you action.


I realise that's not what you were asking

[EvilPie]

Call.

[AlexMartin]

fold, hes never raising worse for value (maybe give him like 1 combo of retardedly played QQ) , his sizing is super zoned in on value and he wont bluff this river (given its much move likely he would continue bluffing turn) much b/c we can have a tonne of strong hands.

[GarethW]

As played fold river. Would prefer c/c river as that follows better with your line upto river. After bet/jam I like the fold.

87s/1010. Get it on flop personally.

[action man]

his flop line is mostly bluffs, got a small feeling QK got there, c/c river for sure

[outragous76]

ty

i folded and sobbed for a while

[GarethW]

ty

i folded and sobbed for a while

Don't let the bint think your a wuss by crying, just get a dog/cat to boot and right your state of mind imo

[DMorgan]

I prefer 3bet/get it in on the flop but as played I think the river is a fold but not loving it though.


He probably bets JT on the turn. Its gross but I think its KQ the majority of the time

[psustudent]

yea 3bet get it in on flop.

on river, c/puke call.

as played fold to the raise, pretty sure he had 10s.

[AlexMartin]

mtt grinders give thoughts on getting it in on flop please, intrigued.

[DMorgan]

Bet-fold flop.

lulz

[GarethW]

mtt grinders give thoughts on getting it in on flop please, intrigued.

don't see anything wrong with the flop flat for value fwiw but we're giving the betting initative over to vil and hope he continues to bet for us when we're OOP for rest of the hand. flatting flop and leading turn makes no sense plus I expect he checks all his unimproved hands back on turn and again on river most of the time so we gain little value in keeping in him it c/c'ing  vs the times he either sucks out on us or the board becomes more scarier and kills our action.

On the flip side a 995r board is pretty safe and you might even get action on an under as well as overpairs.  There's 1k in the pot already and personally I think we gain more value in a shove on the flop vs the flat. 

[DMorgan]

Heh, the old bet/fold line was discussed at great length in dublin (albeit over a few beers) but I think for bet/fold to be the optimal line here his flop raising range has to be beating us and this is where we disagreed.

Readless in this spot I'd expect villain to raise this flop a fairly large %age of the time with 66+. I think that the view of the majority of average players in the field is that they don't like just calling here and 'not knowing where they are' or 'letting your AK/AQ get there'. imo an unknown villain is more likely to raise/fold these hands on the flop than call and re-evaluate later streets.

If this is true then bet/folding obv misses a shedload of value and we fold the best hand a ton. I think that the villains flop raising range is the all important factor. I just think that his flop raising range is never going to be 9x and 55 often enough to make KK a bet fold on 995r.