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Author Topic: A Worrying Trend?  (Read 2843 times)
doubleup
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« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2011, 05:15:43 PM »




Why would you complain though? If you were to only have to pay 4% tax on winnings you're not really doing too badly compared to people in a "normal" job.

Have you heard of a concept called ROI?  What effective tax rate results from the imposition of a 4% tax on a player with a 5% profit margin.  What happens to a breakeven player?  The effect of this kind of tax is to lessen the likelyhood of players regularly playing in tournaments and if they can't be replaced by new players, a spiral of decline starts.



That's a fair point but how much tax do you reckon you should/would be able to afford to pay? An end of year tax on winnings doesn't sound like a massive issue to me. Nothing to do with an ROI (unless they decide to run it in exactly the same way as in France where every pot has a % tax raked and therefore you are also tax'ed on your losses. then again, if they do it like it's supposed to happen in Holland you'd pay 29% tax on your winnings, minus a tax deductable sum) Obviously the majority of players you would take the money from would be recreational or losing players and therefore the decline spiral is probably not as steep as you might think as most of them play for fun.


The point is that the economic activity taking place is the casino persuading people to take part in their tournament and charging a fee.  The profit from the service provided by the casino is the activity that should be taxable.  

The customers of the casino assess whether or not they are getting value for money but like any other service an increase in costs results in a reduction of demand.  

As far as gamblers themselves the tax position in the uk is quite established and unlikely to change and a red herring in any debate about direct taxes from poker players prize funds.


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The Camel
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« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2011, 05:28:11 PM »




Why would you complain though? If you were to only have to pay 4% tax on winnings you're not really doing too badly compared to people in a "normal" job.

Have you heard of a concept called ROI?  What effective tax rate results from the imposition of a 4% tax on a player with a 5% profit margin.  What happens to a breakeven player?  The effect of this kind of tax is to lessen the likelyhood of players regularly playing in tournaments and if they can't be replaced by new players, a spiral of decline starts.



That's a fair point but how much tax do you reckon you should/would be able to afford to pay? An end of year tax on winnings doesn't sound like a massive issue to me. Nothing to do with an ROI (unless they decide to run it in exactly the same way as in France where every pot has a % tax raked and therefore you are also tax'ed on your losses. then again, if they do it like it's supposed to happen in Holland you'd pay 29% tax on your winnings, minus a tax deductable sum) Obviously the majority of players you would take the money from would be recreational or losing players and therefore the decline spiral is probably not as steep as you might think as most of them play for fun.


The point is that the economic activity taking place is the casino persuading people to take part in their tournament and charging a fee.  The profit from the service provided by the casino is the activity that should be taxable.  

The customers of the casino assess whether or not they are getting value for money but like any other service an increase in costs results in a reduction of demand.  

As far as gamblers themselves the tax position in the uk is quite established and unlikely to change and a red herring in any debate about direct taxes from poker players prize funds.




Are you saying this 4% is a tax on the casino, rather than a tax on the players?
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The Camel
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« Reply #17 on: January 20, 2011, 05:30:15 PM »

Lets be honest it makes no odds if every one follows suit as we will all pay the charges no matter what at the end of the day.

This is nonsense.

If I think rake/juice is too high, I won't play a tournament/cash game.

I won a seat for Deauville, but if I had known about this hidden juice, I might not have entered the sat.
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Congratulations to the 2012 League Champion - Stapleton Atheists

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doubleup
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« Reply #18 on: January 20, 2011, 05:50:38 PM »





The customers of the casino assess whether or not they are getting value for money but like any other service an increase in costs results in a reduction of demand.  




Are you saying this 4% is a tax on the casino, rather than a tax on the players?



not sure what you are on about but the bolded comment is pretty much what you are saying below?



If I think rake/juice is too high, I won't play a tournament/cash game.


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