6 card O...... oh god...

[tikay]

I'd love to know what % of people who have posted in this thread would actually have folded this handed on the flop in a live game.

I honestly can't EVER begin to imagine putting a penny in the pot with garbage like this.

Then again, we sit in a fun live game, chatting away, bla de bla, Chandra has £3k in front of him, & temptation comes a-knocking.......

[tikay]

Actually, now the Omaha Whizzos are all here, JB's question got me thinking, about a spot which always gets me in trouble.

He said this was the flop, & for the purposes of this debate, assume we potted it pre & got the usual 2 or 3 callers.

Our hand contains A-A, & does NOT include any diamonds, or wrap cards to the 6-7.

The flop was....

 

So we have top set, with no improvers except the boat, & 2 customers.

How do we go from here in...

6 card?

4 card?


We must pot it (I think....) but so often we get 2 callers, then the Turn is one of the scare cards.

Do we HAVE to keep potting here? 

If we shut down, we get exploited presumably.

We can pair up of course - do we just keep potting & hope we do?

In common with most of us, certainly at my level, I lose more money in Omaha with Aces than I like to admit.

[jgcblack]

Actually, now the Omaha Whizzos are all here, JB's question got me thinking, about a spot which always gets me in trouble.

He said this was the flop, & for the purposes of this debate, assume we potted it pre & got the usual 2 or 3 callers.

Our hand contains A-A, & does NOT include any diamonds, or wrap cards to the 6-7.

The flop was....

 

So we have top set, with no improvers except the boat, & 2 customers.

How do we go from here in...

6 card?

4 card?


We must pot it (I think....) but so often we get 2 callers, then the Turn is one of the scare cards.

Do we HAVE to keep potting here? 

If we shut down, we get exploited presumably.

We can pair up of course - do we just keep potting & hope we do?

In common with most of us, certainly at my level, I lose more money in Omaha with Aces than I like to admit.

interesting you say this.....


the original cbettor had bare AA and potted then folded to my ckpotjam.

they all talked about the hand after (I said some words but nothing of importance) and the consensus was that I should play my hand as I did and the guy with the uberwrap did good getting his 78910Jxddd in.


??

[SuuPRlim]

tikay we need to the stack sizes to be able to comment.

[tikay]

tikay we need to the stack sizes to be able to comment.

No idea, it is hypothetical, but I get in such a mess in these spots, time after time.

I pot, they call, the scare card (diamond, 3, 4, 9, 10, etc) comes on the turn, now what?.......

And we still have the River to come.

Really, I just need some general help in these spots, let us assume we are all playing reasonably deep.

In 6 card, I don't mind giving up quickly, but in 4 Card, I'm sure I get pushed around in therse spots, especially OOP. Position in Omaha is, to me, SO important.

Guess I really want some general PLO advice. We ought to have a section for PLO. It is such a beautiful game.

[GreekStein]

tikay we need to the stack sizes to be able to comment.

No idea, it is hypothetical, but I get in such a mess in these spots, time after time.

I pot, they call, the scare card (diamond, 3, 4, 9, 10, etc) comes on the turn, now what?.......

And we still have the River to come.

Really, I just need some general help in these spots, let us assume we are all playing reasonably deep.

In 6 card, I don't mind giving up quickly, but in 4 Card, I'm sure I get pushed around in therse spots, especially OOP. Position in Omaha is, to me, SO important.

Guess I really want some general PLO advice. We ought to have a section for PLO. It is such a beautiful game.

Me and Dave rarely bet 'pot' down the streets. Tends to make life easier for your opponents to play correctly against you and perhaps more importantly, it's going to make your bluffs damn expensive when you have to pot because that's how you play your nut hands.

Your hypothetical question is still so hard to answer because there simply is no correct answer about what to do. We need to know, positions, stack sizes etc etc.

If only PLO was that simple eh...

I think a PLO board would be great

[Tal]

You could start the ball rolling with a 'common novice mistakes' piece. That should get the PLOers' chins a-waggin'

[Honeybadger]

interesting you say this.....


the original cbettor had bare AA and potted then folded to my ckpotjam.

they all talked about the hand after (I said some words but nothing of importance) and the consensus was that I should play my hand as I did and the guy with the uberwrap did good getting his 78910Jxddd in

Wow, your opponents managed to play the flop even more poorly than you! Hugely impressive hand-massacring tekkers from both of them.

So you ended up getting heads up with the best hand AND the best draw. After top set - the nuts - folds the flop!! Run better IMO.

[zerofive]

Where is this game?

[redsimon]

I love playing PLO with holdem players.

Did you love it at APAT? 37 players busted before I did and not one put there name down for PLO cash

[jgcblack]

interesting you say this.....


the original cbettor had bare AA and potted then folded to my ckpotjam.

they all talked about the hand after (I said some words but nothing of importance) and the consensus was that I should play my hand as I did and the guy with the uberwrap did good getting his 78910Jxddd in

Wow, your opponents managed to play the flop even more poorly than you! Hugely impressive hand-massacring tekkers from both of them.

So you ended up getting heads up with the best hand AND the best draw. After top set - the nuts - folds the flop!! Run better IMO.

told you it was a gd game.

Im not a complete loon.

[Honeybadger]

I just messed around a bit with Propokertools. It only does 5 card PLO, but it gave me some idea of the equities.

1. If you get HU with the AAxxxx hand (which is what should have happened after you raised the flop) then you are about a 34/66 dog.

2. If your hand gets all in threeway then the equities are approx:
AAxxxx 35%
JT987x 34%
Your hand 31%

3. If you get HU with the JT987x (with a worse FD than you), you are around a 60/40 favourite.

I think your equity is actually a bit better than this vs the AAxxx hand because I did not know how to specify that the AAxxx hand does NOT have nut diamonds. But you will still be a big dog to top set, even when your FD is live.

You got massively lucky to a) have a FD that was live, and b) have top set (the nuts) make a ridiculous fold in a bloated pot, leaving you with the only possible match-up that was good for you.

Finally, the guy with what you called an 'uberwrap' has a complete bag of spanners on this flop. It is NOT an 'uberwrap', and even if it was then it is still far too easy for it to be dominated by a FD. Even the true 20-out uberwrap is dominated by a FD.

[George2Loose]

He's obv called so he can bluff and show the 3

[jgcblack]

I just messed around a bit with Propokertools. It only does 5 card PLO, but it gave me some idea of the equities.

1. If you get HU with the AAxxxx hand (which is what should have happened after you raised the flop) then you are about a 34/66 dog.

2. If your hand gets all in threeway then the equities are approx:
AAxxxx 35%
JT987x 34%
Your hand 31%

3. If you get HU with the JT987x (with a worse FD than you), you are around a 60/40 favourite.

I think your equity is actually a bit better than this vs the AAxxx hand because I did not know how to specify that the AAxxx hand does NOT have nut diamonds. But you will still be a big dog to top set, even when your FD is live.

You got massively lucky to a) have a FD that was live, and b) have top set (the nuts) make a ridiculous fold in a bloated pot, leaving you with the only possible match-up that was good for you.

Finally, the guy with what you called an 'uberwrap' has a complete bag of spanners on this flop. It is NOT an 'uberwrap', and even if it was then it is still far too easy for it to be dominated by a FD. Even the true 20-out uberwrap is dominated by a FD.

Seems like I ran good to be in that spot then bad to lose what was a day saving pot.

Without divulging any secrets Stu, do you mind explaining the wrap vs fd vs xx kind of equities?
Skype?

George - huh???