This should NOT happen! FACT - maybe, I think, doesn't seem right anyway

[Jon MW]

Can somebody who actually has a better understanding of the rules than me (this should ensure a large field of potential respondees) explain a rule in stud for me.

It's actually from a razz tournament, and I've put the hand history below but the basic question is:


If the player who should pay the buy in is all in from paying the ante - who pays the buy in?

I would have thought that it would be the next highest or next lowest (depending on whether you were playing razz or stud) in line. Or it would just go from the player who should be paying it and the table would just be playing for the antes.

But in this instance the player one to the left had to pay the buy in - is this right?

HAND HISTORY
PokerStars Game #17183524246: Tournament #86191424, $10+$1 Razz Limit - Level VII (150/300) - 2008/05/03 - 21:24:39 (ET)
Table '86191424 11' 8-max
Seat 1: canuck3030 (1999 in chips)
Seat 2: tenfour111 (7368 in chips)
Seat 3: POPO8 (6666 in chips)
Seat 4: DArickiebear (5269 in chips)
Seat 5: Happy1here (3886 in chips)
Seat 6: Jon MW (5534 in chips)
Seat 7: mimoun666 (10 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 8: Elrohir44 (1448 in chips)

canuck3030: posts the ante 30
tenfour111: posts the ante 30
POPO8: posts the ante 30
DArickiebear: posts the ante 30
Happy1here: posts the ante 30
Jon MW: posts the ante 30
mimoun666: posts the ante 10 and is all-in
Elrohir44: posts the ante 30

*** 3rd STREET ***
Dealt to canuck3030 []
Dealt to tenfour111

Dealt to POPO8 [] Dealt to DArickiebear [] Dealt to Happy1here [] Dealt to Jon MW [ ] Dealt to mimoun666 [] Dealt to Elrohir44 [] Elrohir44: brings in for 45 canuck3030: folds tenfour111: folds POPO8: folds DArickiebear: folds Happy1here: folds Jon MW: calls 45 mimoun666: folds *** 4th STREET *** Dealt to Jon MW [ ] [] Dealt to Elrohir44 [] [] Jon MW: bets 150 Elrohir44: calls 150 *** 5th STREET *** Dealt to Jon MW [ ] [] Dealt to Elrohir44 [ ] [] Jon MW: bets 300 Elrohir44: calls 300 *** 6th STREET *** Dealt to Jon MW [ ] [] Dealt to Elrohir44 [ ] [] Jon MW: bets 300 Elrohir44: calls 300 *** RIVER *** Dealt to Jon MW [ ] [] Jon MW: bets 300 Elrohir44: folds Jon MW collected 1730 from side pot Elrohir44 said, "wtf?" Jon MW collected 80 from main pot Jon MW: doesn't show hand *** SUMMARY *** Total pot 1810 Main pot 80. Side pot 1730. | Rake 0 Seat 1: canuck3030 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet) Seat 2: tenfour111 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet) Seat 3: POPO8 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet) Seat 4: DArickiebear folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet) Seat 5: Happy1here folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet) Seat 6: Jon MW collected (1810) Seat 7: mimoun666 folded on the 3rd Street (didn't bet) Seat 8: Elrohir44 folded on the River

[matt674]

never mind about the bring in - what are you doing calling with a king in your hand against a player who is bringing in with a 2 showing?



and as far as i am aware play always goes clockwise from the player who should bring in - but as minmoun is already all in then play passes to elrohir

[M3boy]

I am consulting my legal advisors re the title of this thread.

[Jon MW]

...

and as far as i am aware play always goes clockwise from the player who should bring in - but as minmoun is already all in then play passes to elrohir

So a 2 get's to pay the bring in?

Doesn't seem right.

never mind about the bring in - what are you doing calling with a king in your hand against a player who is bringing in with a 2 showing?
...

They're all weak - they can all be pushed around*





*DISCLAIMER: does not actually work all of the time.

[Jon MW]

I am consulting my legal advisors re the title of this thread.

It's a homage

[AndrewT]

I am consulting my legal advisors re the title of this thread.

It's a homage

Are you calling M3boy gay?

[gatso]

while I don't know what the rule is, that seems right to me.

the order of play should not be affected by stack sizes

[gatso]

while I don't know what the rule is, that seems right to me.

the order of play should not be affected by stack sizes

the only exception to this that I'm aware of is Village Poker in which IIRC the short-stack is always the big blind

[Claw75]

while I don't know what the rule is, that seems right to me.

the order of play should not be affected by stack sizes

the only exception to this that I'm aware of is Village Poker in which IIRC the short-stack is always the big blind

and they have to deal 

[Jon MW]

while I don't know what the rule is, that seems right to me.

the order of play should not be affected by stack sizes

If the high card at the table had 11 chips when the ante was 10, wouldn't they pay a bring in of 1?

And the player to his left would have the choice of whether to call or complete and start creating a side pot?

If so, shouldn't this be the same if they had 10 chips and an ante of 10, with a bring in of 0?

[gatso]

while I don't know what the rule is, that seems right to me.

the order of play should not be affected by stack sizes

If the high card at the table had 11 chips when the ante was 10, wouldn't they pay a bring in of 1?

And the player to his left would have the choice of whether to call or complete and start creating a side pot?

If so, shouldn't this be the same if they had 10 chips and an ante of 10, with a bring in of 0?

ahh, with you now, didn't really read it properly tbh. didn't see that the next player had been forced to bring in.

so my new opinion is the same as yours I think, next player should have the option to call, complete or pass.

the comparison to HE is bb and sb all in for the ante. utg now has the option to call, raise or pass

[Jon MW]

...
the comparison to HE is bb and sb all in for the ante. utg now has the option to call, raise or pass

Good comparison - thank you

[Ironside]

while I don't know what the rule is, that seems right to me.

the order of play should not be affected by stack sizes

the only exception to this that I'm aware of is Village Poker in which IIRC the short-stack is always the big blind

and they have to deal 

from the car park