Good stt Roi? what %

[mex]

what % do you consider good ROI for standard stt? Not turbo or speed as i know they tend to be lower.
Just got back to playing stt again as i want to build a good bankroll for the summer, (want so much to play live events and its gonna cost)
just wondering esp you guys out there who have a large sample.

[Wardonkey]

It depends on what level you play and how many tables, but if your not playing more than 2 tables then I think 20% is reasonable.

http://archiveserver.twoplustwo.com/showflat.php?Cat=0&Board=&Number=2302700&page=0&view=&sb=5&o=14&fpart=

This link was posted on THM forum last week. I think (hope) however that it is overly pessimistic. It also seems to refer mainly to those maniacs who play upto 8 tables at once like byronkincaid and also most of his stats (perhaps all) are from party poker which has a horrible structure.

Maybe I'm a jammy fish but I've played almost 1000 at $100 (2 tabling) on my current spreadsheet and have achieved 21%.
My record keeping before that was disorganised and so that's as much accurate info as I can give you.

The advice given in the link about bankroll management is fairly accurate. I have gone as many as 17 tourneys without a hit b4. So if you work off a 50 buyin bankroll then holding a reserve is a good idea.

[mex]

Not sure i agree with that guys thoughts WD. Sure he has data but its from lots of players, several who could be playing against each other for a start. I am playing well below a level that i find a challenge at the mo, and my roi is through the roof. Slowly building up my roll again and finding level where i will do best. I don t think i'm running hot i just think there has been an influx of bad players at the mid level STT on Blu Squrrel, the higher i go the lower roi i expect. So i will try and find a level where i can sit above 20% TY donkey

I use the moving up and down levels with max buy in of 1/20th whats held on site account, so i don't think the 50x applies although my longest with out a win out a hit was 9 last year in $50 stt, and that took me down to $25's. I used to stay away from $100's found $50's that much easier, shame i didn t have as good record keeping back then

[Graham C]

that's a great post on 2+2

[Wardonkey]

There's a lot in that link that I don't agree with myself.

If what your trying to do is build a bankroll rather than make an income then your 5% method may well be the best way.

[Sheriff Fatman]

I've not seen that particular post before but I met Irieguy (the author) out at the WSOP last year and his views are definitely worthy of respect.  He's very intelligent and spends a great deal of time analysing the game.  The data he collected will all be from his staked players who, in theory, are 'winning players' (although he stated himself that some were not winners according to his stats).  The point I'm trying to make is that this data wasn't from a 'random' sample of players, but from people who take the game seriously and consider themselves to be winners.

Just as a bit of background info, he stakes a number of players for the Party SnG's so his data will mostly likely be focused on that, very fast, structure.  If you are playing a slower structured game where, in theory, your skill has more chance to shine through then the figures may have worked out a little higher.

The key point to note though is that he shows much more confidence about the ITM figures compared to the ROI information.  Even with a 10,000 SnG sample he doesn't believe that there's enough data there!

Sheriff

[mex]

its a good sample but i think the structure has thrown the figures out i guess. Lets just say my roi at the mo is very high then!!

[Wardonkey]

Irieguy's post has undoubted value. However he hasn't really shown how he has used his data set to come up with the figures. I also have some doubts as to the value of a data set that comes from so many sources. If he has 10,000 STTs recorded then how many does he have from each level? How has he calculated expected ROIs? I think that most of the data collected has been from multi-tablers who play systematically, sticking to 'how to beat the Party SNG guides'. These guides are designed to remove the decision making, and thus the skill, from the game. Rather than actually playing poker these people are robotically playing upto 10 tables at one time.

Both Mex and I play on 9 seat tables with a fairly fast timed structure, so we might expect slightly better results than Irieguy's estimates, providing we are beating the game consistantly. I cannot speak for Mex, but I play only 2 games at a time and I like to think I am fairly good at adjusting my game to different opponents and actually playing good poker. Something that is not possible if you are playing 8 or more tables. Of course we would both like to think that we are superduper poker players whos' figures reflect our ability, rather than statistical blips going through a hot patch. My stats come from a sample of almost 1000 games and I accept that statistical anomolies can occur over this period. However I am also aware that there is room for improvement in my game and I honestly believe that 20% is sustainable in the long term at the $100 level on Tribeca.

Also, what's this section all about?

'I can't spell, my grammer is no good, and i get defensive when your replies insult me. Can I still be a poker god?'

This is just snobbish rubbish and takes no account of different cultural, educational and linguistic backgrounds.
Am I to discount everything this bloke says just because he can't spell the word 'grammar'?

[Highstack]

Pick on him if you like, but no need to bring his nan into proceedings

[thetank]

Pick on him if you like, but no need to bring his nan into proceedings

 

My first giggle of the day, cheers Highstack