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Author Topic: 40bb 99 in 3bet pot blind-on-button  (Read 1357 times)
Skippy
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« on: March 21, 2012, 08:46:25 PM »

This is my exit hand from the £150 last weekend. Any thoughts? Obviously results aren't good. My memory isn't good either, but here is how I think it went.

I've got 110,000k in the SB and I've got 99. It's folded to all round nice guy, great player and excellent tracksuit wearer Mehteb on the button. He opens it up on the button to 5.5k (ish)  1.2k/2.4k/300 on the button. I 3-bet him to about 15k. BB folds, and Mehteb calls me.

Flop comes down 10c two spades. I c-bet 25k, Mehteb raises me to 50k, I've got 80k back(ish) and I ship it.

Any advice on how to think about this hand would be appreciated. His range to me seems to be a few flush draws, a few massive pairs, some Tx and some junk.  Basically he's either got it or he hasn't.
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sm00035
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« Reply #1 on: March 21, 2012, 08:53:31 PM »

Don't bluff the flop
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skolsuper
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« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2012, 02:00:13 AM »

Yeah your cbet is huge, can bet 11k or something and actually get value from some worse hands. Fold to the raise, more so now, would be tougher if you'd sized it properly.
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Suited_Jock
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« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2012, 03:53:29 PM »

Why are you narrowing his range so much, Just because he's opened the button dosen't mean he is oviously stealing with junk.. yes his range is wider but after he raises you on a wet flop you are describing him with "what seems to be a few flush draws, a few massive pairs, some Tx and some junk". You seem to ignore TT+ AKss /Aqss etc

With 45bb's OOP I may be inclined to flat with the nines and use pot control / set mine.

As played I cbet alot smaller (15-19k) and fold to his raise..
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dakky
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« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2012, 01:13:09 PM »

cbet like 17k, probably folding to raise as he either has T(even tho he shouldn't be raising mostly), fl-draws with over/s and occasionally overpairs, none of which we are doing well against. Only real hands you want to see are like  .

I also increasingly find myself flatting oop in spots like this
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Killerkilsby
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« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2012, 12:18:27 PM »

Why are you narrowing his range so much, Just because he's opened the button dosen't mean he is oviously stealing with junk.. yes his range is wider but after he raises you on a wet flop you are describing him with "what seems to be a few flush draws, a few massive pairs, some Tx and some junk". You seem to ignore TT+ AKss /Aqss etc

With 45bb's OOP I may be inclined to flat with the nines and use pot control / set mine.

As played I cbet alot smaller (15-19k) and fold to his raise..


I agree with this, not saying its right but its how i would play it.
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Killerkilsby
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« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2012, 12:19:04 PM »

Out of interest do we have 9 spades?
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the rage
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« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2012, 01:32:29 PM »

I think that with these stack sizes, you should just flat call villian's opening raise. Although your hand is way ahead of villian's opening range you seem to be turning it into a pre-flop bluff. If you flat you could hit a pretty well disguised set. If you get called (as here) the only flop you are likely to be comfortable with is one with a nine in it. I think you have to fold to a 4-bet from villian too?
 Would you really lead out on the flop with an overpair in this situation? I dont think so.
 so, for me, it's flat pre, but, as played, i will go for a check on the flop.
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rfgqqabc
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« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2012, 06:43:35 PM »

I think that with these stack sizes, you should just flat call villian's opening raise. Although your hand is way ahead of villian's opening range you seem to be turning it into a pre-flop bluff. If you flat you could hit a pretty well disguised set. If you get called (as here) the only flop you are likely to be comfortable with is one with a nine in it. I think you have to fold to a 4-bet from villian too?
 Would you really lead out on the flop with an overpair in this situation? I dont think so.
 so, for me, it's flat pre, but, as played, i will go for a check on the flop.

You really check an overpair here? REALLY?

Cbet size should be about 1/2 pot here, 15k again is fine, even less is also good. 13-17.5k perfect.
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[21:05:17] Andrew W: you wasted a non spelling mistakepost?
[21:11:08] Patrick Leonard: oll
the rage
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« Reply #9 on: March 30, 2012, 08:29:36 PM »

I think that with these stack sizes, you should just flat call villian's opening raise. Although your hand is way ahead of villian's opening range you seem to be turning it into a pre-flop bluff. If you flat you could hit a pretty well disguised set. If you get called (as here) the only flop you are likely to be comfortable with is one with a nine in it. I think you have to fold to a 4-bet from villian too?
 Would you really lead out on the flop with an overpair in this situation? I dont think so.
 so, for me, it's flat pre, but, as played, i will go for a check on the flop.

You really check an overpair here? REALLY?

Cbet size should be about 1/2 pot here, 15k again is fine, even less is also good. 13-17.5k perfect.

Cheers for that reply rfgqqabc.
 When i made my original post on this thread i was curious as to how my suggestion to check the flop would be received. I suppose that, as the player to make the most aggressive move pre-flop, convention would suggest that Skippy, our hero in this hand, should fire out a continuation bet?
When i chose the option of checking the flop, i was hoping that there would be some feedback to tell me the error of my ways (if it was an error).
 One of my lines of thought was that, being OOP, hero would be in a similar position to someone who has flat called an opening raise, the main difference being that the pot was now much bigger (due to it being 3 bet), and so that, as well as being, potentially, a stack v stack confrontation, it would also be less likely for the villian to just give up to a c-bet.
 If villian had a flush draw or an over-pair he certainly would not be folding.
 I felt that by checking the flop, hero could then assess his options (particularly dependent on live reads). If vilian checked behind (prob unlikely), hero could then consider leading out on a non spade, low turn card, or maybe check again, trying to get to showdown cheaply.
 I'm pretty tired at the mo, so probably thinking even less clearly than usual, so apolgies in advance if this one makes even less sense than my previous post.
 I do still beleive, that, regardless of the post flop line, my suggestion to just flat call the original pre flop raise is the correct choice. I would be interested to hear if anyone begs to differ.
 Cheers for posting the hand Skippy. Smiley
ps-I agree that the c-bet is too big, either way. It appears to commit hero to the hand, which i would say is not ideal, oop, with this stack and this particular hand.
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