Ched Evans

[DungBeetle]

"The Evening Standard conducted a poll in London which showed about 2/3 of the respondents wouldn't want him to play for their club "

Would you be more likely to respond to this poll if you felt strongly anti Evans?  

[DungBeetle]

Plus asking an Arsenal fan if he wants a player to join them who is miles below 1st team standard who is a convicted rapist seems a pretty pointless question.

[Jon MW]

"The Evening Standard conducted a poll in London which showed about 2/3 of the respondents wouldn't want him to play for their club "

Would you be more likely to respond to this poll if you felt strongly anti Evans?  

Given the lengths his supporters have gone to I'd have thought it could be argued either way.

[Jon MW]

Plus asking an Arsenal fan if he wants a player to join them who is miles below 1st team standard who is a convicted rapist seems a pretty pointless question.

On the general point that was made - do you think most people wouldn't mind working with a convicted rapist then?

[arbboy]

Plus asking an Arsenal fan if he wants a player to join them who is miles below 1st team standard who is a convicted rapist seems a pretty pointless question.

On the general point that was made - do you think most people wouldn't mind working with a convicted rapist then?

Most poker players sit and play willingly with criminals every time they play to various degrees.  There was a dtd reg who went down for child offences in the last 12 months in a multi year sentence.

In a football environment i don't think the average footballer would care less about Evan's history if he helped him earn his win bonuses every week with his goals.

[Doobs]

In a liberal objective way I think it's right he should carry on his career - but I think the natural response from most people would be that they wouldn't really want to employ or work with a convicted rapist, or to be associated with them in any way. I think it's a bit odd if people can't understand that's where the protests against him come from.

4 football clubs have wanted to employ him.  And I'm fairly sure those who sign these petitions aren't the prospective team mates.  So as far as I can see the protests against him aren't from the employers or employees, but from people online who have to fill their hours and make themselves feel important, as opposed to allowing a man to serve his sentence and then try and rebuild his career.

30,000 people signed the Oldham petition.  In the context of how many people attend football or watch it every weekend it's tiny.

Less than 300 of them will be people who have actually attended an Oldham game this year imo.

The Evening Standard conducted a poll in London which showed about 2/3 of the respondents wouldn't want him to play for their club - I'd expect the figure to be at least similar for most places.

That's even taking into account the laddish football culture which is more likely to blame the victim - in the general population about working with a convicted rapist I'd expect the figure to be even higher.

Ask tranmere fans or Hartlepool fans if they could sign him for £500 a week when his market value is £5-8k a week with the promise he keeps them in the football league and i think you might get a different answer.  They might not be as keen to admit it in public just like the vast majority of silent people in the yes/no vote were no voters whilst the loud minority was shouting yes at the top of their voice.  It is crazy to think footballers at the lower level of the game are role models when they earn less than most of us on this forum and are totally unknown to 99% of the people in the town they play in.

There was a poll on an Oldham athletic fan forum I saw where 80% of the fans were against the signing.  This is kind of where I am, I think deep down he should have a right to work, but wouldn't want him at 'my' club. 

Just for Tikay.  The website is clearly associated with Ched, as that is where his apology video first appeared.  That website could do many things to prevent the attacks on the current victim without admitting Ched's guilt and has chosen not to.

[DungBeetle]

Plus asking an Arsenal fan if he wants a player to join them who is miles below 1st team standard who is a convicted rapist seems a pretty pointless question.

On the general point that was made - do you think most people wouldn't mind working with a convicted rapist then?

If any criminal had served their prison sentence I think I'd be okay working with a convicted person.  Dunno though - it's easy for me to say that before it actually happens.  On principal I would anyway.  

[arbboy]

Hughes was sentenced for 6 years for death by dangerous driving.  Evans 5 years for rape.  Why is Hughes allowed back into the game but Evans isn't?  What if a talented 18 year old footballer went down for 10 years for serious drug dealing and was let out at 24 would he get the same treatment as Evans?

[DungBeetle]

I assume it is the remorse aspect? 

[arbboy]

I assume it is the remorse aspect? 

Why should he be remorseful when he doesn't believe he committed the crime and is appealing?

[Woodsey]

I assume it is the remorse aspect? 

Why should he be remorseful when he doesn't believe he committed the crime and is appealing?

Can't imagine too many people being remorseful if they felt that strongly they had been wronged by the system to be honest.

[DungBeetle]

I guess that is the crux of it.   

I assume if Evans says sorry to his victim after his release, everyone is happy for him to play like McCormick/Hughes?

So assuming he doesn't get to play till his appeal process is finished, and it doesn't get overturned can he say sorry at that point and still mean it?  It would seem hard for him to do it at that point.   

Can you ever work again if you think you are a victim of injustice but the legal system tells you you are wrong?  Or are you in a constant state of "non rehabilitation"?

[DungBeetle]

I'm playing devils advocate here.  The best course for Evans (unless he is 100% that she fully consented) was to say something along the lines of:

"I thought I had consent at the time.  After looking at evidence in retrospect I didn't.  I am mortified that I have committed rape and apologise unreservedly to the victim for the harm I have done.  I hope she can rebuild her life"

However, I am interested in what life holds for him if he genuinely thinks that he is a victim of injustice and will never show remorse.  Is he cast to the abyss forever by society even though he has served his sentence?

[arbboy]

I'm playing devils advocate here.  The best course for Evans (unless he is 100% that she fully consented) was to say something along the lines of:

"I thought I had consent at the time.  After looking at evidence in retrospect I didn't.  I am mortified that I have committed rape and apologise unreservedly to the victim for the harm I have done.  I hope she can rebuild her life"

However, I am interested in what life holds for him if he genuinely thinks that he is a victim of injustice and will never show remorse.  Is he cast to the abyss forever by society even though he has served his sentence?

No not at all.  He will have to just hope a club it desperate enough to need his services and put up with the short term bad pr like Hughes' clubs had to to get a foot back in the door.  Pretty sure no one at Forest Green cares about hughes 6 year sentence a decade later.

The other thing to remember is Evan's will not be able to play outside of the UK due to the terms of his release so from a pure supply/demand point of view the number of clubs he can offer his services to is massively reduced which will probably force him to take an even lower offer salary wise than he would have had the option of aboard been available to him.  Therefore the price is going to become so cheap that some club will scupper to the PR issues and take him on.
If that doesn't happen then he will just have to get a 'real job' or work for his loaded bird's dad i suppose.  Sure he will never struggle financially in life.  We shouldn't feel overly sorry for him.  Worse case he ends up in the real world like the rest of us.

[horseplayer]

If you dont believe he did that (like me) then its probably ok to feel sorry for him