blonde poker forum

I prefer to play using my "gut" for judgement, You know the way where your gut tells you your jacks are gonna get out drawn so you limp/muck knowing you were gonna go broke otherwise, I know I enjoy poker more playing this way.

I want to know who else plays this way, Who else trusts their card instincts when playing online, and who thinks its a load of bolloks?

Devilfish was on PNL i think the other night and the Bird asked him how he'd play a particular hand from a particular position to which he replied: " YOU'VE MADE THE WRONG BOOKING FOR THIS PROGRAM, THERES SO MANY THINGS I'D HAVE TO ENCORPERATE INTO MY DESCISION THAT YOU HAVENT MENTIONED; MY TABLE IMAGE, HOW I PERCIEVE THE PERSON WITH WHOM I'M IN THE POT, OTHER PEOPLES POSITON" he wound up saying: "I CANT GIVE YOU AN ANSWER" because it all depends how he feels at the time, feeling about things you cant memorialise!

I dont know if thew bird was able to carry on in light of the fact that poker doesn't revolve around Harrington and -+ev but thats the devilfish contention regarding analysing any given hand.

Guaranteed right!!! "HOLLA" in absence of nemesis who aint posted in a while cos theres too many idiots about.

I would agree with your gut statement, I have changed how I play  Th Ts and  Js Jh when I have position on someone who I think has  Ad Ks in a tourney. I always used to aggressively re-raise pre-flop and we get it all in only to see my lovely pair get cracked. I was re-reading Sklansky's Tournament Poker for Adv Players (not sure I really qualify), he is very clear to stay away from 50-50's if you can, at least try to see a flop and make another judgement after he has fired again.

The issue I guess is having the confidence that there will be a better spot, I would rather go out getting priced into a war over blind stealing from the button or cut-off, at least thats a positive move.

Why limp muck, why not just muck?

I find it impossible to muck a pair when its an unraised pot, Even though my gut feeling tells me I am horsed I still have to confirm my gut, its a funy human thing, you bot's would not understand

I can't help being an idiot, it is the result of living in a house full of plants and also the poor educational system in my area  :D

There's nothing wrong with using your gut to read another players hand, take many factors into consideration that change the relative value of your hand (as Mr. Ulliot alluded to) etc etc.

All that is to be actively encouraged, it's the essence of poker.

It's your changing your relative value of your hand because your gut says that the flop will be bad that worries me. I think this is what you're talking about here.
What's the differnce between that, and punting on black at roulette because your gut tells you it's not going to be red.

Now I don't want to take the piss here, that's not my intent. You've said that you enjoy doing things this way, that's fair enough and there's no way I can knock that.

What I mean is, you know the times when your hand wont hold, so rather than go broke just play it passively, I have gone in to hands 76% to win yet I know my opponent is going to hit his set with his smaller pair.

Have you never been playing and that "little Voice" inside tells you to play your cards / Muck your cards, only to do the opposite just to see the "little" voice was right?

I know this happens to me, I know Phil Gordon advocated this also.

Now before the piss taking starts I am not claiming to have esp, So no sending me pics of tarot cards!

This worries me.

The "little voice" in my head says things like "You're top pair top kicker is no good, your opponent has flopped middle set".

But, correct me if I am wrong here, your "little voice" says things like "my aces are no good pre-flop, this guy is going to flop a straight".... It seems to me that you ARE saying you have ESP!?

And, of course, by playing passively you remove one of the ways the hand can win (making the other guy fold) making it more likely to be a self-fulfilling prophecy.

There are two separate issues here.

The gut feeling 'he's got a big hand here - I should fold' can be the result of your subconscious instantaneously picking up on clues (betting patterns, tells etc) that your opponent is acting in a similar way to the way people do when they have a big hand. This is a good 'gut feeling' and should be listened to (provided you've trained it enough).

The second gut feeling is 'My Jacks will probably lose' based on, what, exactly? The fact you're predisposed to more likely remember bad beats than the times they hold up?

Its just a gut feeling, there is no Math involved, its that gut feeling that tells you to make the wrong decision for your own good.

Let me put it another way, how many times have you looked down to find a complete junk hand and you raise cos your gut tells you you are going to win?

Its a 2 way street for the wrong play that works to your advantage.

Surely i am not the only person on the forum that gets gut feelings?

We all get gut feelings that we may not be able to explain, but they are usually based on information we have recieved and not processed completely rather than random predictions of future events.

Good post mate.

Now where does that come from and how come its right most of the time?

I think your sig tells us more about your state of mind than anything you've posted in this thread.

If you've got Jacks & you "know" your oppo has a lower pair why arent you raising him to either fold or make a bad call?

No.

it all depends on how you have done with a certain hand the previous few times... if you have won your last three races with AK vs a smaller pair... you should be more likely to fold AK this time round because its "about time" that your AK lost.. you cant keep winning the flips.

Conversely if you have lost with AK the last few times, you should get into the pot asap as you are more likely to win

The same applies to flushdraws as well.

This can be closely correlated to optimum roulette theory, you see the experts all the time holding their 25p chips, studying the previous few spins, and if the last 3 or 4 have gone red, they will lump onto black, because the law of averages state that it is more likely to be black

Bear all this in mind, and you most certainly can become not only a professional poker player, but a professional roulette player as well

That sig is ages old, I am just not in to changing it everyday.. lol

What I am talking about is not makin " the right decicion" its more about you just get a feeling you are gona lose a had, you know you are miles ahead and yet you know that 4 hits the flop to give your opponent the set, then afterwards  you curse yourself for knowing it was going to happen and not listening to yourself.

Knowing your opponent has made a bad call is rarely any solace when you are riding the shortstack and on your way out of a tourney... or am i being naive?

so you follow your gut flushy ?

The feelings I was refering to having nothing to do with 'I know I'm going to be outdrawn' or 'my filth will hit this flop' more 'He has a big hand' or 'he is weak'. Often you can sense these things, when playing live, without being able to put it down to a tell or betting patterns.

Getting a feeling about a random event that is about to occur is completely different. I think that the human mind tends to recall the times your gut feelings were right more easily than the times they were wrong. Poker is not a guessing game.

Totalise, you are a naughty boy!

Ricky Gervais is shitting himself :)up ;D

The feeling you get when someone is weak or when you are sure you can raise them off a hand is different.

Its just a question, and I am not claiming to see the future, be tuned in to the force or have xray vision, Maybe its the pessimist in me that "knows" i'm going to lose to a 2 outer, and the jammy sod that see's my bag of spanners make a boat on the flop.

I was just curious.

I follow my brain.

yes, but that feeling can be logically reasoned. I think it was Wardonkey that alluded to the fact that snippets of info seep into your subconscious, which is often where the gut feeling comes from.


I'd say that is likely the case.

Billy, it just seems to me that your way of thinking is more in line with the hundreds of compulsive gamblers that I knew during my casino career, than a succesful poker player.

This was the point totalise was making, in his own sarcastic style, in his first post.

I know that Totalise was taking the piss I'm not that daft ( yes its debateable)

Dont get me wrong, I have gone back to playing TA poker online, its working and i'm ticking over nicely, I just see situations where possibly the pessimistic voice is particularly vocal and seems to be right or the optimistic voice is quite loud and seems to be right.

Anyways just a thought cheers for the input.

Don't forget the earlier point of playing a hand more passive makes you more likely to get outdrawn. Self fulfilling prophecy and all that.

Leave the force up to these guys if you wanna beat online poker long term.....

;starwars;

I was going to post something about the force but Tankie beat me to it!

Then again, if you really do have use of "the force" then you should be using it to make people fold, not pessimistically folding yourself because the force tells you that you are beaten. Join the dark side.

I did not mention "the Force"  and in my first post I did say I am not claiming to have esp or see the future.

Its just a passing thought i wanted opinions on

You didnt need to say "esp" or "the force". You are basically telling us that the little voice in your head can predict the future.

TBH I think there is much milage in the self forfilling prophesy though. You think your hand will be outdrawn so you play it differently, encouraging players to look for the outdraw that inevitably will come.

I never said That I DID play the hand differently, I played the hads properly yet I did suffer the outdraw, how would I know otherwise?

If I get Jack's I'm raising and I'm trying to get the other guy to make that mistake, However when you get a gut feeling that you should have played the hand differently its a pisser when your gut is correct.

...and not so much of a pisser when your gut is wrong....leading to it not being burned in your mind as much perhaps?

Touche tanky

When my gut speaks it sounds like an arsehole.

Well, THIS tends to give it away....


Or am I not reading that correctly...

No


Read it again, I stated i would prefer to limp muck if I get a gut feeling, yet i never do. 

I got the opinions I wanted anyways.

Read it again. Still says "I would limp/muck knowing I would go broke otherwise". Doesn't say "I was going to limp/muck but didnt"

ok going off topic here but If YOU READ it again mikky it says " YOU know the way where your gut tells YOU YOUR jacks are gonna get out drawn so YOU limp/muck knowing YOU were gonna go broke otherwise"

It was a question not a statement, the statement from me was the preferenceon how to play the cards rather than go broke.

 ;whistle;

"I know I enjoy poker more playing this way."

Still get the same inference from your statement/question/conjecture.

Well in that case consider yourself corrected.

On the basis of what? Evidence clearly shows otherwise. I don't have ESP (unlike yourself) so how am I meant to know that you really meant to write something else instead of what you actually wrote!?

Hang on to that bone Mikky!

I usually go with my gut instinct... maybe thats why I'm a losing player?

yes but your gut instinct doesn't rely on ESP poppet

i'll ans your Q......... mugs game.