blonde poker forum

Card room supervisor at Cardiff, who changed the ante structure twice last night (at the request of the players) to allow more play.

Sean has now been inducted into my Grovesnor Supervisor Hall of Fame, and is a serious contender for a spot in the top 3.

Sounds like a weak TD to me, caving in to players twice is either a product of poor tournament management and organisation or he's just keeping the people with deep pockets happy.

I would be impressed if he set a precedence within the chain to have all tourneys with a good playable structure not caving in to player pressure on a night during a tourney!

Seriously though guys, thanks for your hospitality. We had a great time, and we hope to be back next weekend for your £500 double chance freeze.

Thanks for your oppinion regarding a person you have never met, a situation you have no knowledge of. and a tournament you didn't attend.

I'll let you know the next time I want to thank someone, perhaps you can have your bucket of cold water ready.

I'll have the water ready Tom and i'm sure you will be as nippy as always.

What was it changed from/changed to?

Given the very brief facts that you gave, Tom, Billy has a valid point (and is free to express him opinion on an open forum) It's great that TD's are listening to players, that is NEVER a bad thing. Lets hope that one day the players DON'T have to kick up a fuss to get a decent tourney.

v well said   j.

a touch of poacher turned gamekeeper    on the new forum of late  imho.........

pathetic

 ;popcorn;

(http://forum.bravofleet.com/images/smilies/kitt.gif)

I deliberately left the details out. It was a simple thank you note.

Why do people need to immediately follow anything positive with a negative. This guy is only guilty of trying to be helpful. and yet someone who doesn't know the situation feels free to accuse him of being a "Weak TD"  and use language like "Keeping players with deep pockets  happy"

Yes, he is free to express his opinion, you yours, I would never argue with that. It just makes me sad that even a simple thank you thread is used to make hurtfull and disparaging remarks about someone's ability and integrity.

Maybe a simple thank you note would prove more personal and less likely to receive unwanted comments, if they weren't posted on an open forum. Doing such allows ANY reader to post whatever response they feel fit.

 I simply pointed out that Billy had a valid comment to make (I quite agree with him on the limited info, but may have worded it differently lol)

There was no fuss, just a simple request.

You wanna try going large mate - (http://www.freewebby.com/beer-food-sick-smilies/pop.gif)

Should we have to request a decent tourney? I would hope that it would be automatic.

 ;iagree;

personally and in my opinion as i have said before i think its wrong for structures to be changed mid tournament or from the advertised structure.

surely grosvenor have ran enough tournaments in past to know what is and what isnt a good structure and to sort out before the competition rather than when asked or pressured (like was said earlier we dont know the facts) by players.

there might of been a few weaker gambler type players who know they arent as good as the red-dogs of this world but felt they would take there chance because it was a fast structure and would suit there loose gambling style rather than an absolute rock who will sit and wait for hands because the structure allows.
how fair is it on these players who pay thier money the same as the next person to see the goalposts moved away from the advertised structure to suit the better players?

hence why i say structures should remain unaltered and TD'S should learn and adjust for future planned events.

i personally would not change a structure at any event i organise because of pressure from players unless i considered there to be a serious flaw.

so to praise a TD for changing something mid tournament that he should have got right prior to the commencement of the tournament is not something i would do but of course if tom feels that his actions were worthy of the said praise then thats his perogative.

but as ginger said if posted on a public forum then its open to anyone to have thier opinion whether right or wrong.

maybe billy could of worded his "weak TD" better but i certainly wouldn't call him a strong TD with the limited facts presented in this forum.

Is this the General Discussion forum?

That's a bit harsh IMO.

If everyone there was happy with it how was it bad management? Surely that's good improvisation - managing. It takes balls to change a structure mid comp IMO. Especially after advertising a different structure.

It's not easy to determine what the TD was like by anything said on here. Only those who were there would know what he was like.

I think Red's view of the guy is a lot fairer than this one!

My comment was " sounds like a Weak TD"  of the TD's I have known a few, the only ones that have changed the tournament structures they were running mid tourney were the weak ones, Tourneys that have an advertised structure should never change from what is advertised, players come with a strategy to play and as Belly said to move the goal posts is plain unfair.

I stand by my opinion.

As for wording things differently, why sugar coat things?  personally i have never seen the point.

listen you lot ,i cant understand why you would want to have a go at a sean (TD) for giving the customers what they want ,,,AND THIS IS WHAT WE ALL WANTED LASTNIGHT,sean is one of the top tds in the game and he listens to the players not like some who want to turn games into crapshoots to get them over with.... this was something new what was asked to be changed,  the running ante during level 150 - 300, and red-dog, as you all know is one of the most respected players on the circuit,so if he offers some advice for a little change then we at cardiff will look at it and welcome it .you know what theres some posters on here just waiting to jump down peoples throats for nothing IMO what a load of boll0x,why cant you just say oh well done sean keep up the good work,its not like as if hes done a runner with the money.GREAT POST RED AND WELCOME BACK NEXT WEEK AND TO ALL WHO WANTS TO PLAY A TIDY GAME THAT DONT END UP IN A CRAPSHOOT

Memo to self:

Refrain from having an opinion, you may offend someone!   pfft

Gimme a break, no one was having a go at the TD in question is was an observation on the facts given, simple as that and as usual the soapbox is taking a beating.

Sometimes just sometimes you don't have to piss on someone's fire. Let him say thanks without lots of Freud's coming out to analyse if it was a warrented  thank you.

Acid, I'm not debating the fact that Red was saying a thank you, the point is that as soon as you decide to post that said thank you note, on an open forum thread, it is open for anyone to reply as they so please. If you DON'T want comments/replies or someone disagreeing, simply don't post it on an open forum!

Billy gave his opinion on what facts Red posted - that the structure was changed TWICE, to anybody that fact alone would make you wonder what sort of TD this was. This isn't a personal attack on an individual, but purely remarks on the little facts given.

 ;popcorn; ;popcorn;

;ifm;

Thats opinion Red not having a go, now if i had said he was a shocking TD and should be sacked for such actions, that would be having a go, with you being a mod i would expect you to know the difference.

I cannot believe how overboard you have gone on Newmanseyes earlier comments Red.. It's his opinion, one which he is entitled to.

I didn't go overboard, I just gave my opinion.

Wow. I went for my afternoon nap - as you do - woke up, & find this little thread!

Let's start with Red-Dog. He's a close personal friend, so it would be inappropriate for me to come on here & defend him. He is quite capable of looking after himself.

The TD at Cardiff. I don't think the facts have been presented as clearly as they might have been, & this has led to some misunderstandings about what has been described as a "weak TD". That's incorrect imo - here's what happened.

We arrived 15 minutes before the comp began to find a Structure Sheet being handed to everyone. It included Running Antes.

At the 400-800 Blind Level, the Running Ante was....200!

Word spread round the cardroonm very fast - "must be a mistake" was the concensus, & Martyn Cavanagh, I think, was despatched to see the TD. TD says "hands up, that's wrong, I hear what you say, we've not done Running Antes before, we will change it".

By now, the comp is starting, so an announcement is made "the Running Antes are wrong, a new Sheet will be printed up with revised Antes shortly".

And so it was. A new sheet was then printed up, & though I never saw it, I gather that one was incorrect, too. The thing was, they had never done Running Antes down there previously, or rarely so, & the TD fella was grateful for the advice from the players. There was not a single dissenting voiice - not one.

The TD made a mistake originally, & was big enough to admit it, & correct it.

He was not subject to "player pressure", not at all. Martyn spoke to him along the lines of "excuse me mate, this looks wrong, what do you think?". It was as simple as that. Every single player was in agreement.

The structure had NOT been advertised in advance, so nobody was misled.

I think it's a wonderful thing the way "the worm is turning" & players views are now being taken into account. Even just a year ago, players moaned & groaned about bad structures, but did nothing. Now we have got things moving, let's all pull together, and make for better Tournament Poker in the UK. But this does not make the Venues or the TD's "weak", far from it, in my opinion.

I can't believe the popcorn smiley has been added to the blonde library! I feel like i have achieved a major life goal.

 ;popcorn;

Good post Tony,  You have given a clear account of what has happened at the tourney, with the new information it most certainly does not sound like a weak TD.  I say the more TD's cooperate with players the better, perhaps the cooperation should be done before the tourney kicks off though.

With the information available initially my original post still stands though.

Cheers for clearing it up Tony, I'm sure the UN need a new peace ambassador.  :)up

Weather you think hes weak or not you derailed a congratz thread.

Trolls trolls everywhere.

Don't you think the knight rider one is a must Flushy? ;)

(http://forum.bravofleet.com/images/smilies/kitt.gif)

It needs to be renamed as "The Flushy" :D

This is the Flushy though. :D

 ;flushy; ;flushy; ;flushy;

Good point ... and very appropriate it is too :D :D

i thought this was the flushy


http://www.planetsmilies.com/smilies/love/love0003.gif

Mountain... molehill.....

well done sean, top bloke, top TD. he listens to the players and has changed the range of tournys available in cardiff, added levels etc all in response to the players (of all levels not just those those with deep pockets). maybe an inquiry as to the facts might have resulted in a more positive thread??

Fair enough, IF the correct facts had been given in the first place than half of the posts on this thread would never be here. The post Red made implied something happened that didn't (IMO - MUST remember to add that to all posts in future!) and thus the opinions and posts on that 'fact' ensued.

You can't slate someone for replying to a post on the facts that they are given, when you haven't given a clear view of what actually happened.

The moral of this story - for me - is let's look for the positives, not the negatives, the good, not the bad, the well-intended, not the ill-intended.

IMO, that is.....

moi? slate? I think not... a gentle suggestion perhaps? and you are right of course incomplete facts can lead to confusion, however sometimes saying thankyou just feels like enough!?

LOL, I'm not accusing you of slating anyone, I was more referring to the response in general to Billy's post.

Thankyous are nice to give out, sadly a tiny half detail added caused soooooo much more bother than if it was simply omitted.

To the Welsh team for turning up and donating to the 4 nations ICHUC prizepool




THANKYOU x

sounds like a weak team to me ;)

Let down by their Captain I heard ;)

Their Captain done a great job, he was unfortunate to get drawn against a Scott that is too tight to call an overbet to the pot.

and very well he played too.....

I intended this to be a thank you thread, nothing more.

However, looking back, I can see that I also used it as an opportunity to promote my views on tournament structures and the attitude of TD's. When Newmanseye chimed in with his two pennworth, I reacted badly. Ginger is quite right, I should have taken the time to explain things in more detail.

The fact is, I'm suffering from a total tact and tolerance failure at the moment. I could give you a list of reasons why I feel this way, but to be honest, it's no excuse.

To those of you who I have offended, I apologise.

This used to go without saying on Blonde. A shame it's no longer the case.

Well, together, we have to keep sending out that message. I freely admit, the cynical Charlies, the moaning Minnies, the smart-Alecs, & the negative Nigels, do get to me now & then - wassamatter wiv 'em, it's about a game of poker ffs? - but as long as we keep smiling & being positive, thats all we can do. It will be what it wiill be.

Ridentem dicere verum quid vetat

Don't suppose anyone would like to let us know the result at Cardiff...?
 ;scarymoment;

Time for a song (Tikay will remember Bing Crosby)  ;hattip;

 You've got to accentuate the positive
 Eliminate the negative
 Latch on to the affirmative
 Don't mess with Mister In-Between

 You've got to spread joy up to the maximum
 Bring gloom down to the minimum
 Have faith or pandemonium
 Liable to walk upon the scene

why do you see people debating an issue (primarily what these forums are for) and/or having a different opinion to yourself as having a go? and why is any other opinion than your own bollox??

you didnt offend me at all tom for having a different view to yourself and i hope i never offended you.

im with you as far as changing the tournaments for the better of the players though im "rubbish", its the timing of it i object to.

well to give an oppinion when you dont know the facts in my eyes would be boll0x, you should only give your honest opinon in my eyes when you know all the facts,it was like some one on here couldnt wait to be first in with a snide comment ok its there opinon what they think, and so is it mine as to what i think......

Hmm, think I'll go back to bed......

just because someone has an opinion different to your own doesnt make them cynical neither does it make them a cynical charlie a moaning minnie a smart alec or a negative nigel.

blonde also used to be a place where you could voice your opinion even with opposing views to site owners or moderators without being accused of being one of the above (and i'm not for one second saying anyones accusing me)

im all for keeping the "unique" friendlyness of the blonde forum but please guys lets still be able to voice our own opnions and not become a bunch of a**e lickers!

and seeings as this is a thank you thread for sean il continue it as it was meant

 ;applause; u gave the players what they wanted sean.

Do you KNOW he couldn't wait to be first in with a snide comment? Or have you drawn a conclusion based on the info available, much as Newmanseye did?

There is also the question of how he's supposed to go get the facts?

beat me to it rod ! :goodpost: ;iagree;

Hang on Sofa King, I made no snide comment, I gave an opinion based on the information given, and IMHO my assessment  based on that information was right on the mark.

You know what, its just not worth the time to type a reply.

".......just because someone has an opinion different to your own doesnt make them cynical neither does it make them a cynical charlie a moaning minnie a smart alec or a negative nigel......"

I never suggested for a moment that someone having a different opinion was any of those Alecs/Minnies/Nigels or Charlies. I concurred with Jezzas Post, which was a generalism. I've held the same view on blonde & off blonde, in poker & out of poker, my entire life. I'm a positive person, not a negative, an upper not a downer, a glass half-full not a glasss half-empty guy. I set up the blonde Forum in exactly that spirit, & so I've never been comfy with downsiders. Thats a generalism, and not related to this thread..

i allways thought to have a opinon on something you should know the something, that your talking about instead of saying ,hey red why did he do this m8?or strange that one ?instead of jumping to a conclusion in which you have done by saying what you did WEAK TD TO ME ,well he aint a weak td to any of us at cardiff he is a great TD to us and he loves the game of poker thats why he is so good at what he does and your opinon counts for 0 as to say he caves into player pressure during a tourney coz he dont ,,,you know what i cant belive im even bothering to write this ,as you all know this was a thankyou THREAD TO sean as tom dont have his number and tom wanted to express his thanks out loud to a top TD ..why does it allways have to end tits up on here when someone wants to thank someone?f-k me it was only thankyou some people got 0 to do than jump on the band wagon THATS MY OPINON and yes i know all the facts!!!

glad to see the flaming rule applies to everyone  rotflmfao rotflmfao

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Loc8bpczZPY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qJ8ahL8LsEQ

Hehe, love it, way to go.

I liked Sting in his Police days, before he went all pretentious & decided he was the one to lecture us on how we lived our lives. Weird how these Pop/Rock stars all go down that route - Bono, George Michael etc. The latter was giving forth on the Iraqi situation the other day, making out to be some kind of expert. Balderdash!

Can someone find me a vid of "always look on the bright side of life, di dum, di dum, di dum di dum di dum"? That's my idealogy in one.

Thats it!

It was there even before I asked. Spooky. Can you read my mind?

Yeah everytime i see Sting going off on one i think of that video, cuz he looks like a right plonker in it :D
As for Bono!! jeez i think just about everything he has said for the last 10 years has been daft.

Spot on Ian.

These guys seem to think that just because they have sold a few records, it makes them "the People's representative", & they trot off to shake hands with the Pope & Mr President, giving it large as they do so.

Bono? Sting? George Michael? Who next, Shaun Ryder? Count me out.

Just read through the whole thread (thought I wouldn't reply without reading through it all) and it sounds to me like a thank you and a well done to this TD was indeed in order.

I love it when TD's listen to suggestions. I can't even count the nr of times myself (and others) have asked for the blinds to be frozen at a final table because average chips were only 4 or 5 times the BB and only once have I heard a "yeah sure".

Especially when a TD has a great idea of a running ante, which they admit having never done before and having no experience with, I think it's fantastic that they listen to the players on the very first day when they say "I have some experience with running ante's and you might want to consider this and that to avoid running into problems here". Many a time have I been at a tourney when people try something for the first time and you point something out and they say "Well if it doesn't work we'll change it the next time" Forgetting in the process that people also pay money for that first time they are trying it.


Of course everyone is entitled to their opinion on an open forum..but reading through this entire thread, TK's explanation (and Red-Dog's apology...which, again, confirms to me that he is a true gent and a bigger man than most) make it sound to me like we need more TD's like the fella who ran this tourney.

Seems like a printing error was spotted and put right. ;hattip;

Leaving aside the 'debate' which has ensued on this thread, I've been struck recently on Blonde how many times people have felt the need to use a variation of the phrase 'everyone is entitled to their opinion'. At least six different people on this thread so far.

Doesn't this really go without saying?

It seems to be most commonly used when a poster feels slighted by another comment, one which suggests that the original poster's comment is wrong. They take the comment as a criticism of themselves personally, and thus get defensive/lash out, rather than accept that it is possible to criticise something someone says without criticising the person.

Just because you think someone's opinion may be wrong, it doesn't mean they don't have the right to express it.

Similarly, just because someone has expressed an opinion, it doesn't mean someone else can't take issue and criticise it - don't take it personally.

Let's debate the issues, not the people who express opinions on the issues.

For my part, I was out of order.

I wanted to argue rather than debate. No one ever listens to people who argue, they just argue back.

The Clock I presume thats you martin.

the result as follows -
1.daniel plays in cardiff
2.roberto
3.uday
4.Blonde fella(Mrs always watches him)
5.Me
6.doc
7.viv
8.ed (doc)
9.maria (chili)

Is that a bad thing? When someone decides to use their fame to try to help solve problems i think it should be embraced not knocked. It would be a lot easier for them to spend their time and money enjoying themselves but instead they try to do something positive.

The more celebs who do this the better IMO. And yes, quite often they do represent the opinion of the general public.

I have a problem with guys like Bono preaching to everyone about how poverty is such a bad thing when he flew his stetson from the states to the concert in businessclass at a cost of 15k so he could wear it for the concert.

As long as the Celebs talk sense, I am wholly supportive of it.........but that caveat is crucial!

Also, in many cases, they do it for self-promotion, not because they care, or they know.

Do we really need sermonising on how we live our lives, by the likes Britney Spears, or Charlotte Church?

Yes Tony some times it is done for self promotion, but is that so bad. It's like when a celeb supports a charity, they get publicity for it which helps them, but it also helps the cause, a win win situation.



If that's what he chooses to do with his money that's fine, he has done more to help world poverty than this entire forum put together.


I hate the British way of thinking that anyone who is successful needs to be knocked down. All successful business people are soulless evil creatures and all celebs just do good deeds "for the publicity"

It is possible to be successful and a nice guy.....let the jealousy end!

Cor, what a long thread about nothing.

I like Cardiff, can't wait to go back.

Light travels faster than sound.  Which is why some people only look bright.

I think I agree with Flushy. I think.

Someone shoot me.

Yep everyones  allowed an Opinion,  but I think people should realise though you dont have to voice it all the time if it will derail, hijack, bring a negative vibe to a thread. Many a times I bite my tongue and not posted because it wasn't really appropriate or my place. This is one case in point, let the Fokker say thank you.

The first part of your sentence had absolutely nothing to do with the second.... unless you need to renounce all your worldly possesions before you're allowed to speak.

Having said that, I went to see R.E.M. and was screaming at the bald guy to just shut the hell up and just sing another ditty. Precocious twonk that he was.

it's not the renouncing of worldy possesions..in fact I think it's really cool when a celebrity does something for a cause (unless it really is blatant self publication) I do however also feel that someone paying 15k for a businessclass seat FOR HIS HAT!! has gone slightly off the rails and I don't neccesarily find him credible at that stage.

I have tremendous amounts of respect for people like Bob Geldof (even though I think he's a prat) and Roger Moore, Angelina Jolie, Madonna etc who put their money and time and effort in without boasting about it.

"precocious twonk" indeed.....! He can get in a sack with Mr Bono & Co for me.....

And it's got nothing to do with jealousy, or not being nice. Bono, Sting, Stipe, Morrisey, Michael, all very successful, & nice guys, I'm quite sure. I buy their music, watch their Vids, I like them - a LOT. But do they hold a mandate for my opinions - no Sir!

You are all right in what you say, I will point out that the posters on blonde would not be the target market for the propaganda spouted by these pop/rock/teenybop stars, they are preaching to the impressionable, the General of the general public, the SHEEP if you will, and if they manage to get enough SHEEP march on their causes them maybe just maybe something gets done in this slow moving planet.

I for one praise what these guys do, if they can separate enough troglodytes from the ignorance beat we might see a change for the better.

"....I for one praise what these guys do,...."

What, ALL of them? That's my whole point. Some of them talk sense, some don't. Some have a valid point, others dont. Some are good guys, some are not. But being successful does not mean we HAVE to respect, listen, or like them. Some we do, some we don't. I can't say, as you seem to suggest, "I praise these guys". My line is that I praise some of them, condemn others, & am ambivelant towards the rest. Surely, that's a more reasonable line, no?

I'll listen (but not necessarily agree) to Bono. Ditto Mr Stipe & Co. But I sure ain't gonna listen to Mr J King, or Mr G Glitter, & nor are you!

It's that balance thing again. But it has absolutely zero to do with knocking success.

It's not as if he's riding alongside his hatty, I assume the money was for it to be couriered over.

That aside, 'tis the precedent that I don't like. Tabloid newspapers deciding for us to what constitutes a necessary expense, and what is gaurish decadence worthy of shaking our heads and saying "tut".

Here's a thought, maybe Bono finds people spending 50k on a poker tournament disgustingly hypocritical. :)

Just because Bono talks some pap I'm not sure he's totally not worth listening to. There's still a lot that he's said that is not only true but needs to be said by someone in the spotlight. He's done some good work over the years even if he is a bit of a pain.

No if he had it couriered it would have been 2k..this actually had to go on a businessclass flight in a seat (as he had stipulated) I didn't get that from the tabloids BTW..don't read them so don'ty know what's in them.

I am fine with people spending a lot of cash on trivial things...what I don't like is the same people telling me how bad poverty is.
If a poker player spends 50k on a poker tourney and then goes on about how bad gambling is for you I would also tend to think he's a hypocrite. (bad comparison I agree but I'm too lazy to come up with a better one)

 :respect:

I think it should be pointed out that U2's own company are not based in Ireland/UK for tax purposes, which just adds to the hypocracy.

Ok
Just out of curiosity, what was the source?

What if they spend over and above what they would be paying in tax in the UK on charitable donations.

What if the reason they moved was becasue they feel they can put the money to better use than this government can.

Not saying that's true, but I'm just arguing that moving to tax havens needn't necessary be hypocritical.

Beat me too it!

yeah i have no problem with people moving for tax reasons...in fact I think as soon as I can afford to I'll do the same..indeed not because it's cheaper but because I don't like the way the government spends my money.


Source for the 15k was an interview bono did with Paxman in which he admitted it....he didn't give a very clear reason as to why other then "I don't perform without it"

Just wondering if he got at least 15k out of press from the stunt. Flight may well have payed for itself.

btw...wow talk about a thread going off topic.

We started off in Cardiff & ended up discussing hats on aeroplane seats & world poverty.

This is the blonde I love.