blonde poker forum

Played there this week and thought it had nothing to offer. It was lifeless, with the staff going through the motions, hardly ever seen a valet. When we chopped the £400 we decided not to leave a drink for the valets as it was that bad. Any regulars feel the same or have l caught them on a bad week?

I have decided to ring at 530pm and if they have 60+, l will come for the ME, if not DTD for the £100 and a nice atmosphere for the fight!

i remember being down in brighton for a £300 freeze and flushy was offered the best ever deal ive seen in poker, you came over to argue that he should play for the win. You said "play for the win james"  and now you chop the £400 lol. Nice result, but from what i heard from you early this year i would think you were the last person on earth to deal.

Action, 3 reasons for the deal last night mate and u would understand if you where there. It was 710pm m8 and we had been playing from 8pm - 5am the night before and then from 3pm yesterday. It was a shocker! I wanted to play the Omaha and the final 4 where all competent players with plenty of play left.

It was the situation more than anything.

ahhh no bother just thought you were anti-deals! how much you pick up and who were the players left in? nice result. GL for the M.E

I don't agree with you, The last thing I would call Luton is dull and lifeless.

Luton is one of my favorite cardrooms, and it's the staff that make it so. They are always willing to listen to suggestions from the players and IMHO really do everything they can to keep everyone happy.

The long suffering dealers are, by and large, excellent. They do a tough job very well and interact well with the players.

I do agree, to some extent about the valets, (many times I have suffered severs cheesecake withdrawal symptoms) and the loud music gets on my threppeny-bits, but the players are good fun, the staff try hard, and on the whole, I think the G is a great place to play poker.

The staff at the G are great.

The poker room is great.

The atmosphere is usually very good.

Its the "powers that be" that need changing!

Luton G COULD be a great card room if only things were run properly.

I have been a regular at Luton for a few years now and have seen a steady decline - now this may be due to the market reaching saturation point, but the complete lack of marketing/advertising MUST be a contributory factor to the fall in numbers.

Mick, I cannot honestly see 60+ for the main event, I just cannot.

Valets are a big problem, a lot left when the casino moved and have been replaced by "newbies". In addition there aren't enough of them. However its not their fault they are over-stretched.

that apart, the staff are very motivated, the players are a good bunch and its a fun place to play

I must admit that the atmosphere this week was "un-festival" like, probably due to the abandonment of non GUKPT festivals by Blue Sq, head office and the like in terms of promotional material, presence at events etc etc

8 days into December and the web site still has November's schedule on there - says it all really. A shame - I've enjoyed all my experiences in the card room.

of all the times iv played at luton ,iv never had any probs ,
from vallets /dealers ,must say its one of the best places in the country  apart from dtd of course.

Problem with Luton is its so variable. When the competent people like Nina and Alistair are present and in charge its generally run well. Take the changes to the £200 FO structure this week for example, fantastic- well done Nina.

However, the day 2 of the £400 FO clashed with a £30 satellite that had about 15 runners. Guess which competition got priority on the clock display screens even after we whined. Yep. F**King joke.

Luton? Well, each to their own. Personally, I adore the place, & I intend to use Luton & dtd as my default Venues, as they both care so much for players best interests.

G-Luton opened early in 2007, & struggled for a while to sort enough Dealers. But the initial batch who were trained up are just super, ever smiling, friendly, & long-suffering at the rudeness of many players towards them. More are being trained as we speak, & the progesss Luton are making is exemplary.

Valets - or lack of them - is their achilles heel, but again, they are on the case. Ditto their Catering, which is just awful - but they know that, & are working on improving it. By the way, I always lave the Valets a drink at Luton when I (so rarely.....) get a draw, because it's not the Valets fault that there are not enough of them.

Most of all, the regulars are a terrific bunch, & that counts for so much. Nina has grow in stature beyond recognition, Adrian is a future Top TD, very much in the Yogi-mould, & Alastair, though he gets some stick, has his heart in the right place.

The chairs & tables are beautiful, & no cardroom in the UK - even DTD - gives the players as much "space" to wander around without falling over side-tables or asking players to "give me room to get past please". It's achingly large & supremely comfortable, it's just lovely to be able to stretch your legs & wander around freely.

The range & stucture of their week-in week-out Tourneys is as good as any in the UK.

The reception Staff do that weird thing that other venues - especially The Vic & Brighton Rendezvous - find so hard to do - smile.

The music - they have a "turn" most nights - is just horrendously loud & incredibly distracting, but we have to rermember, it's a Casino, not a pure Poker Venue (a'la dtd), & so they have to cater for "Casino Tourists" who come to play the table games, especially at weekends. On Friday & Saturday nights, the place absolutely heaves with people, "night out" folks, & this is where Grosvenor make their income, not from Poker. Were it not for that income, there would not be the superb Cardroom at Luton, so I guess we have to endure the damn music on that basis, & remember thart we can't have our cake & eat it.

This week's Fessie has suffered with low numbers - as most Fessies have in 2007, due to the "series poker" craze, but plans are afoot to address that in 2008.

As an aside, & apropos Luton "developing" their new Cardroom, have a guess at how many Staff they employ - it's the top side of 120! And how many different nationalities within that? 32!

It's not easy starting a new Poker Venue, as Rob & his dtd Team will testify, & I think Lution are working very hard to be one of the UK's Premier poker venues. These things are not easy, & take time. I know of no other Venue, dtd excepted, that is trying so hard to please their clientele. We are lucky to have them both, in my opinion. Festivals & work apart, I shall share my Live poker time between Luton & dtd - 4 days a week at each.

You can't manage that and work as well?  Pfft!

Only been to Luton once and thoroughly enjoyed my weekend in the cardroom.

Tikay's post covers all.

I am begining to get bored with everyone comparing DTD to Casino cardrooms, yes we know it is probably so much better...........it's a poker club for pokerites, that was Rob's intentions.

Whilst we all agree that Casino cardrooms could be better, it is not until places like DTD have been up and running and showing that, treated properly, there could be additional profit to be made by entertaining pokerites will Casino's catch up.

Geo.

Geo, l'm not comparing it to DTD. I was stating a fact of how l found it now, after many previous visits there as a UK Circuit regular.

Love Luton
Love DTD

Played DTD last night after having wathed Leicester beat Toulouse........nice to have the option

Playing Luton tonight probably.....always be home

 Aspades

Sorry guys but agree with original post...Luton is a very poor venue or at least was on my last visit.
Service poor, some of the cardroom staff are excellent but some are absolutely awful, the tables and especially the chairs are totally US. Generally all the bad points from the old casino have been relocated in the new one. Having said that I, along with a lot of other players will no doubt "Shut up an put up" ...on rare occasions.
DtD on the other hand is a different matter.....   L.A. type cardroom in Notts ....fantastic job by Rob .

I also found the service in Luton dreadful, it's a really nice room but the times i have been there a valet has never asked me if i wanted a drink and a night hasn't gone by without an argument, not my idea of a good poker venue.

I remember in the GPT festival 200 rebuy event, the whole first day a valet never came to our table, 8pm-5am not a single visit!. It annoyed me so much that i was hoping to win the event so badly just so i could make the point of leaving nothing for the valets.

As for the cardroom staff, i don't really see anything wrong there, i have had a few dealers in there who are a bit unsure of themselves but its hardly surprising given how hostile a lot of the players are.

I'll go back for festivals but outside of that i can't see myself there, why are almost all cardrooms full of complete twats that ruin it for everyone else?

I remember in the GPT festival 200 rebuy event, the whole first day a valet never came to our table, 8pm-5am not a single visit!. It annoyed me so much that i was hoping to win the event so badly just so i could make the point of leaving nothing for the valets.

Yup, the level of Valet Service is poor, very poor. But that's not the Valet's fault, so I'm not sure what point there is in penalising the few Valets who are there by not tipping them (when you Cash), because they need to work very hard to "cover" the Cardroom without help. That's just punishing the wrong people!

Poker players are incredibly hard to please, & demanding. We want Valet service with soft drinks, tea & coffee, all for free, & if we don't get it, we moan & groan!

G-Luton is a new Venue, & they are working on improving their weaknesses. Unless you have started a new business, you cannot comprehend how difficult it is, especially if, as a part of a plc, you are constrained by tight operating budgets.

But, I concede, it's each to their own, & if a poor Valet service means you don't wanna play there, so be it.

Personally, I prefer the dtd solution, where there are Valets galore, coming round every 5 minutes, with plunging necklines, acres of heaving lily-white bosom in your face, & split seamed dresses. And charging £2 for a cup of offee - which is absolutely fine by me. Give the Luton players the option of having enough Valets but paying £2 for their cup of coffee or char & World War 3 would break out! Trust me, it would.

In fact, I think I'll run that past Hinge & Bracket. Just as I'm about to leave the building......

I'm not sure if you are referring to the Staff or the players there James.......Most Venues have a mixture of good & bad Staff & Patrons. We pays our money & we takes our choice. There's no such thing as the perfect poker venue. But there are a goodly few that are more than tolerable, & several that are a perfect pleasure to be at. I guess it's a matter of realistic expectations.

I feel sorry for the cardroom staff bearing the brunt of criticism which they are unable to directly influence - the valets.

Although I have to say I saw a level of rudeness I'd never seen before last night. Food is ordered by a player, and as we know the delivery can be a little slow. No problem, the food arrives and the player gets ready to eat. No cutlery.
"Excuse me" he shouts politely across the table to the valet who has moved on one table to deliver another meal. No reply. "Excuse me" he shouts again. He can't get up easily as he is wedged between players.

"In a minute, I'll be with you in a minute" replys a harrassed valet.

"It's just that you brought me my food but you haven't given me any cutlery" says the player helpfully.

"I said I'll be with you in a minute" retorts the valet, "I know I haven't given you any cutlery". The player had to sit there and waited some time while his food got cold.

So not only was she rude - you had to be there but the way she spoke to him was unbelievable, she raised her voice and was very agressive - but she wasn't actually doing her job correctly in the first place.

This set off a discussion from Hinge and Bracket as to the warmth of the food when it left the kitchen and why it was always cold by the time it got to them.  Perhaps because no one wants to deliver it? ::)
 

It's not just the Luton G that has problems with valets - at Manchester this weekend for APAT we were more likely to have seen Ricky Hatton walk in wearing a Man Utd shirt than someone taking a drink order.

Precisely, a common factor at both venues is that costs are being cut to the bone and its difficult to get good customer service in this environment

Nothing to do with the valets themselves, who do their best

years ago we occasionally used to go to one of those cheesey night clubs that has a high entry fee but has free drinks all night, the main problem was the massive crush of people at every bar meant it took all night to get served. eventually we worked out that all you had to do was bung one of the barmen a tenner and he served you first all night. so cool to stand behind a 5 deep crowd of people hold your hand up and have him passing beers over everyones heads to you.

valets in vegas meant to earn 100K+ right? maybe you guys ain't tipping enough.

Those gaffs are murder, i used to have to get carried to hospital 5am every sunday morning after free vodka all night.

I knew junior doctors actually had it easy. All that 'we have to work 100 hour weeks' moaning was just lies - they're out on the razzle all night.

i'll answer this question in about 6-12 months when i'll have visited the casino more regularly................

ooooohhhhh.........something you want to share Matt?

The Grosvenor chain baffle me to be truthful, it is like they don't want to make money. In manchester (and luton if i remember correctly) the bar is designed to cause maximum chaos. stood for ages waiting to get served by one or two staff who were clearly stressed to the max, so much so that they would dissapear for short periods to calm down from the screaming hordes. This is Saturday night btw when they had advertised for people to come and watch the hatton fight in probably one of the few places in manchester still open and they had 3 people maximum normally on or two behind the bar. We left before the end of the fight as there were so many angry drunks that when it became obvious Ricky was getting battered we didn't fancy hanging around too much longer.

Another point slightly unrelated to op but don't want to start another moaning thread. Saturday night after people started busting out of the APAT game we were looking for some Sit and goes to get started. asked the card room staff to be told there won't be any only cash tables. Des to his credit stepped in and had a quiet word and we were allowed to set some up. We proceeded to have a good laugh playing 20 pound sng's plus 2 pound rake on a self dealt table. At one point in the night we fancied another so i started another list at which point i hear some of the locals who have just came in i think "oh sit and goes, there is something new. that looks good" (or words to that effect). I come bak 5 minutes later to see if the list is filling up to see that it has been wiped from the board. I ask the guy behind the card room desk and he informs me that there will be no more sit an goes. Why? i asked "because i said so" he replied. So basically there was a table all set up with chips cards etc that lay empty all night from there on in and we would have paid them 20 quid just to sit there and they wouldn't allow it. There cash tables were oversubscribed with people waiting so it wasn't as if it was loosing rake.

Senseles and a total lack of commercial awareness in my opinion. I don't think I will be rushing back to manchester g casino for anything in the future i'm afraid.

All in good time......... ;)

Poker players are notoriously stingy tippers, hence the reason you lot dont get the level of valet service the table games get.

Having said that, i'm with Mr Pink from Reservoir Dogs when it comes to tipping.

Im going to make a suggestion to management that they should start charging 50p for tea coffee and soft drinks.

The revenue generated from this would result in lots more valets being on duty to service us more regular.

The old casino gave sandwiches away for free, but now we have to pay and they arent even as good.

50p for a tea or coffee sounds like a bargin to me

dont know if its because i am in the chair but i find valets at most venues after the first 2 hours of the comp

normally his name is KEV fae portsmouth

please dont generalise

i dont tip dealers because

1) not many places in the uk allow it
2) i never win to tip them anything anyway

i always tip valets even for free drinks etc etc and always more than i should

It's a contributing factor, its something that is so easy to sort yet is still a problem, the G has been open a while now this is pretty simple stuff.

Like i say the main reason is the attitude of some of the players.

I agree with you completly, but Grosvener management have other items on their agenda at the moment it seems, with a few of their shares being bought by a rival casino, the whole group looks like it is a sitting duck. Not that this is a reason for Manchester, but its a whole group thing.
IMO the casinos are still run as casinos and not a venue for entertainment (which is what they are trying to do slowly). They look like a company who dont know how to keep their no 1 staus as others are catching up and giving the punters what they want.

I totally agree with you regarding Manchester. It was the same at the last regional, they did not give 2 hoots about APAT and the tournament, and even one of the cardroom staff said to me he did not see the point of the tournament as quote' it does not make my card room a penny'. Is it there fault or management for not telling them what the tournament / apat is about or the staff for not finding out..

In terms of the service, well someone got something wrong, they were even 2 dealers short for it, but my biggest grind is ' staff called in sick' same reason everytime with this casino group..

APAT took 300 players to Luton last bank holiday weekend and the event was a fantastic success.  The management and staff could not have been more helpful and the venue is far and away the best venue that we have taken APAT to.  As with most other posters here, I found the valets very thin on the ground but ample breaks in the event ensured that everyone was able to see to their own needs.

 :goodpost: ;iagree;

I have mixed opinions on this sort of situation.  In one respect it would be great if communications within every company were strong enough so that the guys on the front line were aware of every initiative and the commercial reason behind those tie-ups, but in reality I would settle for staff having a clear understanding of what their jobs are; which should not be influenced by whether the event is a £10 rebuy, an APAT or a GUKPT. Certainly staff should not be having those sort of conversations with their customers.  I have to admit, the gambling industry is one that I struggle to understand the casino / customer dynamic.   It's almost as if both parties are suspicious of each other - I find it really odd.

 have to admit, the gambling industry is one that I struggle to understand the casino / customer dynamic.   It's almost as if both parties are suspicious of each other - I find it really odd.

 Aspades  Spot on they don`t and in most cases don`t seem to want to.
Cardrooms such as DtD may well serve not only to wake these sleeping giants but also make them realise that most of the suggestions made by players and dealers or staff at the sharp end never actually reach the decision makers within the companies concerned...Grosvenor is a classic example of how poor their tiered management systems are...and they are one of the better casino groups ...God help the rest!

On Sunday I played the £25 with an add on or rebuy at Stanleys in Luton............small game of 40 odd runners being well run by Simon ex the G ,free tea/soft drinks, free sandwiches in the break........ a number of faces I hadn't seen in a while because they have moved away from the G. Also the atmosphere reminded me very much of the old Grosvenor Luton............it was lovely, and no loud music. We are blessed in this country that you really can pay your money and take your choice. 

Things I liked.......
small intimate venue
no posturing by drunk young men
Free sarnies
Free tea and coffee
Good banter at the table
No session charge
Tourney ran to time

Just felt like writing something positive

So whats the short term fix

The music isnt going anywhere
they wont be employing more valets
they wont be stopping drunk people wondering around the cardroom
the food will still be cold and bad
rulings will still be bad

emigrate?

Thats 6 weeks away what can i do until then

Go and house sit /stay at Tikays..he is never there and you could reciprocate in Vegas at a later date. Play DTD Thursday through Sunday.....trot across to Walsall rest of week. SORTED

The valet who was rude to Stuart Nash on Sunday was a disgrace, i could hear her from 3 tables aways but generally the valets are ok. Don't they cover the whole  and not exclusively the card room?

Think it is all being blown out of proportion. You're average regular Luton punter doesnt spend much money in the cardoom. They pay £5-10 juice. I realise the cash game players pay more. scoff free drinks all nite, moan about bad beats, fill their plates up with the free buffet(when it's on) then moan how crap it was.

We get breaks during comps, go get a drink from the bar ffs, go during the tourney, so what if you miss a couple of hands, a lot of us in the card room (myself included) could do with the exercise rather than sitting ordering the over worked valets around, and the rudest players are the ones who dont even bother to tip them. Always something to moan about ffs, It was the tables first, then the music, the card room manger, the dealers, the colour of the decor, the funny lights on the wall, the music again, ffs its supposed to be a fun night out with the prospect of winning or losing a few quid.

From what i have heard there are things 'happening' and thats a good thing it appears. Spreading negativity about a place that on most nights is a good place to go to is never going to help it.

Im gonna do something i never thought i would do Phil. Im gonna start playing the Vic

I think your totally missing the point Vince. Ok things are happening  Alistair has given his notice but big deal they arent going to spend the money to bring in someone who can run the room properly and make it the success it should be. Festival wek was a joke this week the numbers were really bad and what response came out of the place none. They werent even bothered. My primary reason for going there is to make money, for profit and to build my bankroll. By them not doing there job properly it costs me money. Yes i am one of the mentioned cash players but do you not think i have the right to complain or the right not to take my business elsewhere if i feel im not getting treated well or even value for money. I spend £15k a year in the place on table charges and regs. I think that is enough of a spend for the casino to take effort in making me happy and ensuring i continue to attend. I do agree that poker players moan, they all do thats one thing that you will never change but there is no reason why basic requirements of poker players cannot be met. The amount of food i have seen returned in recent weeks is unforgiveable let alone the amount of time it takes to arrive or the amount of things that are unavalible. If you believe that sitting back and excepting whatever happens then things will never get any better.

Wouldn't it be ironic if in Jims blog in a few months there start to be a few moans about the food at the Rio or such like? I hope not but I wonder if card rooms are the same all over?

 

Having spent most of my working life in the "service industry"- Hotels and Taxis, i find that people generally fall into 2 categories when it comes to tipping:

1: Those that "always tip" as a matter of course (unless the service is extremely bad).

2. Those that NEVER tip regardless of the service they receive. (some of these also think its clever to try and belittle the waiter/waitress in front of friends/colleagues-obviously this makes them feel important!!! ).

Of course you have the right to moan, but doing it via Blonde isnt the place to do it. For someone like you i understand where u r coming from but the card room is made up of the average punter who wants a drink, a game of poker and a night out. The quality of the food has never been great but its a casino, if u want a nice meal then go to a restaurant. I ate at the restaurant on thursday for the first and last time. It was shit, and i let them know.

All the festivals are suffering not just Luton, didnt wallsall have one of its worst turnouts last month? There is so much competition now and choice you probably wont get the numbers you used to get.

Bring back Helen, thats what i say.

ps what happens with the players forum now? Did anyone replace Alan? Is Danish still on the forum?

The forum is a waste of time

there hasnt been a meeting for months    things like the league and the festival arent discussed with us just actioned.  The things that are discussed in the meetings are agreed but never put into place. For example do you know how much money the league generated. We asked to be given regular updates of where all the players money was going. WE were assured that this would happen and that players would know on a day to day basis.

As for the food im not talking about the restaurant im talking about food at the most basic level. Burger and chips a breakfast. If you cant get the basics right then what chance anything else

Luton choose not to run Sats for the festival cos they didnt want it busy, they choose to turn away business. I bet that didnt happen at Walsall

Whose responsibilty is it to call a meeting?

Why do they want the place quiet / turn business away?

Who does that benefit?

I asked for a meeting to be called 2 weeks before the festival  i still havent had a reply
AXXXXXXX choose to run the sats at 11pm on a Sunday night as he knew they wouldnt be busy. For 5 weeks they were scheduled and not 1 of them ran. He did this as he didnt want the room busy as he has 10 dealers and wanted the festival quiet.

shocking behaviour if true. Wouldn't it have been worth knocking on carmel's door then and asking for an explanation?

do you think it might not be true.

How many times do you think i have sat down with Carmel or with other managers and discussed the problems with the cardrooms

shocked and disappointed if its true. 1 side of the story obviously so cant comment. Dont doubt your commitment and frustration and the club, but think that that a lot of the regulars are unaware of all the probs that have been happening behind the scenes etc.

Nice blog by the way, just incase people miss ur link  ;)

Jim, l think if more people that attended the festival posted their thoughts on here instead of sitting back we would get a true representation of how non regulars found it. I know people  on here are standing up for them, APAT mainly but l can sum it up very quickly. That FESTIVAL was pants and l will not return until someone informs me of a vast improvement. The thing that stuck out for me though on Saturday, was the numbers of non poker people playing in the Casino, are they really interested in our avenue of revenue or are they concentrating on the more lucrative casual punters on the table games.

I've had discussions at Luton regarding this and the G approach (as I understand it) is that they want the card room to be a separate cost centre and run as such. That means no comped food, no dedicated valet etc etc. The added revenue that the players bring to the casino in incalcuable but this isn't being taken into account. They are looking at just what revenue the card room generates versus specific card room costs. This is never going to look as attractive when you take out the added gaming revenue the players generate. With this reduced figure is it any wonder they are not looking to invest any further?

Comment re only 10 dealers.

And why could they not take dealers from other Casino's - like they used to at fessie events?

I will leave you all to come to your own conclusion - but "the powers that be" would be a good place to start.

Tracey, I take your point re the Card Room being a seperate income - ie no special valets etc...... but if this is true, why pay so much money to have a nice big card room built? - Surely they didnt think that their current strategy would fill it did they?

I really do feel for the people working the card room (valets included) as they are taking all the heat, and seem powerless to do anything about it.

Maybe, just maybe this is why so so many staff have left ?!?!?

All grovesnor casinos the Vic excluded are no longer allowed to use external dealers except during the GUKPT festivals to limit costs.
That is why Luton had only 10 dealers avalible to them

luton is failing at all basic service levels  in the cardroom, from poor valet service, awfull food   and lack of dealers.

play table games tho, as p does, and you get a hot drinks/food  on tap.

that tells you where there v simple priorities lie  imo.

It is a bit of a paradox........UK casino.....we do not want poker players.....hang on somebody is going to open a just for poker club.......... UK casino groups say we must object.

Why???

From the way we are treated generally.....and there are exceptions.......you do not want us in your business

Oh and before i forget why is it still Novembers calendar on the website

I think to get a proper handle on the issues in the individual casinos you have to take a step back, and look at the corporate culture that allows a business to operate in a way that seems to be so "non-customer"

Rank plc, of which the Grosvenor group is a part, has been a poorly performing business for years. I used to be a professional investor in it (alongside many other businesses) and as such had access to main board managements at Rank.

These were, in my opinion, some of the least impressive boards to represent what was at the time a FTSE-100 company that I came across.

Now we have a business who's share price has suffered for years, where industry competitiors are beginning to circle the group (taking stakes recently) and which is, frankly, not going to be in the same form on a 2 year view (trophy assets, undermanaged). Indeed were one to look at the annual accounts and check out the freehold value of the properties and compare it to the current asset value of the company then an interesting story could be told. It might be argued that it is only for two reasons that the group has been allowed by the markets to survive this long.

a) the Deluxe Video duplication business was a "poison pill" the technology clearly being outmoded, and was unsellable for ages until costs fell to a level appropriate for revenue

b) the credit markets closed up earlier this year making acquisition finance more difficult for non-trade buyers

So, against that background we take a look at Rank's corporate culture. Within Grosvenor that devolves decision making responsibility down to the individual properties namely the top managers in each of the clubs. Said managers are rewarded on their overall numbers and then a bonus is paid which said manager distributes amongst his staff

So, you are a Grosvenor club manager..your focus is on..........poker or table games?

Now you are the Head of Grosvenor Poker, you have no influence over the club managers who are given enormous power with a huge financial carrot. You take the fairly obvious decision given this to keep costs low, slash marketing budgets (which has happened for 2008) and focus elsewhere.

Meanwhile elsewhere within the group Blue Sq is doing fine, it develops the GUKPT concept which works well but they don't want the success of the GUKPT to be at all affected by the traditional festivals. Online satellites to these cease, added value at club live satellites from Blue Sq ceases. No central marketing, no online marketing, no added value, gradually non series festivals suffer as the club managers aren't interested.

Now back to Luton, I will relate a serious tale from 6 weeks ago. We are halfway through the 30G league which guarantees £30,000 in the prize pool for the event this Sunday. At that point roughly £15,000 had been collected in contributions.

A club Manager asks the cardroom maanger, given the pressure they are under on costs..."can we scrap the league?" given that they will be having to add value into it! 

Meanwhile the dealers, croupiers, valets do exceptional jobs but they are horribly let down by the group culture that prevents sensible customer-focussed thinking..this permates from Head office to the clubs themselves. All the time the reward for the clubs is focussedon the bottom line and not on any issues such as customer satisfaction then the lot for poker players (facilities aside) cannot improve.

I have played at G Luton now only three times in nearly two months. Its fifteen minutes away from me. I share the concerns expressed by my fellow forum rep. I play elsewhere sometimes, much of the time I play nowhere.

I'd love to return and play the 3-4-5 times aweek I once did, but I lost the will to do so.


Meanwhile the company's website proclaims

"All of the businesses within the Rank Group Gaming Division (RGGD) are about people: both customers and employees. Our purpose is to 'put on the best game in town' and in all that we do we strive to raise our standards, make people feel special and add a touch of fun and theatre"

Yes, I laughed too.
 

I also went through the interim report.....laughed loads........the casino business really could make so much business. Also if each area of the casinos has to make a profit is that true for the whole group?? What is really happening in bingo for example.....

Tighty you and I have discussed attendance at Luton on many occassions and I have now reached the same point as you....I would rather do other things with my time or I play elsewhere.

Grosvenor really need to wake up......I dropped £100 on Sunday night. I didn't mind as I was having a good time. I was not in a Grosvenor. I think individuals within Grosvenor do a great job. I have huge reservations about the corporate ethos of the company.........but I am just a customer why would they care

the answer to this is pretty simple, tighty buys Rank out of some of the loose change under his sofa cushions, flog off the bingo crap and get me to run the rest for say 5% of profits?

sort it out son ;)

The buying of Rank and stripping out the "deadwood" WILL happen - FACT

It is just a case of WHEN.

Sooner the better IMO

I totally agree with you..

I have just read my posts from last night.  Although i stand by what i said i do wish i hadnt posted them.

I have supported Luton maybe more than any other player over the past couple years. I travel 100 miles per trip while i only live 18 miles from the vic or the gutshot. Luton does have a lot of problems but the frustrating thing for me is that its core elements have the potential to make it the best room in the country.  Ill be taking some time away from the place i guess i just need a break but I will return to the place and i will miss it when i move

Oh deary deary me. Luton G are on the back foot, so let's all join in & kick the semi-lifeless body around a bit.

Jeez guys, you are well hard to please. Yes, they have "customer-facing" issues, & the Valet service is not what it should be. It's free, mind. Their cardroom organisation, as to Satellites, etc, needs improving. But it's do-able. And the chairs are, according to one, not fit for purpose. That's subjective, with respect. And this, & that, & the other. It's amazing how these things snowball, & become self-perpetuating.

So tikay is on his "let's defend Luton hobby-horse" again. Well, yes, I am.

And why?

Lots of reasons.

1) I always tend to try & support the underdog. OK, the place needs a bit of management attention, but it's hardly life-threatening, & everything they have issues with is fixable. Have you boys always had everything your own way? I can think of far worse places to play poker, I really can, including other Venues in the same ownership.

2) It happens to be a very lucky venue for me, of that I must admit. Non-admissable evidence, OK, I agree. And I like the local clientele. Rinse, repeat.

3) I guess I'm different to most of the moaners & groaners. But I know that, if the table company is good, the craic is good, & the Tourneys are well-structured, the place is well-lit & warm, & there's a free tea, coffee & chocolate machine within 5 yards of my table (for which I don't need Valets), well, I can tolerate the minor irritations of which so many are complaining, because there are far worse things in life than having to fetch my own (completely free of charge) cuppa tea. And to be fair, those that only go there once in a blue moon don't really know the character of the place, & it's people.

For the eejit who informed me anonymously via e-Mail that I have a vested interest (via some sort of commercial relationship or other self-interest) in G-Luton, you jest, my friend. My anonymous friend, that is. I don't. Fact. I just prefer "doing" to "moaning". Luckily, because poker ain't short of the latter.

But I do shake my head in sadness when everyone piles in with their moans & groans, & yet very few of them take the time to try & deal with the problem in a constructive manner. So far as I can tell, only two folks have done this - been & chatted to Management to help identify & solve the (alleged) problems.

So, here's the deal. I can't be arsed with talking the talk, I prefer to walk the walk. I'll arrange a meeting with Luton Senior Management, & make a few suggestions as to how the "irritations" (poor valet service etc) can be addressed. I'm afraid that won't include changing the furniture, because that's just subjective, & I've sat on far worse. And I bet you - any of you, & any number of you - £50 (each) in crisp pound notes that within a month, you will see improvements. Because that's how to bring about improvements - do something constructive.

Any takers? Or you just gonna continue moaning? Go on, bet me I can't help bring about improvements within a month of sitting down & chatting to Management. Go on go on go on go on. The bet duration is one month from today - it ends January 10th 2008.

The stakes must be lodged with a mutually agreed third party. Because I expect to be paid when I win the bet. ;)

Meanwhile, I'll continue to share my "default" time between G-Luton & DTD.

Why will I continue to play at G-Luton? Because playing with nice, decent, people more than makes up for a few stones in my shoe. For me, anyway.

I must say Jim, the place was very quiet last night, & not the same without you there. Guess we'll have to get used to that soon!

For what it's worth, I'm not sure what all the fuss is about at Luton. True, they don't seem to be focusing their attentions on the cardroom, but why should they, they're a business, not a charity that has to cater for the poker community. There is a Stanley down the road and plenty of other venues in London, so if the players don't like it, they can speak with their feet. If this affects their business, then I'm sure Luton will make the changes, but just voicing your complaints on a forum rather than taking a more constructive approach and 'walking the walk', as tikay says, won't make much of a difference.

As i say Tikay  I love Luton

I feel though i have been caught up too much in the polictics of the place to be able to concentrate fully on my game and at the end of the day that is my primary reason for visiting.  I have had many meetings with both staff and management and i am aware of lots of upcoming changes. I will continue to attend Luton but I wont be there as often as in the past where else can i get a dealers choice game like the one that we sit in most evenings

p.s. i dont have a prob with the chairs

I was going to put up a big long post but I just can't be bothered.
Tikay it has all been said before.
I wish you luck in your mission.
I will continue to play there because it has always been home.

neither does tikay, his arse is never in a tourny seat long enough to work out if its comfy or not :)

I hope you suceed Tony, I really do.

But I have my doubts as to weather you will or not.

Good luck with it.

I have also been a supporter of Luton for a long time, and like you, it is a lucky venue for me.

The banter I have had there is superb.

But the time has come for me to "not attend" on days when I normally would.

It is not like this has been a recent problem, it has been ongoing since the new casino opened - and to be honest, it has just got worse. By problems I mean getting people through the doors and back playing again.

I have spoken to Alistair and Carmel about certain ways to improve the situation (imo), its not like I have not tried.

PS I to have no problem with the chairs, nor do I mind going and getting my own drinks.

You Kev are soooooooooo dead.

Oh, & by way of sticking it up you, any idea who won the Comp there last night? From a HUUUUGGGGEEEE field.

I have just read back through all the posts and i only found one person who past comment about the chairs

The room will start to get busier in the upcoming weeks but that is down to the fact that the league has now finished

I heard you came 2nd     AGAIN

Forget the chairs Jim, that's no reason not to wanna play somewhere - and I should not have included the furniture comment, but I do hear it - especially about the tables - a lot. Yes, they need a "lip" & a padded rail, but what the hell, it's hardly the end of the world. I was in Manchester G over the weekend, & they have amended the design fauilt with the tables, but I can't see them changing the Luton Tables, so it's put up or shut up.

No, I WON IT. (Technically). OK, I chopped it. And OK, the other guy got a bit more money than me. (Technically). Don't tell cyclops though, purlease.

Right, off to The Western, with Red, looking for my 3rd straight Tourney Cash.

how many entered 2?

Yep - if proof were needed that numbers are defintiely falling at Luton.... ;whistle;

and the standard obviously ;nanana; ;nanana;

In The Bellagio you can order room service in the cardroom.  With a $15 credit courtesy of the nearest friendly pit boss.  I try not to eat meals at the table just as a personal standard, but sometimes on the graveyard session, breakfast starts to beckon and if the table is playing short, I don't want it to break up.  A mobile table arrives about 20 minutes later, full place settings, absolutely everything you asked for just perfect, piping hot,  - and loads of other stuff thrown in for good measure.

Not quite comparing like with like, but after seeing how spot on the Yanks get it, it makes it painfully obvious how appalling it is over here.  I'm not picking on Luton G in particular, but as it is the subject of discussion, many of the criticisms mentioned are valid.

Jim, I have no idea how/if/when the management look after you - I suspect there are no freebies flying around.  Haider (sic?) was in the cash game the other night and even he was getting charged for drinks, despite a)presumably he shows them plenty of table game drop and b) there were plenty of other cash game players happy to buy him another  :)  For myself, I get infinitely better looked after in other casinos for my table play, so I should make a resolution to only give casino game action accordingly.  I'm not sure how much of it is the casino just being plain tight.


Me too.  I sat down at 7:30 in an empty restaurant.  I feared the worst, so only ordered 1 course, when 2, possibly 3 would have been ideal ;)  I eventually had to break up the wait staff chat to get served, despite being sat at a table 2 feet away with my menu wide open.  I'm sat there with a full tilt poker shirt on, so no prizes for guessing that I might be there for the poker, eating on my own, and working to an 8:30 deadline.  Eventually the food came out at 8:29, on the final call for the tournament.  Steak with spuds/veg that comes as standard, not a special order.  As it was served, the other customer walked out, saying "forget it' or words to that effect - and went to play poker.  I bolted mine down in 5 minutes flat and despite asking for the bill in advance to speed things up, it took ages to come, of course.  I didn't mind paying in so much as the steak was fine, but an enjoyable experience it wasn't.  For a few quid cost to the house, it wouldn't have killed them to scrub the bill - it would have been enough of a gesture for me to give them another chance.

I am not really in the loop on all the changes that are hinted at.  But perhaps as a start they could try putting a secret shopper in and see how thirsty they get!  Yes I can go to the bar myself, but that isn't really anyone's idea of a good model for a poker room is it?


Happy if there was a direct improvement in service to pay for it.  However, as soon as everyone got used to paying for it, someone upstairs would decide to "cut back" and the valets would go back to working short - but still charging.

I normally have something more positive to say, but this time I can't think of it!

The restaurant is a crying shame.

I wonder a lot when I see it empty and then people complain about standards/service why they don't outsource the whole operation on a profit share to a local restauranteur (with a theme eg Italian) and start running it as a real destination to go to


As to the chairs/tables..I have no problem with them

As to valets, its not their fault that they are over-stretched etc. I repeat they do a decent job, as do the dealers

My point remains that the essential faults arise from a non customer facing corporate and maangement culture. Luton is not alone in this, Grosvenor as a group is not alone in this, all the major casino groups display it to varying degrees

For me that is the crux of the matter. I have vented my frustration at this venue a few times in the past and not had too many agree with me but it isnt that I have any kind of axe to grind it is that this venue really has everything to make it one of the best poker rooms in the country yet just plods along with its mediocre mindset.

I agree with almost all the critisisms levelled here and would add that their ridiculous payout structures are the biggest reason I wouldnt play tourneys there on a regular basis.

What I have always enjoyed about Luton is the players are some of the friendliest I have ever played with and the banter 2nd to none, but in the grand scheme of things that isnt gonna be enough to keep people coming and putting up with the feeling that deep down they dont really want to improve owt.

to be fair, the payout structures were altered/flattened in the summer. I and Jim were consulted as part of that process

Consulted yes  in agreement no

im happy with the breakdown of how many spots get paid but as for the % breakdown i think is terrible and have been asking for this to be changed for weeks

This is all good ammo, & I see it as a personal challenge to help lobby for some improvement.

I bet we can remove some of these little niggles.

Personally, I can live with them, as they are minor irritants in the grand scheme of things. I do happen to be very tolerant, or as Hinge & Bracket put it last week (mid-moan of course), "tikay puts up with anything". Which ain't strictly true, but when it comes to minnie-moanie niggles, well, yes, I'm pretty tolerant. (Except, oddly, of moaning minnies). Which I take as a good thing, & others see as weakness. Hey-ho!

OK, the work starts Wednesday. I shall report back.

Suggestions please, then, for the % payout structure you think would be reasonable. And, of course, therein lies the rub - as most will disagree on this matter......!

can you mention the toilet paper please tikay, not as soft as im used to at home and a different colour too. (pre wipe of course)

Whats wrong with the prize structure? Thought it was adjusted after consultation.. NO?

Snoops, with all respect that is a pretty daft post.

Why would a business spend fortunes creating a class casino and poker room and then not do its best to provide good service and then say'If you dont like it go somewhere else'

Of course they are a business and not a charity that caters to the poker community, why would any sane business not cater for its clientele? Why open up a  grand poker room and not staff it properly? Why open up a poker room and not have sensible payout structures? Why open up a poker room and let it just rot away without trying to put things right?

These things are not 'catering for the poker community', they are basic good sense business procedures yet you indicate that players should just put up with it or go somewhere else.

Reading between the lines  most people are frustrated more than angry because it could be the best but isnt even trying to be good.

As for making changes if it is affecting their business, it clearly has affected it and they clearly havent done anything about it and your last line about voicing complaints on a forum and not doing owt about it is in my view a very strange thing for someone so closely connected to a greeat forum to say, that IS what forums are for, we are supposed to discuss poker things here, good and bad.

can you NOT tamper with the hand driers in the gents though, i always take my wet laundry into the casino and dry them under the jet engines :D

If that is the case then thats a good step forward. What are the payout structures now Rich?

743. (Approx).

I think it was Red Dog that once suggested that live rooms should take a look at online payout structures and use those, I agree with that.

7 +  4 + 3 = 14 then ?

Hold up, let's get this right. There is something in G-Luton which is good? Careful Kev, you'll get lynched saying such things.

I must confess, I do find those hand-dryers bloody annoying - they are so frigging loud!

Enough, stop taking the Michael. There were - get this - 31. And I whopped the lot. Well, most of the lot.

There are a lot of things that are good in the poker room but as Bill Parcells said to Tony Romo when he gave him his first start for the Dallas Cowboys 'Dont let good enough be good enough'

got heads up and lost to a man half his age.

WP Dicky Lynch.

My problem with the payout structure isnt the usual is too top heavy or its too flat
my problem is the increases between the levels

example being during the festival the £100 roe   7 places got paid as follows

2,410
1,380
1,040
   830
   620
   410
   210

Each place increases by £200 allowing for rounding until you get to 2nd place    each place should get more of an increase than the place before

OK, so make a suggestion then. Say, 60 runners, and a £100 Freezeout.

He BEGGED me to chop it up.........

37%
22%
15%
11%
8%
7%

That looks about right for me   only paying top 6 so 10% of the field  very similar to pokerstars but a little less top heavy

i copied it from pokerstars horse payout they pay 8 with over 56 though

a very quick effort.

6k pool

1900 30%
1400 24%
1000 16%
700 11%
500 8%
300 5%
200 3%

% not quite right as I havent added the bits but you get the drift

I have used 7 places as I think that was how manyy they paid for a similar comp the last time I was there.

For me 37% is too much at the top.

your missing 3% bobby so i would make it 5% for 7th and 6% for 6th

as i said Iron , the % i have quoted isnt rounded up spot on

Yep, that's what I said, and I'm sticking by it. Have a look at the payout structure on PokerStars, it's as close to perfect as you will ever get.

( In my, & a few 100,000 others humble opinion, of course).

and, if you mention PokerStars payouts to a Grosvenor cardroom manager, they look at you as if you are completely barmy!

I know, I've done it


to repeat the Luton payout structures are far flatter than they used to be. Not perfect, still some things I would like to see different, but a lot better than as recent as a year ago

always reminds me of that classic scene in phoenix nights when brian is telling jerry a story in the gents about hs exploits with the opposite sex, using all sorts of hand movements to tell his story whilst the hand dryer is booming away.
as the dryer stops brian finishes the last line of the story and his final words are "covered in piss"

absolute classic  rotflmfao

for those of you who have never watched phoenix nights or just dont get it im sorry lol

dont f&ing tell them they are pokerstars payouts


live cardroom managers want a headline sum for paying out so it attracts people who dont understand the concept of bankroll

and are more inclined to gamble

after cashing the throw 50% away on the magic wheel of doom


"wow for £100 i could win £5000" sounds better than £3000

Tikay, what exactly is the Grand scheme of things at Luton. From what l witnessed it did not involve a poker friendly/focused environment. You say that you are tolerant to these little things, but surely you are seen as an Ambassador for Poker Players by many of these casinos brought about by your television time, blonde etc. Is this not a bad thing, as your actions or words are inadvertently informing these people that things aren't to bad and can be easily rectified. I think it will take a lot longer than 1 month to change the direction Luton is going, which is why l will take you up on your £50 bet. Will be at dt (http://www.dtdpoker.com/aff/BlonditesDownload)d (http://www.dtdpoker.com/aff/BlonditesDownload) on Thursday, put it on deposit at cash desk if allowed. Who will judge the changes?

My point is that you have to be active in your protests not just write about on it on a forum. As tikay said, only two people have actually approached the powers that be to voice their concerns. If people bombard the place with actual complaints, then maybe they'll be more likely to do something about it. Why doesn't someone print this out and hand it to Carmel, or even send it to a big wig? Maybe everyone could write a letter to the powers that be. You have to make some noise, surely? It seems silly to me that we can say how much we dislike a level of service and then keep on turning up.

Looking at the numbers of their daily comps, they seem to be relatively well attended, and I assume the house games are raking it in, so don't be surprised if they don't suddenly spark into action when they receive few complaints, get decent numbers and continue to thicken the wallet of Mr Grosvenor. In fact, the last time I was there they had reached full capacity and there was a long queue waiting outside.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the poker community don't bring too much income for the casino when compared to the house game clientelle. With the clubs and pubs nearby, it would seem that this is the market that Luton have decided to focus their attentions on, and, as a result, the cardroom has suffered. However, as much as I dislike it, if this is making them money, then it's hard to criticise because at the end of the day they are business, and making money is their priority.

The Beagle ducks in advance.  ;angel;

Posted by Snoops
[/quote]Correct me if I'm wrong, but the poker community don't bring too much income for the casino [/quote]

Would have to disagree mate, lots of poker players drop a chunk at the tables and these festivals are what brings in the fillet beef of punters. Why else do you think they run them Snoops, for the benifit of us poor poker players!

Some good points for sure.

The be all and end all for that Casino is to increase turnover on the table games, whether we like it or not. To do that they should be trying to attract people through the door for ALL their offerings, for every person that eats in the casino a % will play the tables, so you would expect them to make the restaurant attractive to eat in and provide good service.

The poker room will make good money from cash tables  IF the cash games play on a regular basis, by having such poor service and structure they are harming the take from these cash games because less players are playing, so less players equals less rake and just as important less players equals less potential roulette and blackjack players. So having a badly run poker room directly harms the table game take. Payout structures should be flatter on the principal that you want the money spread a little thinner, more people make a little more, more people have a little more to spend on table games and the cash games and all future games.

Its a kinda never ending circle, but the one driving factor is the people coming thru the door have to be catered for and above all enjoy it, by having the poker room badly run they are shooting themselves in the foot on all fronts.

where do we get the figure only 2 people have voiced there concerns?

i personally had a chat with carmel last week with my concerns and also a quiet chat with alistair and have also spoken to martin in the past when concern regards the poker room.

just because we dont inform tikay or snoopy that we have done this doesnt mean that only 2 people have voiced concerns to the powers that be.

good luck in your quest tony i hope you suceed.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the poker community don't bring too much income for the casino [/quote]

Would have to disagree mate, lots of poker players drop a chunk at the tables and these festivals are what brings in the fillet beef of punters. Why else do you think they run them Snoops, for the benifit of us poor poker players!
[/quote]

Well, I do agree that is odd that they don't make a big fuss of their festivals with satellites, advertising, etc, as these events can bring in some big house game players if enough buzz is created.

I meant "in the Grand Scheme of Life" rather than Luton specifically, Mick, poker is, after all's said & done, an irrelevance in the real world.

I'm not sure how I'm seen by others, & I certainly don't set myself up as an Ambassador for poker, but I do hate moaning without doing anything, so I'm gonna give it a go.

The Bet is on. I'm not fussed who judges it - you name someone to judge. The criteria is "has the Cardroom reasonably improved?".

I don't thnk it's right to lodge the stakes at DTD - that'd be a little indelicate! - but any reasonable stakeholder is OK by me.

OK, I stand corrected, only 2 people that I know of have seriously negotiated these issues with G-Luton. If there are more, fine, I accept that.

good luck in your quest tony i hope you suceed.

Oh, I will!

Tony, as l know you from Gala Notts and other venues on the circuit l know you are very genuine and just an oul fish from the Midlands that frequently misreads  3h 5d  as  Qh Qs, and l know you are very modest but surely you must be aware that your face stands out as one of the daddies (granda's) of European Poker. If you can use this to rectify the problems at Luton and steer them in the right direction it would be fantastic and although l think you will make an impression, l think you will have to grow a grey beard and hair, wear a white robe and call yourself Gandalf the Grey to do it in a month.

As a matter of fact l can imagine you riding into Luton on a white stallion, at least you would have a comfortable seat unlike the Primary School seats in Lutons card room.

Tikay arrives in Luton for his meeting with Carmel

Bloody hell he looks years younger than the last time we met.......

decades

Classic Vince.....

rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao rotflmfao

Neverendaments.

Snoops - this is quite wrong!

The numbers have been falling steadily since the opening - and why? because people have been voting with their feet m8.

As for only 2 people approaching management, again this is incorrect. I know many people who have voiced their concerns AND suggestions many many times.

every place's numbers are dwindling tho, not just luton.

look at the club in walthamstow 123 runners 8 weeks ago, same comp last night same gtd prize pool 62 runners. It cant all be down to the way its run.

This is true Vince, but you know that people are staying away because of the problems.

and the league contributions.

everyone hates them but everyone that qualified will turn up on sunday, unless they have a prior arrangement that they cant get out of..

When compared to to other cardrooms across the country, Luton receive strong attendances.

Of course they will Vinny  its there money on offer   why wouldnt they turn up

What time does it start on Sunday

I just looked on line and it is still showing Novembers schedule. There is no excuse it is now December 12th!!!!! This is a business???
Now I am not sure if I am complaining or airing a genuine concern but I will be there to try and get some of my contribution back. Two people have raised issues Snoop?........I don't think so.

If I am sticking the boot in Mr. Tikay it is because I am not a casual attendee. I do occassionally play the tables and this thread has just left me wondering why I do not follow the beagles advice and vote with my feet. The answer is because I am living the dream that it might get better, oh and some of the best poker company can be found there.

3pm on Sunday I THINK. I say I think becuase when in last week it was a guess on their part

The Spoils of war 64 runner consolation (those who lose their first HU match) shootout is an evening comp. I'll be able to make that but cannot do the afternoon

Just a thought, but has anyone linked the falling numbers to the time of year ?

maybe, just maybe people who play poker as a hobby have other priorities for their money  at this time of year.

Kev, Luton was busy last year, and the year before etc... at this time of year.

fyp

The League Contributions? These will not happen again at Luton. I have the categoric assurance of Management that this is the case.

So that's another excuse not to attend booted into touch......

I had planned to play this, especially as I have contributed a great deal of money - against my will, I hasten to add - to the Pool.

I heard on Monday that the Structiure for the Heads Up Comp on Sunday is 2,000 starting Chips, & 100-200 Opening Blinds. Certain that this was incorrect, I asked for confirmation of this fact, but failed to receive a clear reply, the only response being "yes, I think that's correct, 2,000 & 100-200".

In the absence of clear knowledge of Sunday's Structure, & the apparent lack of interest or knowledge as to what it is, I now plan NOT to play it, & instead play the £200 at DTD. So the money I contributed has been wholly lost.

If I can find out confirmation of the actual structure for Sunday, I'll Post it on blonde, but my own decision is made as to this Sunday - I'm going to DTD.

Good luck with your quest down at Luton, tikay. I would be wonderful to see that cardroom blossom as the venue, in my opinion, is perfect.

Lol plenty of play in that, with that structure I might even be +EV in a heads up game which is unheard of.

you need to win 8x a 10x bb one move heads up crap shoots for £10,000 then.....

pretty clueless structures, but there you go

anyone know how much added value they had to put in to reach the £30k pool? I can't find out/they won't/can't tell me

i might even be -ev and thats with tikay in the draw

Nina told me on Sunday it was 25/50.

its 100 200 and u take your chips forward to the next match so you will have 4k for the 2nd match, 8k for the 3rd match 16k for the 4th and so on.

That's premature Rich, I could not get confirmation of the Structure when I asked on Monday. As I like to plan ahead, & I can't clarify the Luton Structure, I've decided not to play the Event now. But I'll be back there on Monday for their "regular" Monday Comp, especially as the League Contributions are now history. (Due to players lobbying Management).

How can u play in the evening comp? its only for people who lose their first hu match..... u wont be there so u lose ur place right?

Was also told that as soon as the first 8 players get knocked out then the will make up the 1 st shootout table so that people dont have to hang around for hours.

Don't worry snoops, it's nailed on, the "silly irritations" can & will be addressed. I'm 100% confident of that. There was only one taker for my offer of a £50 Bet, (amazing when there was so much moaning going off) but he's already as good as lost his money.

But will the Moaners & Whingers ever be silenced? That's also a sure fire thing - they won't. Some folks just love to moan, they don't know when they are well off. Rob Yong has got that situation nicely summed up!

Anyone remember what Harold MacMillan said?

You automatically get £50 even if you don't turn up so you can collect your winnings refund of some of your contribution on Monday!

"indeed let us be frank about it - most of our people have never had it so good."

"Where's the fecking valet?"

Correct, Kev gets it spot on. That was a long time ago, but it's even more so today. We have never had it so good. The shame is, few realise that.

Many have said in this thread that the management have already promised changes and that they are about to be implemented, so where does this offer of a bet stand?
I think you need to get something specific changed, something they have not already agreed to otherwise you can't actually lose can you?

I think you've either qualified or you haven't as I understand it. It's not like the old league where you could wait and if someone didn't turn up you would go up a place and potentially play. All players get £50 for being in the heads up and if they loose they still get £50 and a the shootout game. If some people don't turn up for the heads up the shoot out should be interesting......

I was told no-shows get their £50 and a seat in the shootout. my opponent in the HU would get a bye.

will  check tonight.. Who's going 2nite?

I have the boy Rookie and his good lady Skrikera coming to Portsmouth for a spot of bowling and a bite to eat ... so he will be missing.

its rooks and me versus Ginger and Skrikera at 10 pin ... easy victory for the lads OBV.

I will not be there

BUT if anyone can clarify the structure of the heads up.

2000 starting chips and 100 200 blinds is quite frankly a joke!!

I have been assured by Alistair all along that the heads up would be a good structure and not a crapshoot.

PLEASE PLEASE someone tell me the "2000 starting stack and 100 200 blinds is a mistake?!?"

I was definitely told by Nina it was 25/50 but it will get checked.

So... I've qualified for the heads-up this Sunday = £50 guaranteed.

If I lose my first heads-up match, I go through to a shootout comp for...???

(Apologies, but I can't be arsed to try and search for the original post about how the Luton 30G league thingy works...)

Here is what I consider to be a good structure for heads up comp

Blind Structure

Players start each match with 20,000

Level 1. 100 – 200
Level 2. 150 – 300
Level 3. 200 – 400
Level 4. 300 – 600
Level 5. 400 – 800
Level 6. 500 – 1000

Each level lasts 30 minutes, blinds freeze at level 6

This is the structure of the world heads up championship.

So even if it is 25/50 Tracey,,,, 2000 starting chips is just not enough imo.

if he makes it mate the daft bastard just rung me and told me hes put £12 of petrol into lings diesel car !!!

they have landed ... the car made it.

i agree paul but its hardly the world heads up championship now is it lol  rotflmfao

lets hope it gets back to!! have fun  ;D

No, I know Paul

The structure could never be THAT good (as it runs over 3 days)

BUT you must admit 2000 starting and blinds 25/50 (or 100/200) is a far cry from that.

I am going to speak to Alistair tonight to see what can be done.

Sunday is Alistairs last ever shift.  Bear that in mind.

no mate joking aside its an absolute disgrace.

oops better watch what il say otherwise il have the antiwhinge police on my back  ;nanana;


people are gonna be afraid to voice opinions on here or state facts soon thru fear of upsetting them  ;hide;

Paul

When have you ever known me to be afraid to voice my opinion?!?

lol

a man after my own heart lol

Vince, on that basis, the final will be played with 128k each!! lol

Like I said, I will speak to Alistair tomorrow (as he is not working tonight) and see what can be done.

This is from another thread but l thought it was relevant to this one!

Quote from: snoopy1239 on Today at 05:56:38 pm
However, I do agree with what Jon says. dtd opening opening seems to have resulted in many folk taking digs at the other venues and using dtd to do so. This, in my opinion, is unfair, as there are many casinos across the country where the staff work effortlessly hard in their respective cardrooms.


Snoops mate, l am not being awkward here mate but is this a post for the sake of posting. That is NOT the case, many people who have made statements about LUTON have yet to visit D.T.D and frankly l have been easy on them. The place has turned into an incompetent dump, wether that is the the result of the GUKPT , the staff or what l don't know. I put up a thread asking for opinions and the results of that have been evident that it has gone to the dogs. As Kim Costa said to me the other night "the casinos have sh1t on Poker Players for years"!

blinds structure for the heads up not yet decided. I put the case tonight for something sensible to Adrain, who's a good guy. Actually they could do a lot worse than him..........

Shootout begins at 8pm for the 64 first round losers

whoa now thats way OTT.

The place is stunning, hardly a dump.

Incompetence? Nope, the staff are extremely competent..its the strategy and direction that I beleive could be markedly improved

I couldnt agree more Richard

waiting for the return of the "luton saviour" lol he must be still in so must have been a very deepstack heads up!

Something like 128k each? lol

spoke to kalam and adrian tonight, both good guys but both had little or no info .Kalam's response was 'I dont know, phone Alistair tomorrow' It appers that Alistairs explanation of how it will be structured is wrong. In fact with 3 days to go no one at Luton seems to know what its gonna be. How can this be? I'm disappointed to be honest, i have spent the past week sort of defending Luton on here, and i stand by that. But for this situation to be allowed is ridiculous. No one as far as i'm aware has recieved any OFFICIAL confirmation that hey have qualified, ie an e-mail or text and its left to the staff to go round and with a print off and tick who they have told.

What i would like to know is this. What is Carmel's role in the cardroom. She is never in there, and who is going to replace Alistair. Do any of the current staff want to replace Alistair? Who makes the deision?

All the info i have had from Alistair so far is wrong ie the structure of the HU comp & The spoils of war tourny. Not good enough really from Luton G.

[quote author=celtic link=topic=29479.msg607371#msg607371 date=

What i would like to know is this. What is Carmel's role in the cardroom. She is never in there, and who is going to replace Alistair. Do any of the current staff want to replace Alistair? Who makes the decision?

i dont think any of the current staff are good enough for the position imo and as nice a guy as alistair is (and i think hes a truely nice guy with his heart in the right place)i dont think he is or was good enough for the position either imo.

lets be honest though its not that hard to run poker tournaments or a cardroom successfully it just takes a little common sense, good planning and customer service.

anyway vinnie how many runners tonight??

He's moving to a job at dtd, dont know in what capacity but am sure Rob or his staff wouldnt have employed him if they felt he wasn't any good so dont really know why he gets a lot of stick.

I'd like to do it. Wouldn't get it but never mind.

Should be an interesting few weeks ahead.

5 tables 45 approx i think. Played like a donk against tracey despite her 'neon tell' that she had AA or KK. NIce crowd there tonight.

not giving him stick mate as i said i like the guy but being honest and imo i think the jobs to big for him.

maybe robs sees useing him in a different capacity as i think alistair has a lot to offer a cardroom but not necessarily the main mans job.

45 isnt bad in todays climate i suppose though not deserving of a well thought out structured tournament that weds nite is.

Wasnt referring to ur comment Paul, generally at Luton if anything doesnt go smoothly u hear lots of mutterings about Alistair. But he must be guided by rules made above him??? This I dont know. He will be free to post on here after Sunday so maybe he can enlighten us?

lets hope so. must be hard when your hands are tied by the beaurocracy  sp?  above you

Simon Trumper has given him a job as a dealer

cheers Jim.

U planning a leaving drink or anything, know its early but nice to send you off in style. Not that i'm inviting myself or anything.......

I vote for bringing back Dena.

I actually like the sound of that for a HU comp, it is a 1 day affair i take it.

Start as a crap shoot and work towards a decent structure.

Starting deep will just mean it never ends in time.

James, so you think that carrying foward your chips will mean it ends in one day?

No i was referring to the concept of getting more play in later rounds.

This is getting better and better......not only am I guaranteed money.........but a strong likelihood of a bye......more money.........half the field do notr turn up.........better chance of even more money......crapshoot if i actually have to play somebody.....50/50 better odds than normal........I shall be there smiling, chatting and drinking lemon tea please do not feel compelled to join me

Ah ok, yes I agree with you there.

Pete I am not going to tell you because I do not want you to turn up

Sorry saint Tikay but we have had it so good.............actually we used to have it better. At the old venue the only whinge I can honestly remember is that the comps did not start on time. I being the lardy tardy bloke I am did not mind.
Did I get the occassional bar meal voucher.....yes
Was the banter as good........yes
Was the valet service good...........yes
Was it mainly self deal....yes
Did it matter.........no
Was there loud music..no
Was the cardroom integral to the casino..........yes
Was it cramped............ yes
Was the walk to car park unpleasant......yes
Did festival players complain whenever they visited the old venue.......yes

Hmmmm......so it wasn't perfect but it was a shed load better than it is right now at the G...........takes off rose coloured spectacles

Winkie

"65th to 128th recieve £50 and entry into a £2,500 prize pool ( G Casino providing the prize) 64 runner 8 table shootout including bounties and a first prize of £700"

As I said, told last night it starts at 8pm, but best to double check that first I would think before setting off!


As to new cardroom manager, I predict Adrian. That would be a good move I feel.

Dear anonymous e-mailer, "GladysKnight@hotmail.com"

Thank you for your comments, though they could have been made without the profanities. I suggest you read the whole thread before writing next time. Happy Christmas on the Midnight train to Georgia,

Regards

"A fucking management stooge"

ooooohh tighty, looks like you got on Gladys' pips !!

taking the pips certainly

off to Google her Greatest Hits for more puntastic comments

Best thing that ever happened to me was realising I've got to use my imagination to Help me make it through the night.

Be strong Tighty cos Neither one of us, wants to be the first to say goodbye.

I never knew they did the original version of "I heard it through the Grapevine"


which is fairly accurate when it comes to the subject of this thread

Don't take it so bad Tighty, I heard it through the grapevine that It's not the end of the road for Luton.
Look forward to next week at DTD when one is will be saying help me make it through the night
 

speak for yourself

Goodbye.

Classy jackets

But it wasn't anonymous - it was Gladys Knight. She even used her real email address.

*goes off to edit her Wikipedia entry to include info about her preference for Dealer's Choice cash games in the Bedfordshire area*

Don't tell Tikay - he'll be trying to book her for the Sky open.........

the email address used added a few numbers too which I left out..please don't go emailing Gladys!!

Hear she's loose aggressive these days

Maybe if she did a turn at the G fewer players would complain about the music.

They'd still complain.

3pm, just out of bed here, & I have to be in South London for the Sky (http://www.skypoker.com/poker/sky_lobby?aff=1062) Poker (http://www.skypoker.com/poker/sky_lobby?aff=1062) Chrissie Bash tonight, so I gotta be brief.

I could not find anyone in Luton last night with whom to discuss the "issues", the protocol here would be to speak to Nina first, & she was absent, & I don't believe Carmel or Martin were there either.

I asked two Staff for the Structure of the Heads Up thing on Sunday, & neither knew.

Eventually, I spoke to Adrian, (who's top-notch) & asked him to find out two things.....

1) The Structure for the Heads Up Bash. He said they were working on a structure which enabled more play the deeper it went, but did not have any details.

2) I requested to know the total amount accumulated in the "League Contribution". Details were not to hand.

If I hear further, I'll let you know.

I won't be there tonight, as I'm at the Sky Bash, & I'm doing the Show tomorrow (Friday), so if I do go tomorrow (doubtful), it won't be until very late.

I am in London (The Vic) with APAT on Saturday, then planning to head home, & playing dt (http://www.dtdpoker.com/aff/BlonditesDownload)d (http://www.dtdpoker.com/aff/BlonditesDownload) on Sunday, so I may not be back at Luton until Monday earliest.

The Comp had about 40 runners I believe, & there was a lovely atmo there, lots of regulars, Tracey (http://www.blondepoker.com/blondepedia/blondepedia_view_player.php?player_id=444) Dell (http://www.blondepoker.com/blondepedia/blondepedia_view_player.php?player_id=444) cashed, with Dick Lynch yet again getting Heads Up, Celtic, Tighty, Lalit, Nav & me never cashed, sigh. The Dealers Choice Game ran all night with a fulll table, & ditto the Hold 'Em Cash.

The Female half of Hinge & Bracket (the other half was AWOL) complained about the valets, dealers, tables, chairs, music, M1 widening, lack of gritters, traffic jams, global warming, Ryanair, virgi (http://travis.bosscasinos.com/re.asp?name=POK&camp=REF5111_0&go=http%3a%2f%2fwww.virginpoker.com)n (http://travis.bosscasinos.com/re.asp?name=POK&camp=REF5111_0&go=http%3a%2f%2fwww.virginpoker.com) Airlines, Tuesday's, Thursdays, Christmas, & cats, but was otherwise happy & content.

I will keep you informed.

Who are Hinge and Bracket?

Female Impersonators who do a double act on stage..one at the piano, one standing, both singing

Nowadays they are semi-retired and play recreational poker inbetween pantos and summer seasons

so basically tony the same answers that everyone else got when they asked. no answers!!


looks like early in the bet slick kid looks favourite to me

That's not really them though is it? I thought we were just taking the mick?

Of course its them? didn't you know?

Brackett is not around this month much, he's one of the Ugly Sisters In Cinderella in the Hatfield Galleria Playhouse if I remember what he said correctly

Having never played at the new Luton casino I cant say for sure but judging by TK's description they sound vaguely familiar and I would hazard a guess at Shirley Lewis & Murray Brown.

Stop it Tighty - I still remember the 'Dave Clarke 5' - although this one was close.....

 :)up ;applause;

What about the HESS?

GFY - they were a great group...... ::)

Nightrider is coming back apparantly - no sign of the hairy chested one though.....

In rehab again

Oh ye of little faith.......

Anyone remember the momentous quotation by Calvin Coolidge, when he was President of the United States? I've lived my life by that quote. Who can quote it?

Nothing in this world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing is more common than unsuccessful people with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent. The slogan "press on" has solved and always will solve the problems of the human race”

I forgot to add, by the way, that on Wednesday, with about 40 folks in the Tourney, & 1 or 2 Cash Tables on the go, there were THREE Valets assigned to the Cardroom, & drinks & service were plentiful the entire night.

Anyone who complained about the sparse Valet Service on Wednesday is being wholly unreasonable. But nobody did, (except Bracket) because it was excellent. And, take note, the drinks are free.

Spot on! It was on a plaque on the wall behind the desk in my office for 30 years.

The right thing to do never requires any subterfuge, it is always simple and direct. - obvioulsy not a fan of the CIA then?

Four-fifths of all our troubles would disappear, if we would only sit down and keep still. - try telling Garry (http://www.blondepoker.com/blondepedia/blondepedia_view_player.php?player_id=146) Bush (http://www.blondepoker.com/blondepedia/blondepedia_view_player.php?player_id=146) that - nice to see him on Wednesday by the way.
 ;D

And yes - the Valet service was fantastic on Wednesday - Rose was in and was a whirling dervish.

Yup, it was great to see "Whacker" Bush at Luton on Wednesday. Slowly, the faces are returning to Luton. Garry Bush is huge fun, & I much admire him. Hard to remember, but he was European Player of the Year (admittedly in odd circumstances) a few years back, & played all the big Events. But eventually he clicked on to the fact that unless Sponsored, nobody can play the Major Tourney Circuit & expect to make a profit, or even a living. Except, of course, the nippers.

hello all.
I am on a weeks holiday at the moment and it has been quite depressing reading what everyone has to say about Luton.
I cant even defend it at the moment either.[which is what i allways do i know] the point is most of the things you are saying are valid.
As most of you know Sunday will be Alister's last day and i for one will miss him.I have spoke to Carmel about replacing him and i as yet do not know who this will be, but it will be someone from outside.
I as you know am only part time as this suits my personal life and this will not change.I have asked for someone with far more knowledge of running a cardroom than me, because there are many things that need to be sorted.
As for the HU tourney on Sunday as i understand it..........the draw will take place on the day and work like a pyramid

 Ad Ac  Kc Kh   Qh Qs   Jh Js

       Ad Kc             Qs Jh

                 Kc Qs    i hope this sorts of makes sense.If your opponent is not in on the day then you will automatically win that round and go on to the next player who is next to you in the pyramid.

As for the MONEY i know that the casino is adding around 6 thousand pounds so the players contribution was around 24 thousand.EVERY PLAYER THAT HAS QUALIFIED WINS AT LEAST £50.

I have a lot to do when i get back and i know it is going to be hard going for a while but things will get better i promise please don't give up on us just yet.I am only still there for you [it`s definatly not the money] i look forward to going to work, just because the players are some of the nicest guys and gals that you could ever wish to meet.

Keeping the faith and looking forward to my return love ya lots Nina.xx 

to be clear Nina, you've never been the problem!

any chance you can get the thread to the powers that be, so they can see the strength of feeling? a lot of people want to support the room but as you can see frustration is rife.

Nina, the complaints were NEVER about you .

See you Sunday

Nina - I don't think it's all that bad - I really don't. Remember that when you're reading this thread it's more than one person saying the same thing - but it's the same thing - it's not like everyone has all completely different moans.

There is a thing called the pareto law - not sure if I've spelt it right - I use it a lot in life - the 80/20 rule. Sort out the 20% most important and the other 80% tends to disappear or sort itself out on its own - that type of thing.

80% of the moans will come from 20% of your customers.

80% of our poker games will be played in 20% of the available venues.

Sort out the 20% which is the mainstay of the moans and the other 80% will be fine.

Don't be dis-heartened, it's better to have an opportunity to plug a few holes publicly than leak players and don't know why.

See you next week x x x x

Thanks Nina. With that attitude, we can't fail. I know how passionate you are, & I understand the problems (all of them easily fixed), so I know how awful it must be when you are described as an "incompetent dump" & "pants". Nothing is further from the truth, & once a few niggles are sorted - mainly communication - Luton wll be tickety-boo, & those that don't like it can do the other thing. Remember, some of those that are throwng stones at Luton right now are the same people who were lobbing stones at DTD a few months back!

Going back to communication, please be aware that there has still been no announcement of the Structure for Sunday's Heads-Up Challenge, foir which, according to you, the Players have contributed £24,000. As an aside, I think it's horrendous that the players - without their consent - contributed £24,000, & the Venue have only added £6,000. Pity we were never infomed of that earlier, as hell would have been let loose......!That's bang out of order, but thankfully, it's history now, as I've been categorically assured that the deductions from Prize Pools affair will never, ever, happen again at Luton.

You will continue to have the support of blonde, & myself, & if we can help in any way - for example, by handling for you - completely free of charge - "player communication", just say the word, & blonde will assist.

I hope Sunday goes well, good luck!

and also proves you cant mix being a mad gambler with playing poker!

 ;iagree;

as you can see in my opening post on the "say something nice about the g casino thread"

i to will miss alistair, a very helpful guy who no matter how busy still found time to get us chips and cards whenever we wanted to play an on the spot sit and go.

if you do read this alistair and i dont see you before sunday to say it to you face i wish you all the best  ;goodluck;

tell you how the g can solve its valet problems in one easy measure.

headhunt steve the chinese guy from the stanleys up the road, he could valet on his own the guys different gravy!

Thanks Paul, but from what I saw on Wednesday, they've already solved them.

At weekends, when "the pit" is choc-a-bloc, we can't expect the same level of service, but we can live with that. We are getting free drinks all night, so I don't think we can complain too much.

As to the guy at Stanley's Luton, yeah, I agree, he's the business, but such staff are far & few between.

and as for a replacement for alistair they need to look no further than stanleys as well , James has done a fantastic job there with limited support from above. very well structured tournaments.

though i think James left the g a few years back not on the best of terms so cant see it happening.

 :o :o :o

not a hope

They have the right people there to run the cardroom. They just need to be empowered. Probably need a new leader, someone with clout and a clue.

never suggested otherwise though i do think a few of the newer faces are being asked to run tournaments when they aren't capable at the moment due to training issues.

i know that tighty but dont you think James could do a good job there?

James and I are not always on the right foot with each other

but, technically wise, he knows the job yes

theres only 1 other person i know better suited to the job and thats me !

but i doubt the salaries enough for myself or anyone else suitable enough to play red adair!

I know the salary on offer

Lets just say it isn't hugely competitive!

exactly but i would do it for nothing (and im sure many others would) to see the cardroom thrive again, luton g should be the finest cardroom in the country it has the potential!

i do find it really sad that everyone is using this thread as a lets belittle luton as much as possible.......i agree there have been lots of problems lately but do we really think that a salg off all and everyone at g casino will help???
yes valets are sparce but one comment i saw earlier sums it up-if u tip u get served.....simple!
my main argument would be the lack of management cover-carmel is"poker room manager"-alistair never was.........when was the last time carmel was involved with the poker room?
imo adrian would be a good choice to replace alistair as card room supervisor(not manager), but will he get the support he need-doubtful.........but i know one thing if we dont support whoever it is then this cardrooms gonna go from bad to worse.
i havent been there because of the poker league so have voted with my feet, altho as two faced as it sounds i will be there today as somehow i qualified for something i disagree with but im not one for looking a gifthorse in the mouth!
ive been one of the cowardly snipers lately but have decided that im now gonna try and get luton back to where it should be, we've got a great crowd down there(one major exception but i wont get into that!) and have had some major laughs in recent times so come on luton lets sort this out and be number one again!!!!

i do find it really sad that everyone is using this thread as a lets belittle luton as much as possible

Everyone?

sorry not everyone-jumped on my high horse and included everyone!

Haha! No problem  ;)

Original post asked for us to give our opinions, i think its the venue that has problems rather than the posters on the forum, given that a lot of the complaints are held by many a different poster.

u couldnt jump on a low horse let alone a high one shorty boy!!!

Ladies and gentlemen,

I have just finished my last shift at the G Luton (All 18 hours of it, boy it was a marathon) and then i decided to read this thread that i had heard so much about, that was a mistake cos 2 hours later here i am. I would love to post a sweeping response but i must sleep off the shift first cos i'm knackered. Rest assured in the morning/afternoon... or possible the evening when i get up i will post, but not on this thread. I will start a new one as i have many things i wish to say and people to thank.

The only thing i will say tonight is .....


 ;applause; ;applause; ;applause; ;applause; Congrats to M3boy on winning The Final Showdown, well done mate.  ;applause; ;applause; ;applause; ;applause;

Good night and Good Luck, i'll speak to you later

Alastair (Very Recently Ex G Casino Luton Supervisor)

From all I've read, you will be greatly missed Alastair......all the very best in you're new job!


Nice one Paul !....well played  ;applause; ;applause;

I agree.

Won't miss that daft kilt he wore yesterday lol.

Fair play tho for having the front to wear it.

Thankfully we never found out if he was wearing anything underneath!!!!

When the girls ask me that question I always reply 'It's self-service' LOL

A new year a new start

im sure the team at Luton are going to make all the steps needed to making this the best casino cardroom in the country

With all the new positive changes that are happening around the place all will be good

 ;fishing;

Mick how come it took you 58 mins to reply  thought it would be a lot quicker than that

 ;ifm;

things are changing for the better and fast. Seriously.

Never going to be able to remove the inherent disadvantages of playing in a casino environment but that said, things are on the up

- valets service far improved
- good numbers (apart from one night) over the past fortnight
- decent January Schedule
- text and email marketing service introduced for players

aside from the 30 minute late start and the final starting at 4.50am last night of course

onwards and upwards.... ;whistle;

A no nipping policy would be a good idea too.

 ;fishing; ;ifm;

forgot about this thread but as I did make a brief visit there a couple of weeks ago I do have some nice things to say.

-as Tikay always tells us I was greeted with a smile at reception, an improvement on most places
-service at the bar was great, friendly and again came with smiles. Special thanks to Louisa (sure that's her name) for the entertainment
-the ceiling still entertains me
-the cage they make people smoke in is fantastic
-the valets that were there were working tirelessly, just not enough of them
-they let Tikay last past the first break

NEGATIVES

-the hand dryers still scare the bejesus out of me
-Louisa went home early  :(

all in all pretty good though

A smile, "Hi",. & eye-contact from Reception Staff is priceless, & Luton do this particularly well. Ditto DTD.

Sorry to say, but Spielers in Southend, The Vic, & Southampton are bottom of the class in this respect at the moment.

As to Valets in Luton, there are almost too many of them now, they come round so often now that I need a bigger bag.

Colostomy or doggie?

ones passion, ones fashion !

Whats the odds of getting  "Eggs Benedict" on the menu at Luton

Regretfully, the Catering at Luton remains abysmal. It will get better - it cannot possibly get worse.

Every request for food is met with a question  - "at 1am Sir?, but the Chef packs up at 2am" or retort - "we are out of eggs/bread/chips"......

It's a shame, but they are aware, & on the case.

At G Luton now, on display, is a breakdown of:

- contributions for the 30G league
- those players still to claim their £50


The top level figures are as follows


Players Contribution £24,600
Added by Casino £5,400
Total £30,000

Paid out as follows

Heads up comp £26,180
Shootout comp £2,520
League Points winners, top 2  £1,300
Total £30,000

Also other prizes

3x plasma tvs
23x poker sets

£1,000 added to the Sunday evening £50 freezeout

Been to Luton once, loved the night there just a shame they dont have many freezeouts, when people are pushing blind every hand (and are quite happy to continually re-buy for £20 a time) you think why dont you just play roulette.

Some of those players in fairness tighten up some after the rebuy period.  Some don't!  So rather than playing a 200 f/o with them all, which protects them from themselves a little bit, why not a 20 r/b tourny with them where they contribute 140 or even 200 to the prize fund and you contribute 60?  Now you get a little reward for tolerating (and picking off) their madness, rather than levelling the playing field by all having to contribute the same fixed amount (and higher juice) at the start?

Lots of people seem to prefer the f/o's nowadays, but last time I looked, 20 r/b and 100 f/o @ Luton generated about the same prize fund.  Getting a 40+% discount on entry fee is a pretty significant advantage surely, more than enough reward for getting mown down by 7-4x once or twice, or even having to think about identifying a couple of new situations worth gambling in?  Someone also suggested that the f/o guarantees a fixed outlay, but surely most people can manage to discipline themselves to playing a 20 r/b with a 100 max stake?  If you burn through 4 rebuys, you simply get up...

Erm, Luton has possibly the best range of freezeouts in the country, id go again but with a cardroom schedule scottbufc.

 rotflmfao

er,Monday, Wednesday, Fri, Sun you get freezeouts or one rebuy comps so you know what your outlay is

Just to say I had a fantastic meal at Luton last night in the cardroom.

Spot on.

Perfect.























Mind you, it was only a bowl of cut up red onion, tomato and cucumber ;)

I'm far from qualified to fulfill the boots of Alistair, but even if I had the knowledge needed, I wouldn't want it.

Imagine working with a group of staff that you got along with wonderfully, and a loyal group of players that made your job excellent. Sounds good, really.

The problem lies with the fact that almost every problem that the card room faces is entirely out of our hands.

They cut funds left right and center and we can't do anything about it. We're not allowed overtime and our festivals are no longer advertised to 'save money'. Not to mention, why does anyone want more stress and more work for the same pitiful wage?

 Currently, we have no supervisor and Carmel is a casino manager. While she does deal with the card room it's not a full on dedication but one of many duties she has to perform, so it's not getting the attention it needs or deserved but it's nothing we can solve.

I'm hoping and praying we get bought out by someone that understands the possibility. Our cardroom is massive, but we fill what? Six tables.

It's disheartening for us because we're listening to all of these slatings, just or not and we can't do anything about most of them.

I think this hits the nail on the head.  Head Office need to decide if the festivals are costing too much money or not.  If they are, don't run them. They can't expect "festival sized revenue" without running a festival properly, including an awareness campaign/advertising that it is on, plus the other trimmings that should make a festival stand out from a normal week.


I can understand that it puts the cardroom staff in a bad spot and it can't be nice to hear constant criticism without the tools to rectify, or at least a voice to reply with.  I think most, if not all, of the criticisms are bluntly aimed at head office.  I think the regular players recognise that the staff on the floor are doing their bit, albeit with hands tied.  Once in a while, someone will have a beef with something that the dealers could do better - such as colouring up, balancing tables, hand for hand supervision etc.  Btw, All of which have definitely got better IMHO.  But it is quite easy to see that these issues are all small fry compared to the main issues with the cardroom, most of which require correct funding/managerial attention to get right.  I don't think any of the regulars would hold the cardroom staff accountable for any of that.

I would like to point out  it is not head office but the actual casino that decides what they want to spend on each comp/fessie. Head office only ask for a brake down of how much money they expect to make/lose and from there even if it seems they will make a loss the casino can still go ahead.

thats incorrect, Head Office has put a spending freeze on the individual clubs as I understand it

Maybe you can clarify for me who sets the budget. The casino or Head Office and based around what parameters

Head Office or the upper echelons of management still leaves it well out of our hands, though I am 99% certain that all budgeting is done by Head Office - Certainly they were the ones behind our almost complete stop on advertisements, and they are the ones that set our targets. I am sure the casino has some small amount of room of maneuvre in regards to what it spends but given the state of -our- company, cutbacks are enforced and money is tight.

So even if it's not the norm, I somehow can't help but feel we're heads up against  Aspades Ac and we've looked down to find our hole cards as  7h  2d

We're live, but we're almost certainly behind!

I feel for you Guys......I really do.....as my old man frequently says to me.......don't let the barstewards grind you down. I suppose at the end of the day Head Office are making decisions that they believe are correct for the business. I do not believe anobody goes to work to do a bad job. I wish they would let me take one site and remarket it for six months so that I could show them what they might be like. If Grosvenor continue to just listen to accountants then their business will go the same way as British Rail......prices up.....costs down.....everybody uses some other form of transport. Everything is already in situ to make more money IMHO it just needs unlocking. I know.....I have a big mouth......come on Grosvenor take me up on it......one site.....6 months

Oi!!

Less slagging off Accountants if you please!

What they need is a poker playing Accountant :)

My old man then

Here it is. In a nutshell.

With all respect to the players comments on this thread, it's difficult to understand the mindset of casino managment unless you've worked alongside them and understand their attitude towards poker. That is, their real attitude towards it, and not that which they convey to the punters. Very few of them understand or give a flying toss about card rooms. If you think it's high on their agenda, then you're mistaken, end of story. I know the game is precious to you, but it's not to them. A cold, hard fact that no amount of debationg will change. It's simply too far down on their list of priorities.

Rank, even with the re-branding, are in deep doo-doo due to ill advised managerial appointments and a lack of foresight about the industry in general. The card room makes sod all compared to the percentage hold of table games, which is what they have to concentrate on if they want to improve their embarassing share price. Accordingly, the poker rooms across the country (Cardiff and Luton being two prime examples, with the formers cancellation of it's GUKPT and the many examples of the latters demise in this thread) are suffering rather badly it seems.

I'm fortunate enough to run a card room within a casino that recognises it's potential worth when run properly, and with sufficient attendance figures of the kind of poker player that will migrate to the casino floor. That is, students and newcomers to our beloved game that are not accustomed to gambling within a casino. Poker has gotten reams of exposure over the past few years, and it's a golden opportunity to capitalise on it.

To draw a comparison, yesterday afternoon I ran a £20 freeze-out that attracted 85 players. Given Swanseas track record in low to mid buy-in poker tournament attendances over the past 5 years (which have traditionally averaged somewhere between 30 to 50 players), it's a very welcoming figure. Now with the £2 juice that I charged, that's not even covering the cost of the dealers for the competition. But what is appealing to the managment is the 85 players that would not have normally walked through the front doors on a Sunday did so, down to a poker competition.

That's what the game can do for the industry if it's well administrated, well promoted and run to even a moderate standard.

What they need (Grosvenor and Rank plc, not Blue Sq) is long term decision making and investing in their business through tough times. Sadly legislation (smoking ban) and the company's finances dictate otherwise...

Good points well made and indeed my comments are not made as a player but a punter....take Luton for example.....massive restaurant.....no punters......how hard can it be to fill a restaurant.........what will a proportion of the diners do after finishing their meal???

I know in London the cuisine within casinos is quite sought after, but i've always wondered why someone would want to go to a casino for a meal.

I dont know, maybe it's just me  ;carlocitrone;

Is that because you view the restaurant as a restaurant within a casino instead of a themed restaurant that you might attend on an evening out???

I suppose that's part of it. I guess it just wouldn't have the right kind of ambience.

Now that the dodgy entertainment has been cut to weekend only, I think it's a nice venue to eat out at. I certainly can't understand why we struggle to fill a table, let alone a restaurant.

Correction. I understand why we struggle to fill a table. The difference is that we shouldn't.

Also, any restaurant that would allow you in, isn't worth eating in.

Its ok Snatty, in a couple of years we can open our own club, then you can show off your marketing prowess!!!

When your missus learns to eat with a knife and fork Kev, then come back to me :)