Title: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 04:02:45 PM a straight A/B poll
POKER ROOMS SHOULD BE NON SMOKING AGREE / DISAGREE Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: DJKebab on October 26, 2005, 04:04:35 PM Poll seems to be broken, but I strongly agree!!
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Royal Flush on October 26, 2005, 04:05:03 PM Agree, but i also think that ginger should get a badge, and flushy should shutup.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: DJKebab on October 26, 2005, 04:05:26 PM Ignore me, I am a donkey, it is working fine...
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Bongo on October 26, 2005, 04:05:59 PM I agree, I wish everywhere would tbh.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: tikay on October 26, 2005, 04:06:56 PM DJKebab, what do you mean, "broken". I can see the "score", are you not able to?
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 04:07:24 PM SMOKING KILLS
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Robert HM on October 26, 2005, 04:07:43 PM Where's the "don't know" or "don't care" button? Not everything is black and white
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: RED-DOG on October 26, 2005, 04:15:50 PM Where's the "don't know" or "don't care" button? Not everything is black and white Don't care? don't vote! Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: -bw- on October 26, 2005, 04:17:40 PM come on Robert and Red
break it up guys Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 04:17:56 PM beat me to it RED. can't remember who brought that up last time. The idea of having to add an abstain option so people who don't care can still vote. >:?
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Scottish Dave on October 26, 2005, 04:35:40 PM Im afraid i disagree lads / ladets.
I sometimes do like a wee cigarette at the table, i know its filthy, but sometimes my needs must. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Robert HM on October 26, 2005, 04:35:53 PM No it's for people who have a different opinion which they wish to express.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Rod Paradise on October 26, 2005, 04:38:52 PM beat me to it RED. can't remember who brought that up last time. The idea of having to add an abstain option so people who don't care can still vote. >:? It's not that daft - I'd bother voting in this country more if I could say 'None of the above' - that would stop claims that the majority of people support the clowns in charge. On this issue (which is very current in Scotland - they WILL be non-smoking as of April 06) - I think that not enough attention was paid to ventilation systems - and with an adequate ventilation system I'd have no problem with smoking in pubs or Card-rooms, or airplanes - of course proper ventilation cost money - so just ban smoking ::) . BTW I don't smoke & never have - but don't generally have a problem & find most smokers considerate about trying to avoid me getting the smoke in my face. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: RED-DOG on October 26, 2005, 04:41:08 PM No it's for people who have a different opinion which they wish to express. Lets hear it then Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Robert HM on October 26, 2005, 04:42:38 PM I want it to show up in the results
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 04:44:51 PM I disagree Robert. I think this issue IS black and white. I feel as the night goes on I am less and less able to focus on my game and it's starting to have an impact on my health. I chose to give up smoking early last year. now my choice appears to be stop playing at Nottingham Gala of passively smoke a pack of 20 every time I want a game of cards.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 04:44:58 PM For this particular poll RHM, IMO no-one would vote "dont care"
A non smoker would be in favor of a smoking ban A smoker would be againts a smokin ban. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Phil on October 26, 2005, 04:47:00 PM I'm a smoker and I'm in favour of a ban.
I smoke in card rooms because I can. Tell me I can't and I'll stop. That might even make me give up all together and I'll be more than happy with that. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 04:47:20 PM not all smokers are against a ban. not by a long way.
can someone can give me one GOOD reason why smoking should be allowed in the card room? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Rod Paradise on October 26, 2005, 04:47:40 PM For this particular poll RHM, IMO no-one would vote "dont care" A non smoker would be in favor of a smoking ban A smoker would be againts a smokin ban. Wouldn't vote 'Don't Care' - but think there should be an undecided button - because I feel the debate has never been properly aired - see the post I already made. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 04:47:56 PM I'm a smoker and I'm in favour of a ban. I smoke in card rooms because I can. Tell me I can't and I'll stop. That might even make me give up all together and I'll be more than happy with that. I thought you had given up? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Rod Paradise on October 26, 2005, 04:49:09 PM not all sokers are against a ban. not by a long way. can someone can give me one GOOD reason why smoking should be allowed in the card room? I guess my posts are invisible.... Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Robert HM on October 26, 2005, 04:49:27 PM Nemesis, thank you for your attempt at telling me my opinion. ;)
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 04:50:06 PM well lets debate it here and anyone undecided can then cast a for/against vote
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Phil on October 26, 2005, 04:50:27 PM I'm a smoker and I'm in favour of a ban. I smoke in card rooms because I can. Tell me I can't and I'll stop. That might even make me give up all together and I'll be more than happy with that. I thought you had given up? I did. Lasted about 6 weeks I think. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 04:52:03 PM not all sokers are against a ban. not by a long way. can someone can give me one GOOD reason why smoking should be allowed in the card room? I guess my posts are invisible.... Sorry Rod, I don't personally think 'because better ventalation systems are available' type arguments are a GOOD reason to allow smoking. it's a poor compromise IMO and no, you're posts aren't invisible. I always pay close attention to you r posts. I usually thoroughly enjoy them Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 04:52:18 PM I'm a smoker and I'm in favour of a ban. I smoke in card rooms because I can. Tell me I can't and I'll stop. That might even make me give up all together and I'll be more than happy with that. I thought you had given up? I did. Lasted about 6 weeks I think. You can do it bro!* :)up :)up :)up * Just dont watch West Ham and it should be alot easier!!! :D :D :D :D Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: RED-DOG on October 26, 2005, 04:55:21 PM I want it to show up in the results the results will show that not everyone voted Do we need to add sections for every possible point of view, what about people who would like to stubb their cigarette out on their opponents bald patch, should they get the option to vote for that? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 04:56:27 PM "what about people who would like to stubb their cigarette out on their opponents bald patch, should they get the option to vote for that?"
LOL Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: The Camel on October 26, 2005, 04:59:10 PM I voted for a ban.
But, if they aren't going to ban smoking, why not have smoking/non smoking tables at the start of a tournament? Used to do this in Paris before they went totally non smoking for tournaments. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 05:00:41 PM I voted NO to this as it very much depends on the ventillation available in the room. The Bellagio poker room was never smokey as it had good ventillation and high ceilings and imo did not need to become non smoking but this would not and should apply to all cardrooms. (Please note I gave up smoking just under 3 yuears ago now).
As for the statement SMOKING KILLS well imo food kills far more people each and every year and depending on the criteria that you use alcohol doesn't do too badly in that department either. I believe in freedoms for everyone and do not understand why smokers are persecuted in the way that they are in this society. Admittedly second hand / passive smoking is not good for you (even though this is scientifically still in some dispute) but I believe that there should be designated smoking and non smoking areas and reckon they should have smoking sections and compartments on trains planes and busses too. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 05:02:24 PM RED, since meeting you in the flesh your posts are even funnier because I can imagine your delivery.
Camel, I imagine thats a nightmare for TDs. I jokingly told the lad balancing tables last night not to send me any more smokers. Unless it's divided into two seperate poker rooms I dont see the point. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 05:04:49 PM come on Harry, who ever died from passive eating?
The Belagios ventalation system may be state of the art but it couldnt deal with the fog in Notts Galas card room. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: tikay on October 26, 2005, 05:06:08 PM In Amsterdam you can take your choice, they have "smoking" & "non-smoking" areas, & you can choose in which section you wish to sit before drawing your seat. Obviujsly, the later stages of all comps are non-smoking.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: The Camel on October 26, 2005, 05:06:58 PM What they used to do in Paris was have a bag with tickets for smoking tables, and one for non smoking tables. They broke the smoking tables first and if a smoker moved to a non smoking table he couldn't smoke. Simple as that.
I would far rather be on the other side of room to a smoker than have one either side of me. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: RED-DOG on October 26, 2005, 05:07:14 PM come on Harry, who ever died from passive eating? I know of someone who was killed when a 34 stone bloke fell on him Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 05:08:26 PM EASY EASY EASY EASY
YOU SHUT UP EASY EASY EASY EASY Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Rod Paradise on October 26, 2005, 05:09:15 PM Sorry Rod, I don't personally think 'because better ventalation systems are available' type arguments are a GOOD reason to allow smoking. it's a poor compromise IMO and no, you're posts aren't invisible. I always pay close attention to you r posts. I usually thoroughly enjoy them Didn't mean that to read as pissed off as it did, sorry. I've not got time to debate it now... BUT I've previously posted about a pub in Glasgow where they invested in a hi-tec ventilation system (it blows in air at bar level, extracts above) & the tested air quality in the pub (an old blokes pub with lots of smokers) was better than the non-smoking pub in Glasgow tested at. If a premises can prove an adequate system, then why should they have to ban smoking? Airplanes are the same - I was (and am) asthmatic & used to fly 4 times a year or so, I never had a problem with smoke even though it wasn't banned on the flights - but the ventilation was run at 100% (complete refresh of air every 1/2 hour AFAICR) - now they run it at 10%, everyone on the flights catches everyone else's cold, they've banned smoking & they say it's more healthy - but it's just CHEAPER. I don't smoke (tobacco), will never start, but don't see bans as the best solution. It's happened in Ireland, and where the pubs near my brother's were never shut, they now are shut every afternoon except weekends, everyone complains about the farm workers smell, and the best conversations are outside in the smoker's shelter - so much so that non-smokers join their mates out in the shelter. I'm off to the Celtic game, (via the pub) but will continue this tomorrow if you like. Cheers, Rod Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: portfolio on October 26, 2005, 05:09:41 PM as a smoker, NON-SMOKING is the only way ahead ANYTHING that stops new blood from entering the fray makes no sense.
there are always breaks and allocated areas for us to indulge,and if u play in LA/LV/most big venues its just time to get used to it. even in illegal underground clubs in NYC,u have to go to the ventilated smoking cubicles,which only adds to the surrealness of the whole poker scenario!! ps as a quid pro quo,can we ban ban i-pods and sunglasses too?? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 05:15:27 PM Don't worry Rod, this argument usually goes on for weeks once it starts.
Portfolio, yes, Ipods and shades and hoodies and caps. actually I wouldn't ban them because I actually think they give the edge to the other guy. I do find it amusing that every week on beginners night new players turn up Ipods and shades and 2 or 3 weeks later largely speaking have shed them. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Bongo on October 26, 2005, 05:18:12 PM It was bizarre last night. Walked from bar to card room to join the queue to draw seats. The card room at notts has a little downhill ramp that leads to the entrance. This smelt of smoke and was hazy and the further down the ramp you got the worse it was.
This was before the comp started. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: divaflava on October 26, 2005, 05:18:46 PM "ps as a quid pro quo,can we ban ban i-pods and sunglasses too??"
ker-rist yes. 8) Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: RED-DOG on October 26, 2005, 05:21:24 PM According to the news, smoking is to be banned everywhere any road up
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 05:23:36 PM come on Harry, who ever died from passive eating? Apart from the 34st bloke who fell on someone and whom I didn't know about............. My remark was directed at Nemesis who posted "Smoking Kills." Like any statement life (and death) is never that simple. Cars/Alcohol/Food all kill but you do not get them banned unilaterally. People have a right to clean air but so too do smokers have rights who are addicted to a drug that the government (and tobacco industry) make billions from. They got people hooked and deserve support and help. Making them scurry off into a corner will certainly not help their addiction and restricting the places where they can smoke will most likely increase their consumption of cigarettes rather than decrease it. The tobacco industry and governments knew for years that chemicals were placed in cigarettes to cause users to become addicted in the same way certain chemicals that are extremely harmful are added to foods to cause addiction to certain brands and products. Even worse is that these chemicals are being targeted at childrens foods and sweets. I'm not sure but I think this all started years ago when pet food manufacturers decided to put things in cat and dog food (like barbiturates) to get pets addicted to sepcific brands (thats why they are so reluctant to eat rival brands when you buy them) so that you have to keep going back for the same brand again and again. It's all about making money and if you think this is all garbage just remember that in the early days of Coca-Cola you actually had cocaine in the drink but thankfully tthat has now been removed. The basic idea is to get your customers addicted and keep them coming back for more as in that way you get to make more money. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 05:26:51 PM coke in coke - true
speed in pet food - urban myth. a great deal of support is being offered to smokers who want to give up an rightly so. as you say, it is a drug addiction and smokers desreve support TO GIVE UP. smokers determined to keep smoking desrve no such consideration any way, thats kind of off the path. we're specifically talking about smoking in poker rooms Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 05:30:19 PM coke in coke - true speed in pet food - urban myth. a great deal of support is being offered to smoker who want to give up an rightly so. as you say, it is a drug addiction and smokers desreve support TO GIVE UP. smoker determined to keep smoking desrve no such consideration ;applause; ;applause; ;applause; ;applause; ;applause; Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 05:32:49 PM coke in coke - true speed in pet food - urban myth. a great deal of support is being offered to smoker who want to give up an rightly so. as you say, it is a drug addiction and smokers desreve support TO GIVE UP. smoker determined to keep smoking desrve no such consideration I consider myself lucky as I managed to escape and better late than never. As for pet food...try changing your pets brand.....until they get hungry it will take a couple of days before they start eating the new brand through necessity. If you want a list of "Extremely Bad For You" and "Addictive" additives placed in human food a simple search on the internet will yield you masses of information. Fortunately Europe has tighter controls than the USA but there is a VERY long way to go before I would consider feeding most foods to any kids. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Royal Flush on October 26, 2005, 05:39:08 PM The subject of smoking and non-smoking parts of the same tournament....
Here is a quite from Daniel Negreanu from the 2003 WPT in the ACF When I arrived, I had to choose my table draw, smoking or non. (They offered each player a choice before he drew his seat: a nonsmoking table or a smoking table.) Hmm … I absolutely hate smoke, but the majority of the local players there are in fact smokers, and I knew that many of the pros who traveled to the event were not. I thought to myself, I’ll outsmart them all by taking a smoking table to start, and avoid the other pros! I’d just have to suck it up and deal with the smoke so that I could enhance my chances of winning the tournament. Well, so much for that idea. I looked around at the smoking tables and noticed that all of the American nonsmoking pros were seated at them! The nonsmoking table looked like it was full of novice players. Classic i thought! Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 05:39:23 PM speed in pet food - urban myth. PS Speed belongs to the Amphetamines class of drugs and yes this is of the track and smokers deserve a LOT more support in givng up than what is currently on offer. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: redsimon on October 26, 2005, 05:39:39 PM http://www.snopes.com/cokelore/cocaine.asp
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: M POWER on October 26, 2005, 05:51:53 PM I know smoking does Kill, so I only smoke Malborough Lights, that way I should be OK.
And I voted to ban smoking in card rooms. Nottingham is a problem because Managers go there for a crafty one because they can no longer smoke in the pit. It is not hard to stop the smoking in card rooms. Take away the Ash trays and put signs up saying NO SMOKING. It will work from day 1 Regards M Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Karabiner on October 26, 2005, 05:57:04 PM I am a smoker (cigar) but find the smoky atmosphere in Notts Gala cardroom almost unbearable when it is full.
I unhesitatingly voted for no smoking in the card room. Once I took an internal Spanish flight from Madrid to Malaga. It was a small plane with two seats on each side of the aisle. A s we got to the top of the mobile staircase and were boarding the plane the Spanish steward said "Smoking on the left, non smoking on the right" Needless to say it didn't help, amused us though. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 05:59:51 PM Harry, for someone who's posts are normally so insightful all of your posts so far seem to be missing the point. I happen to disagree that there's insufficient support for people who are trying to give up smoking. If you cannont afford the patches you can go and see your GP and he/she will happily write you a perscription. there's helplines and literature, websites and billboards. At the end of the day it's down to individual will power.
All of this has NO baring on whether or not smoking should be allowed in the card room. Sadly it looks like the new legislation will have the 'private members club' saver in place so there's no immediate legal support for those of us in favour of a ban. the reason I've put this poll up again is that I want to write a leeter to Notts Galas GM and I want to include the results. I'm soory, Im a bit hazy on my amphetemine / barbituate / opiate catagorising. I still say it's an urban myth that pedigree pet food resort to drugging the food to make animals prefer it. maybe it's just better stuff Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Royal Flush on October 26, 2005, 06:00:59 PM The idea of smoking on a plane just drives me mad!!
Would you smoke in a petrol station? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: RED-DOG on October 26, 2005, 06:02:57 PM The idea of smoking on a plane just drives me mad!! Would you smoke in a petrol station? No, but I wouldn't fly in one either Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Royal Flush on October 26, 2005, 06:06:15 PM The greatest danger to an aircraft is fire, to alow people to bring cigs/matches/lighters on is just asking for a disaster.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: patman on October 26, 2005, 06:16:04 PM i`m against smoking and am proud that scotland has decided to go as far as it did in banning it in public places...the deal in england wiil i am sure in future years seem to be the sell out that it is to the tobacco and breweries.
in card rooms i prefer not smoking. my first visit to a card room was marred only by the smoke doing my eyes and head in and would put me of if it continued like that. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 06:22:16 PM The idea of smoking on a plane just drives me mad!! Would you smoke in a petrol station? They DEFINITELY DO in The USA Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Royal Flush on October 26, 2005, 06:24:46 PM lol yeah it amazed me in the US to see them smoking in a petrol station. They didn't seem to think it was a danger!
Thankfully they don't on planes anymore! Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 06:27:35 PM it's actually very difficult to ignite petrol with a cigarette, ir even a live flame. If you did the who die hard, drop the match thing it'd just go out. even dropping a Zippo is likely to have no effect.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 26, 2005, 06:30:01 PM it's actually very difficult to ignite petrol with a cigarette, ir even a live flame. If you did the who die hard, drop the match thing it'd just go out. even dropping a Zippo is likely to have no effect. petrol fumes and vapour however are highly flamable Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 06:31:39 PM quite true, but a dropped fag end wont be enough. jeez we're rubbish at staying on topic
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 26, 2005, 06:36:10 PM but a fag being smoked while pumping petrol could be enough to spark a fire IF vapour was in the air which knowing petrol is HIGHLY proberable but my understanding is that american GAS is less likely
these is due to slight differences in the 2 products Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Karabiner on October 26, 2005, 06:42:05 PM This is like two dogs fighting over one bone :blonde:
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: M POWER on October 26, 2005, 06:42:39 PM Adam
Douse yourself in Petrol and let Ironside throw matches at you. We could bet on it too say £5 a match Regards M Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 06:47:35 PM that sounds like an inflamatory remark.
so, smoking incard rooms... Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Nem on October 26, 2005, 06:53:03 PM Adam Douse yourself in Petrol and let Ironside throw matches at you. We could bet on it too say £5 a match Regards M LMAO!!!! Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 06:57:13 PM Harry, for someone who's posts are normally so insightful all of your posts so far seem to be missing the point. I happen to disagree that there's insufficient support for people who are trying to give up smoking. If you cannont afford the patches you can go and see your GP and he/she will happily write you a perscription. there's helplines and literature, websites and billboards. At the end of the day it's down to individual will power. All of this has NO baring on whether or not smoking should be allowed in the card room. Sadly it looks like the new legislation will have the 'private members club' saver in place so there's no immediate legal support for those of us in favour of a ban. the reason I've put this poll up again is that I want to write a leeter to Notts Galas GM and I want to include the results. I'm soory, Im a bit hazy on my amphetemine / barbituate / opiate catagorising. I still say it's an urban myth that pedigree pet food resort to drugging the food to make animals prefer it. maybe it's just better stuff I do not believe that the answer is a blanket ban and the amounts spent supporting those who want to give up is a pittance compared to what the governement is making from the sale of cigarettes. If they were to spend 10% of the duty received from fags it would be infintiely more than is currently spent on prevention and support but like most things governments tend to squander our taxes on what they seem to deem appropriate but now I'm really off track. Smokers need to be considered and have an outlet for being able to smoke as it is an involuntary act on their parts due to their addiction. Having enforced bans is not the answer as it denies the smoker any say and does not acknowledge his rights and makes it very difficult for them to cope. I am not advocating that non smokers should be subjected to passive smoking (I have always personally hated smokey environments) but in the same way that a screaming baby or child cries for food you do not turn around and deny that child the food and say you'll have to wait an hour or so until dinner time before being fed. I think that in this day and age smokers and non smokers can both be accomodated eg California card rooms where there are smoking rooms for smokers to walk into and smoke. Personally nicotine patches and gum did not work for me and the answer is not to give people drug patches (imo) but to get them off the nicotine completely with 24 hour support if necessary. Market forces should ultimately dictate whether smoking is or is not allowed in a place of leisure and if a card room somewhere became non smoking and had greater business than a smoking rival then thats the one that would survive. Having said that there is probably a fair degree of correlation between gambling and smoking and probably drinking alcohol and coffee for that matter too as all involve some kind of addiction and often multiple dependancies and addictions are present in individuals. I just find it suprising that both smokers and non smokers cannot be catered for in this day and age. The Grosvenor Victoria has smoking and non smoking gaming tables but then is large enough to be able to do this. Which sections are busier I do not know but I do know that some will consider abusing the gaming rules and refuse to play a hand if drawn next to the bar section where smoking is allowed for some of their poker tournaments. If it transpires that most casinos or card rooms make more money from smokers than non smokers then why should they be denied the opportunity to make money? Likewise if they make more from non smokers then why not let them make the place no smoking. However if I were a card room or casino operator I would want to have as many customers as possible regardless of whether they smoked or not and as such have two seperate areas to accomodate all of them. Over the course of time I would then decide which group would get the greater space allocation and if one area were unprofitable or uneconomic then I would certainly drop that section and say tough luck to the unlucky group. This may sound cynical but then I would be in the business of making money and maximising profits and I certainly would not entertain any governemnt telling me what to do. I sympathise with those of you who go to The Gala? Nottingham Casino but like most things if they do not accomodate your needs then you should vote with your feet. If enough of you do so (and raisng a petition is a good way of getting attention) then they will have to listen as it will hurt them in their pockets. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 07:09:51 PM to say that smoking is involutary is going too far and, the more I come to think of it, the more I object to money being spent supporting smokers giving up at all. The withdrawal effects from stopping smoking cause nothing more than a temporary longing. It's not the same as recovering from Heroin/cocaine/alcohol. Society is gradually coming round to the concept that smokers have no rights other that that of being able to smoke in their own home.
I would vote with my feet if there were anywhere near enough to considewr an alternative and, given that he's indicated playing areas are likely to be smoke free, when Rob Yongs place eventually gets off the ground I will certainly be doing just that. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 26, 2005, 07:13:06 PM to say that smoking is involutary is going too far and, the more I come to think of it, the more I object to money being spent supporting smokers giving up at all. The withdrawal effects from stopping smoking cause nothing more than a temporary longing. It's not the same as recovering from Heroin/cocaine/alcohol. Society is gradually coming round to the concept that smokers have no rights other that that of being able to smoke in their own home. being an ex acholic and an ex smoker i can say that it was much easier to come of the demon drink, Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 07:19:19 PM my point about the physiolocical effects stands.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: jammer on October 26, 2005, 07:29:24 PM The thing is with poker rooms is that in a town, one casino will tend to have a monopoly (there is market failure), which mean the players in its locality have no choice if they want to play live. Hence making them non-smoking if that is the majority opinion makes absolute sense (while still providing facilities for smoking customers).
Now I think this is completely different to pubs. I have just heard a woman ranting on the radio about smoking in public places such as pubs. These obsessive activists do my nut. The thing is in each town there are hundreds of pubs all competing, and as such there is room for market forces to compete between non-smoking pubs, full-smoking pubs, and those with only designated areas and let the invisible hand make the choice. If people are concerned enough, smoking pubs will die out (no pun intended) due to lack of trade. I never go to weatherspoons because they have no background music, but some people love that, and that's great. Choice! But for pete's sake, let PEOPLE decide. Enforcing non-smoking in all pubs, in a highly competetive market with low barriers to entry, is lunacy (and probably a violation of civil liberties). grrrr. >:( An angry ex-smoker, Jammer Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 08:30:31 PM to say that smoking is involutary is going too far and, the more I come to think of it, the more I object to money being spent supporting smokers giving up at all. The withdrawal effects from stopping smoking cause nothing more than a temporary longing. It's not the same as recovering from Heroin/cocaine/alcohol. Society is gradually coming round to the concept that smokers have no rights other that that of being able to smoke in their own home. I would vote with my feet if there were anywhere near enough to considewr an alternative and, given that he's indicated playing areas are likely to be smoke free, when Rob Yongs place eventually gets off the ground I will certainly be doing just that. It is very sad imho to read these thoughts. The reason smoking is so addictive and difficult to give up (if memory serves me correctly) is due to the nicotine staying in the blood system for 28 days. Heroin metabolises quickly in less than 48 hrs so is in fact easier to give up. It is very much an involuntary act for an addict and it is very much NOT a "Temporary longing" which makes a smoking addiction very different to heroin, cocaine and alcohol. As for objecting to money being spent on reforming smokers and helping them give up I would assert that the NHS would cease to function completely without the contribution made by tax on cigarettes and society as a whole would benefit in more ways than just financially from a massive investment in helping people give up. Smokers are people and as such have rights or at least an entitlement to have their views heard. Admittedly you could argue contibutory negligence but to abandon them completely in the way you suggest is ludicrous and does not represent a way forward whilst forcing views and laws on people is more akin to a dictatorship and fascism. I'm not sure what the stats are for smokers and non smokers but doubt very much that the split is outside the 60/40 range and as such neither group can be termed an insignificant minority. In any event, however, I thought that democracy was all about freedom of speech and preserving and protecting the rights of minorities from the majority and as such would never wish to deny any group an opportunity to argue their case.. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 08:39:02 PM I struggled for years to give up smoking and I realise how difficult it is. I've also had close friends who've battled with Class A drugaddiction(and in most cases sadly lost) the two just don't compare.
you don't need medical assistance, or hypnotherapy, or helplines to give up smoking. you just need a determination not to put another one in your mouth. if you want it enough, you'll crack it. the same cannot be said about a drug like Heroin. please Harry, lets not fall out about this. I have no wish to sadden you . I'm trying (and failing) to keep this thread on topic. poker rooms, smoking Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Bongo on October 26, 2005, 09:48:49 PM My chest hurts, I went to the gym and was wheezing today.
Why? I played poker last night. Does anyone have a reason why people should be able to smoke in a cardroom? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: redsimon on October 26, 2005, 09:52:05 PM I voted anti smoking but I guess your answer Bongo is "because they can" Most smokers are inconsiderate of others.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 26, 2005, 09:58:43 PM no Bongo, no-one has come up with a good reason why smoking should be allowed in the card room. Sunday I coughed all night and tuesday I was actually sick in the night. I can't believe I used to pay £5 a pack to do that to myself.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: tikay on October 26, 2005, 10:00:28 PM At the risk of being considered "wet", & of going off-topic, the Post about petrol being hard to ignite troubles me greatly.
Diesel fuel "DERV" is almost impossible to ignite via a stay spark, or cigarette. That is NOT the case with petroleum, "petrol" as we call it. Petrol gives off vapour which IS highly inflammable. I think I'm duty bound to warn you that I consider the post that suggested otherwise to be incorrect. We don't need any accidents, & if there is doubt about which is right, please give me the benefit of the doubt. Petrol, via it's vapour, WILL ignite spontaneously, & easily. For once, I am being totally serious. OK guys, you can have your smoking/no smoking thread back now. If you want to debate the petrol issue, please start a new thread. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Harry Demetriou on October 26, 2005, 11:11:04 PM I struggled for years to give up smoking and I realise how difficult it is. I've also had close friends who've battled with Class A drugaddiction(and in most cases sadly lost) the two just don't compare. you don't need medical assistance, or hypnotherapy, or helplines to give up smoking. you just need a determination not to put another one in your mouth. if you want it enough, you'll crack it. the same cannot be said about a drug like Heroin. please Harry, lets not fall out about this. I have no wish to sadden you . I'm trying (and failing) to keep this thread on topic. poker rooms, smoking I'm not going to take anything personally or fall out with anyone and especially so over this subject. I am a former smoker and over the course of time there will no doubt (hopefully) be less and less smokers. The bottom line, however, is that for a smoker to give up they have to develop a mental determination that is so tough and strong that it will enable them to see off the demons in those early days and weeks so that as time passes they get over the cravings and kick the habit. Unfortunately there is no real incentive for the govenement on this issue to assist smokers to give up. Call me a cynic but if they put the time effort and money into it then they can prevent the next generation from taking up smoking in the first place by educating them at an early school level about everything related to cigarettes/drugs alcohol etc etc. However there is a conflict of interests. Less smokers = less revenue and they can't really afford that now can they? Also less smokers mean better health and longevity of life which means a greater burden on the already overstretched and squandered pension funds. On top of this it will cost jobs in the NHS and the tobacco induxtry not to mention all the funding various political parties get from the tobacco companies (any coincidence in Formula 1 being allowed to keep fag sponsorship longer than other sports?). We live in a very sick world where governments and politicians continually lie to us about a multitude of things from going to war to what goes into our foods. They are fuelled by self intertest and the need or greed for money, more money and power and the general public have the wool pulled over their eyes and are the ones that suffer and pay for it all and they pay handsomely in both financial terms and their own health and lives. As if that wasn't enough they sneak in laws about things like the terrorism act and then apply those laws to areas that were not intended to be covered (eg 82 year old outspoken men at party political conferences and women walking on cycle paths near sensitive ports). And the UK is not alone in this as they stand side by side with (you guessed it) The USA in abusing our rights and freedoms (eg America introduced the ricoh statutes which were intended to combat organized crime but over the years they now apply it to any law broken that they see fit n ot to mention the extension of the Patriot Act and its powers). Now there that's me on my hobby horse and now wildly off topic but it is all interelated in oine form or another. In summary it's all a great conspiracy to manipulate and control us all and we are mere puppets playing and dancing to the tune of whatever current governement that we have and at the rate we are going there will be no freedom and democracy left all within a few years. I call you all to arms...its time for a revolution...and I say off with their heads because they certainly have forgotten about representing the common man and ordinary people. Ooops! who's that knocking at the door................................................................................ Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: snoopy1239 on October 26, 2005, 11:14:41 PM :goodpost:
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Royal Flush on October 26, 2005, 11:51:16 PM At the risk of being considered "wet", & of going off-topic, the Post about petrol being hard to ignite troubles me greatly. Diesel fuel "DERV" is almost impossible to ignite via a stay spark, or cigarette. That is NOT the case with petroleum, "petrol" as we call it. Petrol gives off vapour which IS highly inflammable. I think I'm duty bound to warn you that I consider the post that suggested otherwise to be incorrect. We don't need any accidents, & if there is doubt about which is right, please give me the benefit of the doubt. Petrol, via it's vapour, WILL ignite spontaneously, & easily. For once, I am being totally serious. OK guys, you can have your smoking/no smoking thread back now. If you want to debate the petrol issue, please start a new thread. See i thought that but i wasn't sure, as i know with aviation fuel there are adatives to stop this happening, infact it's quite hard to light it. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 26, 2005, 11:55:46 PM At the risk of being considered "wet", & of going off-topic, the Post about petrol being hard to ignite troubles me greatly. Diesel fuel "DERV" is almost impossible to ignite via a stay spark, or cigarette. That is NOT the case with petroleum, "petrol" as we call it. Petrol gives off vapour which IS highly inflammable. I think I'm duty bound to warn you that I consider the post that suggested otherwise to be incorrect. We don't need any accidents, & if there is doubt about which is right, please give me the benefit of the doubt. Petrol, via it's vapour, WILL ignite spontaneously, & easily. For once, I am being totally serious. OK guys, you can have your smoking/no smoking thread back now. If you want to debate the petrol issue, please start a new thread. i already said that Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 26, 2005, 11:57:58 PM At the risk of being considered "wet", & of going off-topic, the Post about petrol being hard to ignite troubles me greatly. Diesel fuel "DERV" is almost impossible to ignite via a stay spark, or cigarette. That is NOT the case with petroleum, "petrol" as we call it. Petrol gives off vapour which IS highly inflammable. I think I'm duty bound to warn you that I consider the post that suggested otherwise to be incorrect. We don't need any accidents, & if there is doubt about which is right, please give me the benefit of the doubt. Petrol, via it's vapour, WILL ignite spontaneously, & easily. For once, I am being totally serious. OK guys, you can have your smoking/no smoking thread back now. If you want to debate the petrol issue, please start a new thread. See i thought that but i wasn't sure, as i know with aviation fuel there are adatives to stop this happening, infact it's quite hard to light it. thats why you dont find rioters using avaition feul in there petrol bombs but in a fine vapour that a petorl bomb produces avaition feul would be flamable but not quite as flamable as good old fashioned unleaded Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: tikay on October 27, 2005, 12:10:12 AM Aviation Fuel contains a "jel" that inhibits the release of vapour, hence it's vapour is less, but once th fuel itself ignites, it's no less flammable. That is, after all, why it's used.
Ok, back to smoking & no smoking........ Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AwesomeAli on October 27, 2005, 01:03:30 AM There's a story about the smoking in public ban on bbc news online today.
Here's a linky for you.... http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4379710.stm?display=1 Looks like it's been/being banned with the exception of places that DO NOT serve food ::) Unless I am reading it wrong. Ali Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: RED-DOG on October 27, 2005, 01:05:25 AM Ahh, Notts will be exempt then
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AwesomeAli on October 27, 2005, 01:11:12 AM Ahh, Notts will be exempt then Ye, but that's a whole nother thread :D Ali Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 27, 2005, 01:58:47 AM in england private member clubs will also be exempt which means that all casinos will be able to have smoking away from the bar food being served or not
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 27, 2005, 02:14:23 AM wow, look another biased poll.
it, like everything in life is not black and white. How can you put forward a poll that has missed a complete mindset? What if the "don't cares" added to the "don't ban it" outweighed the "ban it" in the poll? Joke. Harry D, you make a lot of sense mate. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: jammer on October 27, 2005, 02:32:07 AM My chest hurts, I went to the gym and was wheezing today. Why? I played poker last night. Does anyone have a reason why people should be able to smoke in a cardroom? ok, totally playing devils advocate, given i voted for non-smoking (sick of clothes stinking after a gala night if nothing else).... The card room is a smoking one, and noone forces you to play there. What right does anyone have to tell the smokers who have been going to that card room for 20 years, which everyone knows is a smoking card room, that they shouldn't have it that way? There's games in towns nearby and non-stop on the net. So if your chest hurts, etc, and you know you are killing yourself by smoking passively.... why do you go? :dontask: Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Rod Paradise on October 27, 2005, 10:11:35 AM Having read through the whole thread again it seems clear that the people who play in Notts are the most militant on this - with good reason from the sounds of it. BUT that's one card-room. Why do you want to make a rule for everyone because of one room?
If I played in the Riverboat every night here in Glasgow I'd want smoking banned (or a proper extraction system fitted), that will improve a bit when they move the cardroom upstairs into a more open space. I play most in Cincinnati's - and with the very high ceiling the smoking isn't a problem unless you're beside someone & it's coming straight at you... but all the smokers I've been beside have been considerate about that as well. I HATE the way we're becoming a 'Nanny State' where everything is legislated for 'our own good'. IF there's a particular problem, sort it - don't make a rule for everyone because one place is bad. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: DJKebab on October 27, 2005, 10:54:01 AM Rod, sorry but I strongly disagree with that. While Cincinnati's may have a very high ceiling, the smoking is still a problem. I am still forced to breathe it in when sitting at the table, even if it does eventually rise. And even with the most considerate smoker, you are still being subjected to the toxins, whether the smoke is breathed directly at you or not. The damning evidence is in the fact that when you get home after an evening playing, your clothes will REEK of smoke. If it can permeate clothes to such an extent then it is getting to your lungs as well.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 27, 2005, 11:07:58 AM Harry, as instructed...You're a cynic.
IFM, ah I remember now, it was you who objected last time to this being a black and white issue. If you remember the poll last time was smokers pro ban / smokers anti ban / nonsmokers pro ban / nonsmokers anti ban. I maintain if you dont care you dont need an option, just dont vote. if you care enough to vote you care enough to have an opinion. Jammer, I don't have the 'right' to tell smokers what to do. if there was a card room anywhere near as close I would be voting with my feet. as there isn't my only right is to voice my opinion to the powers that be and I'll be including the results of this poll in the letter because, as expected it's 80% in favour of a ban. Eventually I'll be forced to make the decision, play poker at Notts gala and passively smoke a pack per session or walk away, unless the place bans smoking at the tables. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Rod Paradise on October 27, 2005, 11:24:32 AM I maintain if you dont care you dont need an option, just dont vote. if you care enough to vote you care enough to have an opinion. It's a sloppy poll then Adam... you can't then say X% of poker players want smoking banned, all you can say is X% of those who could be bothered voting want a ban. If you presented me with that poll I'd laugh at it because it's designed to get the result you want. There's 3 so far who feel there's a middle ground & you maintain we don't get a say, that's plainly wrong. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 27, 2005, 11:34:48 AM ok, I give in
option added Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Rod Paradise on October 27, 2005, 11:42:36 AM ok, I give in option added I'd already voted no - out of badness >:D :)up Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 27, 2005, 11:43:25 AM even with abstaners voting no it's overwhelming isnt it
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 27, 2005, 12:01:30 PM By your own logic, if you don't like it don't go......problem solved........next!!
With regards to Notts, the place is booming, more and more each comp, comps selling out at 6.35pm for christ's sake!! If you were the powers that be would you change anything?? Of course not, if it ain't broke don't fix it. Adam i understand your point of view, i have said many times on here that i dislike passive smoking (i even recommended a factory wide smoking ban where i work), but i strongly believe in freedom of choice. Persecution is not too strong a word when it comes to smokers, especially with the lack of evidence to support the victimisation. If there are 2 casino's in Britain that allow smoking in the card room then fine, there are hundreds that don't.....go to one of those. It was also said on previous polls that unless you canvass every member of Notts it will have no relevence to your cause, how many members do they have? how many voted in your poll? Ian Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 27, 2005, 12:18:57 PM I'm lobbying for change. to do that I don't have to canvas Notts members, I have to lend weight to my case. What I'm seeking to do is show the Gala management that for every smoker who'd leave due to a smoking ban there's be 4 non smokers or considerate smoker who'd step in there place. It's 26 mile to Nottingham and 100 to Walsall. for two or three trips a week, it's not an option. if (when ) another option becomes available in Nottingham of course I'll take it and the Gala chimneys can please themselves.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 27, 2005, 12:40:08 PM your poll would need to be area specific then, in fact it would need to be very specific.
"would any of you non smokers who live in and around Notts gala come to the casino at least 5 times a week if they banned smoking from the card room?" Though i have to say that if you don't poll members of that casino there is little weight to any poll. Have you approached the casino with regards to a comittee? many casino's are forming these to get feedback and implement popular changes, i believe all grosvenors are doing this (walsall has one). As i said before the biggest obstacle in the path of your crusade is the popularity of the card room as it stands, hard to argue with that. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Robert HM on October 27, 2005, 01:55:34 PM You could be "For", "Against", "Indiiferent" or "willing to seek middle ground or seek a solution", the latter is less dismissive then "Indifferent" or "Don't Care"
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 27, 2005, 01:56:49 PM I dont believe where smoking in confined public places there is a middle ground.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Robert HM on October 27, 2005, 01:59:39 PM Is that a firmly held opinion? :D
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: jammer on October 27, 2005, 06:26:05 PM I dont believe where smoking in confined public places there is a middle ground. the gala casino isn't a public place - its a private club (and a smoking one at that). I'm not offering an opinion either way on that, just pointing out that if I owned the casino, and didn't want to change, well that would be a powerful argument that would come to mind. However freedom of choice is all important imo. Roll on the day the gala has a bit of competition in nottingham. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 27, 2005, 06:27:43 PM how can you add an option after 90+ people had voted
btw getting 500 votes would be unrealistic if you got 150 i would be shocked Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Karabiner on October 27, 2005, 07:23:24 PM Nottingham's cardroom has a low ceiling, no windows and poor (at best) ventilation.
It is definitely not suitable as a smoking cardroom. Most of the smokers agree. But other cardrooms with high ceilings and good ventilation are perfectly suitable as "smoking" venues. Just another viewpoint. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Bongo on October 27, 2005, 07:40:01 PM There's games in towns nearby and non-stop on the net. So if your chest hurts, etc, and you know you are killing yourself by smoking passively.... why do you go? :dontask: I hadn't been for so long I forgot how bad it was. I probably won't be back again until i've forgotten again. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 27, 2005, 09:14:54 PM how can you add an option after 90+ people had voted btw getting 500 votes would be unrealistic if you got 150 i would be shocked because, a) I was being moaned at and b) people who voted presumable had an opinion one way or the other. how can someone who has already voted to agree or disagree with the statement suddenly decide they're indifferent. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 27, 2005, 10:12:09 PM i voted but i am indifferent
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: M POWER on October 27, 2005, 11:35:36 PM Adam
do you sniff Glue >:? Just asking Regards M Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on October 27, 2005, 11:41:00 PM dont be nasty
adam you could change the voting options to allow us to change our votes Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: tikay on October 27, 2005, 11:46:08 PM Oh nooooooo. Having just seen MPower's post, I am praying Adam does not "bite"......... Well, there has to be a first time, eh? Resist, Adam, RESIST.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: mikkyT on October 27, 2005, 11:51:40 PM Sniffing glue is fun. Don't knock it till you have tried it.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: The Truth on October 27, 2005, 11:55:27 PM sorry couldn't do it - the smell puts me off.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: byronkincaid on October 27, 2005, 11:56:12 PM what type of glue do you find best mikky?
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: The Truth on October 27, 2005, 11:57:59 PM wall paper paste - mmmmm lovely just like the porridge me mammy made
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: byronkincaid on October 28, 2005, 12:03:03 AM i love the smell of creosote
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 28, 2005, 12:07:43 AM evo-stik was good once ::) :blonde:
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: RED-DOG on October 28, 2005, 12:53:00 AM while we are on the subject of substance abuse, I'll tell you about a dog I had as a when I was a boy, an Alsation x ridgeback puppy that my dad bought for my 9th birthday, he cost seven shillings and six pence
Kim, as I called him, was my gardian, constant companion and best friend. He used to sleep under the caravan directly below my bed. When he was about 5 years old and in the prime of his life, he developed a bad case of mange, we did everything we could think of but he just got worse and worse, his coat fell out completly, and his skin was just an ugly red mass, he followed me no longer, his life was a misery of scratching and bleeding. The vet, a close family friend, told us, "I have done all I can, it would be a kindness to put him to sleep On the morning when Kim was due to die, my Dad told me about a cure he had heard of but never tried, when I asked him why not he said he thought it was an old wives tale that couldn't possibly do any good and would probably just mean more suffering for me and the dog, nevertheless, we resolved to give it a go The 'cure' involved mixing about a pint of used sump oil (since found to cause cancer) with a pound of flowers of sulphur, (you cant buy it now, apparently it's used to make bombs) this mixture is rubbed all over the dog When we rubbed it on Kim we regretted it stright away, his screams were pitifull, he cried untill he was exausted. We expected to find him dead the next day, but when I went out to check on him first thing in the morning he greeted me with that old familiar glint in his eye and a wag of his bald tail I took about six months for his coat to re grow fully, but from the moment we used the oil and sulphur he started to mend, it was a miracle I did eventualy take Kim on that last trip to the vet, but by then I was a grown man and he was fourteen After a long and happy life, he was ready Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: tikay on October 28, 2005, 12:58:02 AM Wow Red, a life rich in stories, & an ability to write. You are some lucky fella, & we are lucky to have you.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: jammer on October 28, 2005, 02:26:15 AM The 'cure' involved mixing about a pint of used sump oil (since found to cause cancer) with a pound of flowers of sulphur, (you cant buy it now, apparently it's used to make bombs) this mixture is rubbed all over the dog. You know, that sounds like an excerpt from a description of when you dyed you're hair. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 28, 2005, 04:22:16 AM wouldn't you just love Bill Hicks to be alive just to read his posts in this thread?
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: RED-DOG on October 28, 2005, 10:53:43 AM Bill Hicks has posts in this thread? I bet he would love to be alive to read them too
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 28, 2005, 11:44:22 AM my grammar's bad
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 28, 2005, 12:11:50 PM tell her get well soon.
(In know it's been up before but it's still funny) Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Rod Paradise on October 28, 2005, 01:30:57 PM tell her get well soon. (In know it's been up before but it's still funny) Even I let that one go...... :D Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: lvlarc_uk on October 30, 2005, 12:28:08 AM I voted for ban on smoking I cant stand it!
Im the youngest of 6 and ALL my family smoke but me, so basically my lungs are wrecked too. I read pages 1 - 4 and came across something about there used to be Cocaine on Coca Cola? WTF? If so how long ago was this and what was Coca Cola called before this? Cheers Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: lvlarc_uk on October 30, 2005, 12:41:30 AM Ok just read pages 5 - 9,
Adam I assure you petrol will easily go up with the drog of a cig or match, done it plenty of times with my mates ( when I was a kid ) RED-DOG, beautiful piece about the dog :'( :)up Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Kaibobble on October 30, 2005, 12:54:01 AM I'm a smoker but still think it should be banned.
It can't be nice for a non smoker having to put up with siiting next to a smoker. I hate it when someone leaves a cig in the ashtray and it ends up blowing right in your face. I'm always quite considerate and always ask the people next to me if they mind that I smoke. In which case one person said for medical reasons they couldn't be near cigarette smoke - so it was a good job I asked. The other reason is that in a smoking cardroom I always end up smoking far too much and wake up with a horrid cough. You don't seem to smoke as much if you have to get up from what you are doing to smoke, again the reason I don't smoke in the house. Although by banning smoking it causes the problem of people getting up constantly through out the game and passing out of turn giving other people an advantage at the table. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Kaibobble on October 30, 2005, 12:55:19 AM Plus you end up with a bad smokers cough like my avatar (as Red Dog has pointed out in the past) :D
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: jammer on October 30, 2005, 12:59:03 AM I just realised that there is a distinction to be made here:
1) I am all for non-smoking card rooms. 2) I am all against a _ban_ on smoking in card rooms. The two aren't mutually exclusive. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: ifm on October 30, 2005, 01:18:54 AM I'm always quite considerate and always ask the people next to me if they mind that I smoke. In which case one person said for medical reasons they couldn't be near cigarette smoke - so it was a good job I asked. What the hell are they doing in a smoking card room then?!!! That should be on one of those cable shows, dumb and dumber or some such ;D ;D ;D Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Aria on October 30, 2005, 01:49:51 AM I have never actually played at the Gala Notts but have observed and found it very smoky - can't imagine what my throat and lungs would feel like in the morning if I actually played and sat through hours of it. I am an ex-smoker and the more non-smoking places turning up the better but its a very selfish view as this means less temptation for me to scab a fag and start again. When we smoke we develop nicotine receptors in our brain and these add to the cravings we suffer when being deprived of a cigarette. Basically our body thinks it needs nicotine because of the receptors and triggers off cravings and hence thoughts of cigarettes. Over time of not smoking we manage to deal with cravings and the feelings subside - however the receptors never go! Therefore once a smoker always a smoker and it takes just one cigarette to wake these receptors again and you're back to £packs/day again.
Bring on the non-smoking tables - but provide designated smoking areas, better ventilation........personally a bigger card room at the Gala or a new casino offering these facilities. Aria ;D Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Kaibobble on October 30, 2005, 11:10:23 AM What the hell are they doing in a smoking card room then?!!! That should be on one of those cable shows, dumb and dumber or some such ;D ;D ;D Beats me??? He may have been lying but he was quite convincing. At least he was OK about it. Unlike some guy the other week who was in the smoking area of the Grosvenor and freaked at me for smoking 2 feet behind him, and then followed to scream at my other half and threaten to take his ciggy out his mouth because he accused him of blowing it in his face (which wasn't true). Now this kind of reaction I can't be @ssed with, as he put him self in a smoking environment and then screamed about it. He then went to sit next to another woman who was smoking just to have a moan again. >:? I mean what the hell is all that about? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: AdamM on October 30, 2005, 11:27:07 AM I just realised that there is a distinction to be made here: 1) I am all for non-smoking card rooms. 2) I am all against a _ban_ on smoking in card rooms. The two aren't mutually exclusive. I'm sure it'll be crystal clear when you explain it but I'm missing te distinction Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Robert HM on October 30, 2005, 12:40:48 PM Ask the French, they had a revolution based on liberty
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: snoopy1239 on October 30, 2005, 12:59:39 PM I have never actually played at the Gala Notts but have observed and found it very smoky - can't imagine what my throat and lungs would feel like in the morning if I actually played and sat through hours of it. I am an ex-smoker and the more non-smoking places turning up the better but its a very selfish view as this means less temptation for me to scab a fag and start again. When we smoke we develop nicotine receptors in our brain and these add to the cravings we suffer when being deprived of a cigarette. Basically our body thinks it needs nicotine because of the receptors and triggers off cravings and hence thoughts of cigarettes. Over time of not smoking we manage to deal with cravings and the feelings subside - however the receptors never go! Therefore once a smoker always a smoker and it takes just one cigarette to wake these receptors again and you're back to £packs/day again. Bring on the non-smoking tables - but provide designated smoking areas, better ventilation........personally a bigger card room at the Gala or a new casino offering these facilities. Aria ;D :goodpost: Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Royal Flush on October 30, 2005, 01:19:09 PM Ask the French, they had a revolution based on liberty lol Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: jammer on October 30, 2005, 02:06:49 PM I just realised that there is a distinction to be made here: 1) I am all for non-smoking card rooms. 2) I am all against a _ban_ on smoking in card rooms. The two aren't mutually exclusive. I'm sure it'll be crystal clear when you explain it but I'm missing te distinction Well its simple really: I think there should be non-smoking card rooms (for people like you and I can happily plan in.) However I also think an overarching ban government ban on smoking in all card rooms is imposing a selfish personal desire on the whole population. Hence there should also be some card rooms where the addicted can happily play and puff away in comfort (which are obviously to be avoided if you take responsibility for your health). As such I think my personal standpoint is that I would promote smoking areas (such as walsall), better ventilation and encourage as many non-smoking cardrooms as possible, without stomping my feet for a sweeping ban (bad strategy imo as it entrenches opinion on both sides). Ok, so here's a suggestion for you Adam: instead of demanding a ban, how about you promote a "non-smoking night" in the card room at the gala for starters. If you think there's any merit in that, then let me know (I'll be at the gala with snoops today for the sunday afternoon freezout), and I'll offer my support. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Robert HM on October 30, 2005, 02:23:54 PM In other words, a middle way?
Something that can't be described as "Undecided" or "I don't give a damn" Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on October 31, 2005, 11:00:40 AM certainly worth a try. when I write my letter I will still explain that my preferance would be a smoking ban but if the management feel that is not an option suggest a non smoking day each week. as Sundays there are two tourneys and it's theoretically possible to spend 14 straight hours in the card room, I'll ask that they consider making sundays non-smoking and see how it goes.
Nice to meet Jammer and Snoops sunday in Notts. Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: SupaMonkey on October 31, 2005, 06:21:13 PM I haven't been to notts for ages because of the smoke. If there was a non-smoking night, i would definitely go only on that night.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: M POWER on October 31, 2005, 08:03:11 PM Hello Adam
I met you on sunday too Regards M Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Ironside on December 12, 2005, 02:44:10 PM in the light of recent devolpments anyone remember this thread
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: lazaroonie on December 12, 2005, 03:14:27 PM recent developments ? Eh ? I didnt know there was a card room in Hemel Hempsted....
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: mikkyT on December 12, 2005, 03:45:47 PM DISAGREE [/u]Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: lazaroonie on December 12, 2005, 03:50:15 PM I am a puffer, of the cigar variety, but would ban smoking at the table. Just as I would ban
- drinking - eating - ipods - reading comics etc etc you are there to play cards.... Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: ifm on December 12, 2005, 04:06:14 PM in the light of recent devolpments anyone remember this thread What developments? Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: mikkyT on December 12, 2005, 04:47:11 PM So, pint of john smiths, bowl of nuts, my creative zen touch (but then again you did say ipod) and a copy of poker player magazine (but then again you did say comic) should be the order of the night tonight then? :D
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: Alex B on December 12, 2005, 04:55:44 PM Aiming for 1 smoking night a week to trial the concept is an excellent idea. I would be very confident that once established it would be hugely oversubscribed and there would be huge pressure on the casino to make more and more evenings non-smoking.
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Bongo on December 12, 2005, 06:32:52 PM Quote A turbo diesel 2 litre engine was started and left idling for 30 minutes in the garage, with the doors closed, after which the doors were left open for four hours. The car was fuelled with low sulphur fuel. Three filter cigarettes were then lit up sequentially, and left smouldering for a further 30 minutes. The nicotine and tar content of each cigarette was 1 mg and 11.2 mg, respectively. A portable analyser took readings every two minutes during the experiments. Combined particulate levels in the first hour after the engine had been started measured 88 ug/m3. Those recorded in the first hour after the cigarettes had been lit measured 830 ug/m3: 10 times greater. The diesel engine exhaust doubled the particulate matter levels found outdoors at its peak; the environmental tobacco smoke particulate matter reached levels 15 times those measured outdoors. [Particulate matter from tobacco versus diesel car exhaust: an educational perspective Tobacco Control 2004; 13: 219-21] Contact: Dr Giovanni Invernizzi, Tobacco Control Unit, National Cancer Institute, Milan, Italy Blimy! Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: TheJagster on December 12, 2005, 06:43:56 PM Right then...thats made my mind up.
I vote to ban diesel engines from all card rooms!!! :D Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: ifm on December 12, 2005, 06:51:50 PM For every one of those there's one contradiction.
It's all muddled, nobody knows the truth Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Bongo on December 12, 2005, 07:10:35 PM (http://www.the-cartel.co.uk/x-files.jpg)
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: AdamM on December 12, 2005, 07:15:41 PM lol
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 votes Post by: ifm on December 12, 2005, 08:05:14 PM I just doubt the truth is out there in my lifetime (though smoking, manufacturing cigarettes and selling them will all be illegal i'm sure).
Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Sheriff Fatman on December 13, 2005, 03:05:54 PM Personally I'm in favour of a smoking ban in the entire casino!
After a week spent playing at Luton it was very noticeable how my clothes still stunk of cigarettes every night despite playing in a non-smoking cardroom. I'm not particularly thrilled about my lungs being exposed to that too often. Its not a major issue for me (I put it down as an occupational hazard of playing as 90% of the players seem to be smokers). However, given the choice, that's where my vote would be. Sheriff Title: Re: that old smoking thing again PLEASE VOTE. It's be nice to get Circa 500 vote Post by: Decider on December 13, 2005, 05:02:45 PM Hello,
I'd started a reply to this to say that I was indifferent, giving my reasoning etc... but the more I read it the more I realised that the only sensible option is for a complete ban in public places, including card rooms. I have swayed back and forth on this issue, I am a current smoker who has quit several times and failed each time, I have been running an ex-smokers website for years and still haven't managed to quit. The poll itself adds nothing for me, it was always going to be around 70/30, non-smokers v smokers with a few in between, similar to the consulation results that were reached by the Scottish Executive. Banning it because of the majority decision for me isn't the issue. Banning in as a public health issue is my reason for supporting it. On an aside, the reason they banned smoking in airlines wasn't for health/safety reasons, but more to do with reducing the amount of fuel required as they could reduce the pressure on the aircon/cabin pressure systems. Cheers, Eoan |