blonde poker forum

Short-stack table, $50 max buy-in.

Reads:
BB is 9 tabling, fairly aggro, 35/20/10, but playing fairly robotically post flop due to the multi-tabling.
UTG is value.  Refuses to let go of good starting hands, no matter what.  Made some horrible calls on river to pot-size bets.
Nothing specific on others at the table.

PokerStars Pot-Limit Omaha, $1.00 BB (6 handed) - Poker-Stars Hand Converter (http://www.handhistoryconverter.com/pokerstars.php#converter) from HandHistoryConverter.com

Button ($22.45)
SB ($167.95)
BB ($50)
UTG ($65.50)
MP ($65.50)
Hero (CO) ($180.10)

Preflop: Hero is CO with  Aspades, Jc, 6s,  Th
UTG bets $2, 1 fold, Hero calls $2, Button calls $2, SB calls $1.50, BB raises to $10, UTG calls $8, Hero calls $8, Button calls $8, SB calls $8

Flop: ($50)  Td, 5s, 8s (5 players)
SB checks, BB bets $40 (All-In), UTG raises to $55.50 (All-In),

Hero?

Ehhh? Pretty standard call now getting nearly 3/1.

I thought so too.  Didn't quite expect what followed though.


Hero calls $55.50,
Button calls $12.45 (All-In),
SB raises to $157.95 (All-In),

Hero thinks WTF? and....


Is it a straightforward call, given the pot odds, or can we find a reason to fold here, given that we expect at least one set out there but not sure who's holding it?

My calculations bring it out to be $328 in the pot and $114.50 for you to call giving you 2.9:1. Easy call?

as the crowd used to say on Bullseye....."gamble"

sample of possible hands?

AsJc6sTh    25.07%    148,046    4,867
tt**            53.42%    318,304    4,498
4s7s**    14.05%    81,824    5,042
aa**          7.45%    42,979    3,525

say your equity in main pot is about 65 and say about 50 from a $200 side pot -it seems like a call.



ps I wouldn't play plo 100 at these short buyin tables - the rake will be very difficult to beat as generally you will be swapping coolers/flipping and rarely get a pot where you can outplay your opponents.

Oh there's most likely going to be a set out there and we'd rather more than one if there are any but in this spot even with the NFD and no backdoor redraws I wouldn't fold in a big multiway pot given how the action has gone. SB is most likely to have a set, but it's perfectly possible that all three could have sets, anyway speculating on hands here is pointless as the flop is pretty wet just get it in and hit der spades.

I just shove anyway when it first comes to me.  I kind of do this automatically, so don't get these decisions. 

Much better to hit some backdoor straight than the flush in circumstances like this...

jam flop

In my experience sets are never folding anyway at plo100. Rather keep in or induce worse draws and weak two pair hands to shove that we are fav against. Also we can fold paired turns (and we never fold flop if sb shoves).

I considered this, but flatted in the (what I thought was a longshot) hope of getting overcalls.  Didn't expect to it to end up in a 5-way all-in on the flop.

Anyhow, here's the rest of the hand:

Hero calls $102.45

Turn: ($473.85) 7h (5 players, 4 all-in)

River: ($473.85) 5c (5 players, 4 all-in)

Total pot: $473.85 | Rake: $3

Results:
Button had 7d, 7c, 6d, 4h (full house, sevens over fives).
SB had Qs, 9c, 7s, Qd (two pair, Queens and fives).
BB had Kc, 2d, 4s, Ks (two pair, Kings and fives).
UTG had Kd,  Ts,  Tc, Jh (full house, tens over fives).
Hero had  Aspades, Jc, 6s, Th (two pair, tens and fives).
Outcome: SB won $204.90, UTG won $265.95

I did call, thinking along the same lines as the responses posted.  However, it's arguably a piss-poor decision looking at the equities from twodimes.net, particularly if we consider the possibility that the holdings could be in a different order (i.e. if the big stack had the set of tens here, then it's a crappy spot).  Obviously results orientated to begin with but, thinking about it further, you'd have to assume that there were at least two sets out there combined with a number of flush draws which doesn't really leave many nut-flush outs in the deck.  Basically, SB's holding is about as good as I could have wished for and we're effectively coin-flipping for the side pot (and obv I don't win flips)

http://twodimes.net/h/?z=7425314
pokenum  -o kd ts tc jh  - as jc 6s th  - 7d 7c 6d 4h  - qs 9c 7s qd  - kc 2s 4s ks  -- td 5s 8s
Omaha Hi: 406 enumerated boards containing 8s 5s Td
cards          win   %win  lose  %lose  tie  %tie     EV
Ts Tc  Kd  Jh  166  40.89   237  58.37    3  0.74  0.413
Aspades 6s  Jc  Th   62  15.27   341  83.99    3  0.74  0.156
7c 7d  6d  4h   79  19.46   323  79.56    4  0.99  0.200
Qs 7s  9c  Qd   69  17.00   333  82.02    4  0.99  0.175
Ks 4s  2s  Kc   23   5.67   383  94.33    0  0.00  0.057

Just started trying out the PLO cash games and thought this was a pretty spectacular hand.  No doubt you regulars out there will be telling me that the 5-way all ins will be second nature soon enough!

You're only in such shitty shape because everyone else has flush draws as well.

Just a cold one mate.

Don't worry about it.

fold pre too imo

This, wrong sort of hand to call a 3 bet with imo, cards need to work together a bit more for me..................

Point taken, and it's an easy fold if I'd been facing a $10 3-bet to begin with, but the pot is 5-way when faced with the additional $8 call, with the likelihood that there'll be two overcalls to come so I'm expecting to call $8 into a pre-flop pot of $50.

I'm in there for the nut-flush prospect only, but it's one of those hands where I get sucked in further and further (far more of them in PLO than Holdem so I need to be wary of this I guess).

Its a call even with all hands face up - you are almost flipping with the sb (46/54) - so the 15% equity from the main pot (that you lose if you fold) is enough to cover the small loss to the sb in the side pot.

FYP

what if one of the two behind shoves?

Easy fold in that case, unless it's the short-stack who shoves and everyone else calls.  Then it might be a odds-dictated call.  However, I honestly don't expect that to happen on this table.  Everyone's just coming along for the ride as the pot odds improve with each caller.

Definitely would be bad to fold pre here. At 50PLO its very unlikely to get repotted pre and you can safely assume that everyone else behind is going to call the $10, meaning that we also should call.

wrong

Ignore anything Cos says,he is ridic bad at the omaha pokers

I'd be interested in your rationale for calling here a bit more. We are so ridc dominated by everything apart from the flush and with so many people in your going to be dodging a full house even if you make your flush. If we had AJT9 I'd say call but surely the 6 makes the hand so much worse? The A is basically useless apart from flush value. I personally think winning at smaller limits is partly about playing fundamentally stronger starting hands, all the 2 plus 2 fish have been watching the card runners crew lag it up at higher limits which is obv a different game to what we are playing, let them do it imo and us nittier players will benefit surely?

OK I'm a fish but I'd still like to learn, please tell me why I'm wrong?

Three broadways with a suited ace is rarely a fold preflop and obv calling the minraise is fine. Calling the 3bet really isn't an issue because thats simply a pot odds call. If you agree that its very unlikely to be repotted pre and that nobody is gunna fold then you are effectively being laid 5.25 to 1 to make the call pre. At 50PLO people just aren't creative enough to repot a hand like 789T behind you imo.

small stakes PLO is and always has been super loose passive in my experience. If you'd care to elaborate as to why thats not that case, feel free...

Well I've prob played a few hundred k hands at 25c50c PLO and in my experience someone would often squeeze here to try and thin the field getting a great price for their hand.

This isn't 50 plo, it's short buyin 100plo - so much more likely to be agg preflop.

fyp.

My only reference point is from a couple of years ago when I was in these games but unless 50 or 100PLO has got tougher and more aggro then I think the preflop call is fine. The fact that its a short buyin table imo makes it way more fishy and therefore less likely to be aggro preflop

Imo we should defo call the extra $8 cos we're in now, but I dont like entering the pot initially, The hand (spades aside) has very little exclusive equity in a lot of instances in such a limpy game as low stakes SS plo similar combo's and pair hands that squeeze behind have us pretty crushed. Its defo not terrible, but I dont think callcalling these hands from 50bbs is going to show much profit, id much rather be waiting for awesome squeeze spots pre or until i have a wrap :)

If UTG wasn't the value at the table I would just fold pre flop, but with that to consider calling is OK, but 3betting to $6 would be preferable, get the pot HU with the guy you want to be playing. As played call the 3bet pre and snap all in on the flop.