blonde poker forum

I met this guy around Christmas last year probably and weve been fairly good friends since. He's been pretty broke throughout that time, he doesnt have a job, the odd spin up or upswing here and there, but mainly struggling financially. He loves poker, plays whenever he can. He plays the £10/£20/£30 comps at Gala, the occasional cash game and deals for tips after hours in the cash games. He doesn't spend money on anything besides poker, food and rent. When he had a bit of money and was playing cash regularly, if he was having a bad night, he'd often ask for the odd 100 or 200 to carry on playing, saying he had the cash at home he just didn't bring it out with him. I always complied because I knew he had the money to pay me back and he was always fairly prompt in doing so although not always. I probably lent him money 6-10 times over the past few months. I was never totally at ease doing it though as there's some dodgy things about his past that he keeps quiet but has told me, a few things dont add up in some spots, he doesn't speak to his parents etc etc and I never liked giving him money to gamble with when he wasnt rolled for the games.

Recently he's been really struggling though, trying really hard to get a roll together, grinding micro stakes online to try and make a bit of dollar. He says hes applied for a few jobs but he's been saying that for months and I've no reason to believe that these efforts are likely to bear any fruition. I keep saying he should sign on but there's something funny there, don't know why he hasn't yet. He doesn't have enough to play the comps at gala anymore and stays in grinding online coming to gala late on to try and get a spot dealing to earn some money. We haven't been hanging out as much as a result and I don't see him/speak to him as often these days.

Almost exactly a month ago I was going away for the weekend and he sent me a text asking to borrow 100quid to "get him through the weekend". He said he didn't have enough for food and had no-one else to turn to. He said his landlord owed him a few hundred quid from his deposit and was getting that back on the Monday. I really wasn't comfortable lending him the money this time as I didn't believe I was all that likely to get it back and I knew he'd probably use an unwise %age of the 100 to play poker rather than save it for future food etc. This was pre Monte Carlo as well so I was still grinding off a 4k roll so didn't exactly have money to give away. I should have just given him enough for the necessities.

Anyway, against my better judgement I lent him the money and unfortunately haven't been paid back. I know he played a 20£ comp that weekend and was told he sat with 50 on the cash game one night. He made his excuses for a few days about why he didn't have the money and then I binked the Monte Carlo and obv didn't feel like chasing him up for 100quid after that. He's given me a lot of support since we've met, when he couldn't afford to play himself he sat behind me a lot watching me play, asking me questions (no wonder he's broke yeh yeh) and railed a large portion of monte carlo days 2 and 3 and came out celebrating with us on the night (think I remember giving him 20quid that night for drinks).

Anyway, we haven't spoken much since then, the odd phone call and text. A few days ago he texts me asking if I can help him out, needs some money for food and has no1 else to turn to. Basically same story as before.

Wwyd?

Sorry if this is tl;dr but I can't sleep and I thought I'd give all the history to save answering more questions later.

You've learnt a life lesson about lending money to brokeass poker players.

It cost you £100.

Move on.

Give him a £20 Tesco voucher and explain from now on this stops.

In order to stop teh freeze out, just send him a text saying not to worry about the 100 he owes, but for him not to ask you for money again as it makes you feel uncomfortable (Im assuming you still want to be his friend?)

Winner/

I was out playing once and after the comp we had a fun dealer's choice game going. A guy asked me if i've lend him £100 as he'd pretty much ran out of money for the month. We get on well enough and I see him there often enough so I was happy to lend it him. I end up going home before him and he's pretty much even in the game.

I then went back tomorrow and during the break in poker headed upstairs and found him sat with a chunk on roulette. At this point I simply went up to him and demanded my money back. I lent it him to play poker with not to spunk away at roulette. And seeing as I called him out on it in front of people he didn't have much of a choice but to give it me.

A few months later and he doesn't turn up anymore but quite a few people saying they've lent him money but not got it back...

That said I will happily lend money to certain people and have never had a problem with getting it back. I will only lend money now to people who I consider to be friends. If they're more "poker acquaintances" then the answer will be no.

In your case the guy doesn't have a job. How do you expect to get your money back? If he sits down and loses it's gone and he needs to ask for more. And he's now at the point he's gambling with money he can't afford. It sounds like he's got something of a gambling problem to me. He'd be much better off finding himself some shitty job or signing on. Quite apart from losing your money I don't think you're doing him any favours lending him money to gamble with.

"Neither a borrower nor a lender be" IMO

This. Learnt it the hard way.

He probably thinks cos you've had a bink £100 is neither here nor there to you now.

For me it's the principle- if he was honest with you and asked for an extension on the loan I'm sure you'd say yes cos you're a nice guy- it's just the fact that he's ignoring it which makes things awkward.

+1

Be thankful its only 100 quid, lot of scumbags in poker

This

Alex,

There's your answer.

We've all been there, done that. Just consider that you done £100, but now your man has reached his credit limit, & you've got off cheap. It's how I've always dealt with nippers. I'm a soft touch for a nip, always have been, but I've always taken the view that the first touch is the cheapest way out, & £100 is a cheap price to pay for a lesson in life.

"Fool me once, shame on you.  Fool me twice, shame on me."

But don't listen to me, listen to the master....

YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eKgPY1adc0A

I did say no. I'm just feeling a bit shit right now thinking that someone is going hungry when I could easily help them out.

Why does everyone assume because he is late paying that he won't get the original 100 back?

Rightly or wrongly because Alex won his friend doesn't view it as urgent but doesn't mean he won't get it.

Alex! You gotta man up.

When it comes to money, don't EVER feel sorry for anyone who can afford (or not, as in this case) to play poker.

There are many losing poker players who are just addicted to the game, & will do anything to touch someone for a buy-in. The way to help them is not to give them money to feed their addiction. 

Maybe he could try Sports Arbitrage, make some money there and pay you back that way

Mate this is where you have to make a judement call imo.

Easy for people to say he's a nipping bar steward etc etc.

How close a friend is he? As Dubai says, is he likely to come through with it? He may be feeling just as awkward about it as you are.

I think he probably will come through with it eventually. He's a decent guy.

If he can pay the 100, do u think he could and would pay 200 eventually whether it be in 2 lots of 100 etc?

If yes then ship him another ton

Yeah, I think Jakally will pay up, although I think it's clear he has spent the money mainly on food.

Well fine, lend him the dough, then!

But this sentence does not sit well with me.....

".....I'm just feeling a bit shit right now thinking that someone is going hungry when I could easily help them out......"

He can afford to play (presumably, losing) poker, but he can't afford to eat? If we are skinto, we can feed oursellf on a tenner a week if we put our mind to it.

Well yes, it's deciding whether THIS time the money really is just for food. He can't afford to play poker anymore and hasn't been. He says he's just been sitting in his house all day with nothing to do...

If you think he will pay back then even if he wants it to mainline heroin you should prob ship if it's a friend
If you think he defo won't pay back but know for sure it's for essential living costs then u should prob ship if it's a friend

It's when a) he isn't that close a friend and/or b) you think he is lying and should just say need a ton to play with- that you shouldn't ship

Can't afford to play poker any more? Sitting in the house all day with nothing to do? That's not what your OP suggested, Alex.......

".....Recently he's been really struggling though, trying really hard to get a roll together, grinding micro stakes online to try and make a bit of dollar......"   

And, in the earlier instance......

"....Anyway, against my better judgement I lent him the money and unfortunately haven't been paid back. I know he played a 20£ comp that weekend and was told he sat with 50 on the cash game one night......"

I guess it depends, as Dubai wisely noted - what sort of friend is he? If he's a proper friend, ship him the money, no questions asked. But your Posts suggest you doubt this. There are many definitions of "friend" these days......

If he's starving this guy needs to sign on and get whatever he deserves from the state.

They won't let him go hungry, it doesn't work that way.

He isn't your responsibility so don't feel guilty at all. You've already helped him by lending him £100. Make no mistake, if you lend him money it's for poker/roulette/black jack or something similar. Even if he spends your £100 on food it's only because he's spent a different £100 on gambling.

I've made the mistake of dishing out loans left, right and centre when I've been flush because the money doesn't matter.

Unfortunately one day the money does matter and these people are never in a position to pay you back.

They still manage to go out at weekends and have holidays but for some reason they can't afford to pay me back. Strange eh?

You have an oportunity to learn from other people's mistakes so make the most of it and keep your hard earned money to yourself.

That being said I know you're a nice guy so you'll probably lend it to him anyway. If you do I'd have a serious chat with him and make it clear that he gets £100 more and that's his absolute limit. There will be no more under any circumstances.

If he then comes to you again in the future you know he's just taking the piss so I wouldn't worry about him at all.

That's true tikay. I'm not sure whether he's still playing microstakes or whether he can't even afford to play them anymore. He just says he doesn't have anything to do all day.

I'm not sure what sort of friend he is....I mean, I dont trust him. I enjoy his company and we have a laugh together, he's been very supportive of me through downswings and everything and I know he looks up to me.

I've lent money to people who fit this description. It's generally a shit idea.

He a dwarf?

'The best thing that can come from lending money, is being paid back'.

That said, there's a lot of people I have/do/would lend money to but wouldn't lend to anyone that I'd ever question paying me. Been there done that. In fact, I'm owed money from years ago by a few Notts Gala regs who are amongst the most degen people of any casino I've ever been to.

Just tell this guy no because it becomes hard to draw a line after that

Gtfo and stop posting on blonde when yr missus is right next to you wishing you'd talk to her.

I really don't buy that "I'm bored, I've got nothing to do" line, & never have, I'm afraid. I see it so often on Twitter "I'm SOOOOOO bored ffs".

Can he not use the internet, read a book, watch TV, get some exercise, get a hobby, or do a million other things that cost less than poker?

You don't trust him, you say? And he's a friend? Sorry Alex, guess my age means there are some things I don't understand in modern society. A friend you don't trust? Do you really mean that, or do you mean he's an acquaintance? Different thing entirely!

Good post Alex. I think that it's good that subjects like this are brought out into the open, particularly on a poker forum. IMO gambling addiction and the problems that arise from it are a much more serious issue than most in the industry are prepared to acknowledge.
 I dont know if your friend has a serious gambling problem but i do think that borrowing money to gamble, or lending someone money to gamble is not a good idea.
 From my own experience of lending money, i would say that, unless you are 100% certain that you will get your money back without even having to ask for it, dont do it. Even if its a relatively insignificant amount, being owed the money, will nag at you and give you more stress than its worth.
 I agree with the saying that Taximan quoted 'neither a lender nor a borrower be'.
 If you do believe that the guy concerned is a true friend, talk to him about the issue, write off the previous  loan. If necessary, give him a little bit more help, but not to just throw away via uncontrolled gambling. Maybe help him with a bit of BRM / coaching.
 Try and do the right thing, the good karma may help you to run better. As a genral rule when people ask for a loan for gambling purposes, just say NO.

I've already told him, I will only pay him back if he can go a decent  length of time without mentioning the words 'Monte Carlo'.... I suggested  a period of 2 hours but he told me  to GTFO and come up  with something that he at  least has a chance of achieving.
 

Probably's  not good enough mate........this is a long term losing play.

Well it can only be a breakeven play at best dr goblin.

The richest man in belper does raise a good point though re monte carlo. Does alex mention it more than herbie mentions the hendon mob?

It's not like that at all! I'm on another level whenever I mention it.

Those saying "lesson learned, it cost you 100 now move on". Are you saying I shouldntve lent him the 100 a month ago? Or before when he did have the money to pay me back?

Not at all.

Most of us, in your spot, would have loaned him that first £100.

Why isn't this in your diary thread?

Then why is it lesson learned? Lesson learned implies, "you'll know not to do that again".


Decided against it.

When you Loaned him the FIRST £100, surely you expected him to repay you?

And he did not.

Now he wants to borrow some more........

We seem to be on a disconnect here.

We lend a mate or an acquaintance (not a "friend", that's different) £100.

He fails to pay us back in a timely manner.

Then he asks to borrow another £100.

To me, that's "we learned a lesson, it cost us £100", unless he can come up with a convincing tale.  I'd not be cross with myself for losing the first £100, I did the right thing & it cost me £100, too bad, move on, but I would be mad with myself for being suckered for the 2nd £100.

And you already said "I don't trust him"!

Yeah you should know not to do it again.

I'm not in the never loan anyone camp.

If I like someone I am happy to lend them money but I only do it the once, you don't get any more until you have shown your good for the first lot.

Apart from my close friends I also treat it as money lost, I hope to get it back but need to be sure that I really don't care if I don't.

It's well worth a hundo to find out about someone, the guy you mention doesn't sound like a mate let alone a friend.

+1

Also, he didn't pay you back on the first loan when it was made before you binked, and was a much more significant sum to you at the time.

Now he knows you're much more secure financially and, in his mind, can absorb another £100 hit makes it infinitely more likely that he grims you for the second loan aswell, IMO.

If you feel bad about it then sure, lend pay him the money again, but treat it in your mind as though you're thanking him for railing you (similar to the £20) and don't in any way expect it to be paid back.  If he comes through with the money some day then treat it as a bonus.

Cool.

Lend us £100.

Ok cool. I think I've done the right thing. Cheers guys. Hope Mitch understands.

Pathetic. Get your own jokes, already done the 'drop a name in' one.

ive heard willie tann will be playing the gukpt at luton friday..................why not get the £100 back then??

By posting this thread you obv dont want to loan him the money and are just looking for better justification than "I dont trust u to pay it back so no".  You deffo need to cut this guy off before it gets worse

Give a man 5 fish and he will be able to feed his family for a week. Teach a man to fish and he will be able to provide for his family forever.

Coach & Stake him imo.

You say he sits at home all day with nothing to do!

Is there any reason he can't get his arse into an agency and take the 'job no one else wants ? ' because it IS there.

Does he want to work or does he NEED to work ? (there is a difference)

:goodpost:

Probably just can't be arsed to work.

Sad but so true.

FYP

Pretty much agree with everything Dubai said itt.

If it was me then the fact he's paid me back all the other times and I had some spare cash then I'd give him it.

Lol too good

Mitch hates people regurgitating jokes. He has a points system and WILL deduct.

Considering I'm pretty sure I know who this "friend" is, this is a fairly tough spot imo. Any decision yet? (I'm really bored all day)

Love this. Especially as you have form for it...