Ukipt hand vs young gun

[stato_1]

Also not knowing what to do vs a raise is not an argument that suggests we should check the turn. Obviously we know that we end up getting raised here, but I think getting raised is reasonably unlikely, and we lose so much value when people check back with hands they would have called with

[Boba Fett]

I really hate cib the turn in this spot, especially if we are checking most rivers to him from oop, considering he has just went ballistic very recently trying to bluff us we're just giving him an incredible spot to pot the river as a bluff again, which might not be a bad thing generally but Im not sure how good our hand actually is on this board to snap a river shove, I guess you could just check/snap him off on any non-heart/A/9/T/maybe 6 river and hope he doesnt have TT but I think just calling his turn raise gives you way more options on the river

Edit- as played I think river is a fold

[rfgqqabc]

Turn is an absolute must lead. Checking is a huge leak imo. What to do now is pretty interesting not really sure. Don't think we can fold just yet and not a raise fan so guess call and re-evaluate. Usually the line I take when I haven't got a clue what to do!

It's so difficult though because we don't really know what he has. If I knew him and thought he was pretty good, I'd be tempted to fold the turn. If he was a bit spazzy and took odd/aggro lines a bit too much then I'd call and fold all bad rivers.

You do know him I'd imagine. I was going to say who it was but it seems kinda unfair on the player. I think your image may have been more active than you think Wazz. I had 2 mates on the table and they both thought you were quite splashy/active.

[pleno1]

Sick 2 mates brag

[Rexas]

Turn is an absolute must lead. Checking is a huge leak imo. What to do now is pretty interesting not really sure. Don't think we can fold just yet and not a raise fan so guess call and re-evaluate. Usually the line I take when I haven't got a clue what to do!

It's so difficult though because we don't really know what he has. If I knew him and thought he was pretty good, I'd be tempted to fold the turn. If he was a bit spazzy and took odd/aggro lines a bit too much then I'd call and fold all bad rivers.

You do know him I'd imagine. I was going to say who it was but it seems kinda unfair on the player. I think your image may have been more active than you think Wazz. I had 2 mates on the table and they both thought you were quite splashy/active.

Picken on thinking live players are splashy shocker

[rfgqqabc]

Turn is an absolute must lead. Checking is a huge leak imo. What to do now is pretty interesting not really sure. Don't think we can fold just yet and not a raise fan so guess call and re-evaluate. Usually the line I take when I haven't got a clue what to do!

It's so difficult though because we don't really know what he has. If I knew him and thought he was pretty good, I'd be tempted to fold the turn. If he was a bit spazzy and took odd/aggro lines a bit too much then I'd call and fold all bad rivers.

You do know him I'd imagine. I was going to say who it was but it seems kinda unfair on the player. I think your image may have been more active than you think Wazz. I had 2 mates on the table and they both thought you were quite splashy/active.

Picken on thinking live players are splashy shocker

Wazz is an online omaha player afaik. And I'm just relaying other peoples views!

[wazz]

Hand hasnt generated as much discussion as I expected, thought it was a very interesting spot, guess I'll give results: I called river and villain had KJo.

[AlexMartin]

given his tendencies he might be a player where ripping turn is best, ie he is raising a bunch of turned combodraws/ we are oop/oppo playes v well on rivers/we guess on 1/2 the deck and dont know his bluffing frequencies/pot is decent.

[Pinchop73]

Hand hasnt generated as much discussion as I expected, thought it was a very interesting spot

Could you possibly lay out your thoughts to initiate the discussion you we're expecting this hand to generate?

Apologies if my unorthodox (or just plain bad, you decide) thought's killed your thread

[Doobs]

Sorry Wazz, had read your exit report, so thought it better not to contribute.  River pretty horrid.  UL.

[SuuPRlim]

What are stacks OTT. Is a jam too big? CIB let's him peel his draws and jam his TT, tough for him to make a mistake there really unless he goes allin which would be very silly of him vs pretty much uncapped range

[wazz]

I specifically thought that, while he would certainly be valueraising TT and J9 ott, the board is dry enough and he has a bdfd 33% of the time such that I could discount some of his J9 - perhaps 50% of them, at a guess, but possibly much lower. Anyway, with two guys behind him, I didn't think he would want to flat that many draws with two guys to act behind when he could rep such a strong hand, and I sorta pegged him as the optimistic type - 'he knows that I know that I'm repping a narrow range so this should be credible' sorta thing.

Thus I thought that his turn range was largely populated by draws, some of them quite weak, including a bunch of Ax hearts. Only A9/AJ/AK/KJhh c-bet the flop (probably?) and possibly bottom or middle pair with a fd (can't remember which was the heart). A jam only gets calls from him when he does in fact have TT/9J or other random hands that beat me (thought he wouldn't slowplay QT/88/66 almost ever), and big combo draws like A9/AJ/AK/KJhh, but a call gives him a free shot to hit all those hands, whereas a cib allows me to get value, even if he isn't making a mistake by calling.

Given my image was active I thought there was even a chance he could think I was at it myself and have him punt it in there and then. I also thought that, because his range was mostly flush draws, I would just close my eyes and check-call any bet on a non-heart river and possibly some hearts too if it felt right. Just flatting the turn doesn't allow me to get as much value from his bluffs.

[Sulphur man]

Fold pre. Reverse implied odd's and Hero's hand MEHquity. Let's not get into an ego war oop in multiway pots and save some brainpower for when its needed. Just my opinion im a nit though.

[Sulphur man]

Turn is an absolute must lead. Checking is a huge leak imo. What to do now is pretty interesting not really sure. Don't think we can fold just yet and not a raise fan so guess call and re-evaluate. Usually the line I take when I haven't got a clue what to do!

It's so difficult though because we don't really know what he has. If I knew him and thought he was pretty good, I'd be tempted to fold the turn. If he was a bit spazzy and took odd/aggro lines a bit too much then I'd call and fold all bad rivers.

You do know him I'd imagine. I was going to say who it was but it seems kinda unfair on the player. I think your image may have been more active than you think Wazz. I had 2 mates on the table and they both thought you were quite splashy/active.

Just spotted this which reinforces my call to fold pre. Maybe wazz was bored.