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Author Topic: Bad Beats  (Read 5988 times)
Karabiner
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« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2005, 11:28:46 PM »

"The crack cocaine" of poker !

An excellent allegory, why didn't I think of that ?
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chrisbruce
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« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2005, 11:34:00 PM »

One more thing

I have yet to meet anybody who admits to losing reguarly at online poker. In fact Im not sure if I have met anyone who admits to a loss overall in online poker.

strange?
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Karabiner
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« Reply #17 on: June 20, 2005, 11:36:25 PM »

Well I'm a good loser on Pokerstars, cannot win there.

But other sites I have won consistently over the last two years.

So that's half an admission.

 Wink
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« Reply #18 on: June 20, 2005, 11:38:39 PM »

I'll admit to it, though I also say I am learning and the trend is in reverse
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« Reply #19 on: June 20, 2005, 11:47:48 PM »

I have consistently argued on blonde, and elsewhere, that there is NO REASON WHATSOEVER for online sites to "fix" the cards. It does not earn them any more money, so why should they do it? Think MOTIVE. What IS their motive?

I dunno, I assume if the poker rooms can create more "action flops" they'll obviously create more action and hence more rake, but that would surely be a negligible amount pro rata, and if any fixing got out to the general public, the loss in custom would more than make up for any extra juice they'd take. I agree, there is no motive as long as they're thinking anything other than ultra short-term.
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Karabiner
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« Reply #20 on: June 20, 2005, 11:53:03 PM »

Seriously though Sunday in limit holdem you get more "bad beats" than any other game.

There are more players in for the flop, turn and river.

So if you run bad at it..........
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« Reply #21 on: June 20, 2005, 11:58:29 PM »

Maybe the random card generator is unintentionally not random.
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Bongo
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« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2005, 12:09:47 AM »


3. Online sites favour drawing hands ( a flush draw is 50%+ on line - imoa)


Do/did you play more flush draws online then?
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tikay
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« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2005, 12:20:02 AM »

Sunday, of COURSE you can call me tomorrow about that other matter, tonight is a case closed jobbie. Evening would be best, please.

Chris - nice post. But think MOTIVE. Why would they wanna "fix" the software ro draw you into pots? I only play SNG's online as a rule, 'cos I cant make money in any other online format, the sites take a flat reg fee, & it don't matter if I go out first or last, quick or slow, they all get the same reg fee.

Now consider bad beats. By definition, for every bad beat there is the opposite, lets call it a suckout. So, for every curly lip, there's a happy bunny. Without exception, the numbers match EXACTLY. We can listen to folks regaling us with their bad beats all day & night, but there HAS to be - definitely positively, indisputibly - EXACTLY the same number of suckouts. It's a given!

It's how we perceive luck that is key. Consider my performance at The Gutshot the other week for a moment. I spent 7 hours plus before exiting, & the only playable pairs or decent hands I had were 99, AQ, & AK, which I had early on & won the blinds with. Was that lucky, or unlucky? Most would say unlucky, but I saw it different. If I survived to the Final, I did so by stealing, countless times before I eventually got caught. So I see that as LUCKY. If any of my oppos had had any sort of hand any of the times I stole, I would likely have been busted. So I must have been LUCKY. 2 pairs in 7 hours is lucky? Depends how you view it, see?

But you then go on to say that you prefer & why, live poker. So do I, as it happens, but that's an entirely different argument. But let's not forget those to whom online poker is a godsend. The disabled, the guys that cant get a pass from their missus, or cant afford "live" stakes - remember, you can play for micro stakes online. I know a top tourney pro whose wife is gravely ill, he cant get out any more, but for a few hours each day he has a release from his 24/7 care of his wife, and he can play a bit of poker & keep an eye on her at the same time. So maybe I over defend online integrity, but we need to remember that it's all that some folks have, & to suggest it is bent serves no useful purpose.

Sunday - no, NOBODY is getting annoyed, it's been a good debate, & you can always rely on a few blondeites to put the different arguments in perspective.

Karabiner makes a good point too, his advice is worth taking on board, he's played the game for 123 years.

We have had a good debate, so don't be doing the hangdog bit, it's been fun, & we've exercised a few demons.
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Jimmy B
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« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2005, 12:34:00 AM »

Well I'm a good loser on Pokerstars, cannot win there.

To continue the spirit, until recently I'd lost on every site I've used apart from Betfair!

I think everyone has these doubts about online sites early on. I've only been playing a year myself - played a bit, lost a bit, learnt a bit, won a bit more, lost a bit, couldn't understand it, sulked, lost a lot more. It went in patterns like this and at some point or other I decided "no way - its all rigged". So I figured I'd better try another site. Eventually I spotted the pattern - I'd be playing badly because of a few bad beats and so lose more than I should have. Then I'd go open a new account on another site and, still playing badly, funnily enough lose even more!

I've now got back into profit on Bet365 playing Rounders. Just hit my worst run on it so far having lost 5 Level 3's in a row (4th was verging on sulky, 5th I played terrible after going on tilt early on because I missed a flush draw!!! but did get a bit unlucky too at the end).

So I'm off my game and not getting any luck either and I'm cursing coz I've just lost enough to enter a Final straight out. Was about to give up for the night and then I read some of the responses to this thread. So I cleared my head and jumped back in determined to play a decent game. I think when you're off your game a bit the best way forward is to go into a game with a plan and stick to it - I decided to fold everything preflop unless I thought I was ahead - leave the clever plays for when I'm in the right frame of mind to escape from them when it goes wrong. Well, I stuck to the plan - I've played far better poker - but I sit there fold, fold, fold, fold, isn't this fun, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold, fold. Sticking to the plan I actually only got three playable preflop hands, 99 - won the blinds, 66 - doubled up defending a blind steal, AQs - um, tied with AK.

One of the other winners at the end of the game says "Bet you enjoyed that <Jimmy>!" and I'm like "YYYEEEAHHHH MAN! Was beginning to think I'd never win one again!". Moral of the story - ending a bad run can feel as good as your best ever winning streak...
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tikay
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« Reply #25 on: June 21, 2005, 12:38:59 AM »

GREAT post Jimmy, especially the final para.

Sunday - "leg-end"? I hope you aint referring to my shorts. Then I would tilt up......Shorts, jacket, Age - and you aint seen NOTHING yet. More fashion shocks in store from the 'ol fella, I promise..
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« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2005, 12:56:33 AM »

People don't realise how important tilting is in online poker.

If you're a solid player who can master the art of not tilting, then you've got a fighting chance.  Cool

I'm a solid disciplined player and I'd always associated titling with losing a pot and then throwing away the rest of your chips in anger or frusration. But it's so much more than that.

Nowadays, not tilting to me means a whole heap of things. Conquering these will improve your game ten fold. Soemtimes you can tilt (chase, force, play to quickly, etc) without even realsiing.

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londonpokergirl
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« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2005, 01:48:24 AM »

Yeah I don't tilt either, I might spit me dummy out and utter a few obscenities Smiley  but i've found that if you
have a hand where you are absolutely miles infront and somebody hits runner runner then
you are better going to make a cuppa tea and sit out for 5 mins than play after that hand

It makes you a better poker player , and also u don't do your stack!!
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tikay
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« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2005, 01:50:26 AM »


Hi Mmel,

How's your little, err umm, how's Declan?
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Jimmy B
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« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2005, 02:08:59 AM »

Cheers tikay Smiley

And yeah Snoopy thats true. The worst form of tilt is the "throw" it all away in anger. I'd like to say I'll never do that again but I guess thats optimistic, though the more I play, the more I enjoy the game and understand the ebbs and flows, the less it happens. My two main tilts these days are (i) slow-burning tilts where I'm off my game as I've lost a bit of confidence after a bad run - normally this ends up with me playing a little looser and fishier than normal, and also letting people outdraw me, (ii) a complete inability to play after a big win.

The first I'm getting better at noticing and rectifying, if it gets bad I go to my over-tight B game above - not optimal but in most games its probably break-even and its always going to bring me a win sooner or later.

The second I don't fully get yet - somewhat less experience of that! But I'm going to have to learn how to deal with it after I win the WSOP next year Grin
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