Would you fold this???????

[M3boy]

Just a bit of background, PDee had moved all in on the last 4 times I have limped on his BB from the SB, including me telling him "just keep doing it" after the 2nd time.
Also, the money is the top 2.

Multi-Table Tournament
Table Name Hand ID Game Stakes
MTT Table 1 13480660-261 Holdem No Limit 600/1,200
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Hand Start.
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Seat 1 : BoyM3 has $12,531
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Seat 4 : PDee has $16,672
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Seat 8 : alfiesdad has $8,789
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Seat 9 : conasatatu has $10,008
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : conasatatu is the dealer.
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : BoyM3 posted small blind.
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : PDee posted big blind.
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Game [261] started with 4 players.
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Dealing Hole Cards.
[Nov 24 00:53:13] : Seat 1 : BoyM3 has Ah
[Nov 24 00:53:17] : alfiesdad folded.
[Nov 24 00:53:22] : conasatatu folded.
[Nov 24 00:53:24] : BoyM3 called 600
[Nov 24 00:53:27] : Stakes: 600/1,200 Current level: 9 Level up in: 17 min. Break in: 3 min. Players : 4
[Nov 24 00:53:30] : PDee checked.
[Nov 24 00:53:30] : Dealing flop.
[Nov 24 00:53:30] : Board cards [ ]
[Nov 24 00:53:33] : BoyM3 checked.
[Nov 24 00:53:35] : PDee checked.
[Nov 24 00:53:36] : Dealing turn.
[Nov 24 00:53:36] : Board cards [ ]
[Nov 24 00:53:38] : BoyM3 bet 1,700
[Nov 24 00:53:45] : PDee called 1,700 and raised 13,772 and is All-in

Do you fold or call?? Also reasons please and what hand you put PDee on.

I folded and typed in the chat box what I had.

BTW, I went on to win that tourney

[M3boy]

18 views and no one has an opinion?

Come on, share your thoughts!!

[doubleup]

I think this is ok - when you slow play AA, the downside is you have to make laydowns like this.

 

[The_Diamond]

I think its a bad fold. Big all ins like this  more often than not are jus one pair. It's easier to fold if you show some strength on the flop.

[moritzey]

Would've 'tested the waters' on the flop already. If he's such a maniac, as you described, he could interpret your bet on the river as a 50/50 between actually having a hand and a stone cold bluff. Based on that, I'd give him credit for a hand about every other time. Still enough chips left to play, though, so you might as well wait for a better spot, I suppose.

[Raindogs]

No.  The fact he has been pushing you around and there is a straight and 2 flush draws on the board leads me to think he has a draw or has paired the Q (can't see him moving in unless he has at least a Q)

The fact that he has pushed you off the last 4 times you limped in, but not the fifth time, suggests he is weak.  If I was in his position and you limped in a fifth time I would be very suspicious.  Given this is 4 handed I would expect him to raise with a PP given his past actions so I can't see him having a set.  Having said all that if he is a good player and is suspicious of your limp in the SB it would tie up with his check on the flop.  If he has rags like 34 or 48 for the straight draw and he thinks you are trapping, the sensible play for him is to check because if he hits it would be difficult for you to put him on a straight and he may get all your chips if you have been trappping with a big PP or AQ.

I guess the decision comes down to how you rate the player.  If he seems to be a good player then you can make the laydown based on the assumption that the guy is giving you credit for a strong hand and will only be moving in if he can beat Q's.   K's would be unlikely so he must have at least 2P in this spot.  If you think he is a reckless aggressive type who will happily move in on a straight or flush draw and he thinks you are weak passive then you call.

The first paragraph reflects what would actually happen if I was playing the hand as I can't read players very well.  I would probably have raised before the flop and bet the flop however.

Why did you tell him what you had ?  (not that I ever believe what I am told anyway)

[M3boy]

OK a few points to talk about here.

1) I only limped because I expected him to push all in preflop - this didnt happen (Mind you, just as well because I would of been out, he had Q 6)

2) Bad fold? Why do you say this? At the end of the day AA is just one pair. The pot was unraised preflop meaning 2 pr was a HUGE possibility. The chips I have left is more than enough to play with. I also considered myself to be a better player than those left (no offence to the people who were left) and felt confident in being able to outplay them

3) PDee is a good player - VERY aggressive prelop. My check on the flop does indicate great strength in this situation - yet another reason when he comes over the top on the turn that I am sure he knows I have a big hand and thinks I have to call. 2 pair to me was his holding here. Big all ins indicate strength to me in ceratin situations, and this was one of those situations

4) Why did i say what I had in the chat box? Simple, because I was 90% confident he had 2 pr - telling him I had just laid down AA to his 2 pr when he expected me to call - this information I WANT to give in this situation. It says "you have to play better than that to get me" - I think this worked well when we were heads up, I got to see many cards for free as he suspected I "could" be trapping with a monster. I feel it is not always bad to give information away, sometimes you can use it to your advantage

[doubleup]

The pot was unraised preflop meaning 2 pr was a HUGE possibility.

It was a possibility...but also the highly co-ordinated board indicated that when you were ahead you were probably up against a big draw.

As a general rule I think that you shouldn't call hoping that you are ahead, when you can be put out of a tournament.  These calls are only for taking on small stacks.


I faced a similar situation in Latvia vs a very aggresive Finn.  I limped in SB, he didn't raise and eventually faced a big bet on the river that would have crippled me, so I folded.

[M3boy]

Doubleup - you see so many people that get "married" to AA KK and QQ and get busted by 2 pr - all because they cannot lay it down.

At the end of the day, one pair is one pair.

[Highstack]

Great pass, but I'm passing this never here to this player, based on what you have said about him.

You expected him to push and he didn't, but surely you have not had a pop at the flop because you wanted to force some action and him to catch a piece of it, so having gone down that route, I would have been prepared to go broke against him.

[Raindogs]

Nice pass.

I usually call these when I am behind and fold when I am ahead.

[M3boy]

Great pass, but I'm passing this never here to this player, based on what you have said about him.

You expected him to push and he didn't, but surely you have not had a pop at the flop because you wanted to force some action and him to catch a piece of it, so having gone down that route, I would have been prepared to go broke against him.

If he had pushed on the flop, then yes I would of called (probably)

[Poppet7]

The way I see it is that PDee is in the BB and checked, he could've got lucky and hit 2 pair on the flop, or a straight on the turn etc, but the all-in just appears weak to me and I think I would've been tempted to call.

Well done for winning the tournament.

[M3boy]

The way I see it is that PDee is in the BB and checked, he could've got lucky and hit 2 pair on the flop, or a straight on the turn etc, but the all-in just appears weak to me and I think I would've been tempted to call.

Well done for winning the tournament.

TY Sophie

Remember : "Strong is weak, weak is strong"

I will use an all in overbet with a strong hand if I am convinced the player to act after me will call and give me his/her chips