Correct ruling here?

[Dingdell]

Ok - Walsall £100 rebuy last night - in freezout period.

Dealers obviously really nackered after a punishing week.

3 people in the hand. Flop seen and checked by 2, third says raise, but as he does so the dealer has already burnt a card and is about to show the turn. The guy who wants to raise hasn't seen the card but the next to act has.

What should happen here?

[TightEnd]

burn card stands, exposed card gets shuffled back in to have an equal chance of coming out, redeal the turn when betting complete


However exact same thing happened earlier in week and ruling was they took third card from bottom as turn card,. which I thought was incorrect ruling but accepted it nonetheless.

[Dingdell]

The ruling this time was that the card stood as did the raise.

[bolt pp]

The ruling this time was that the card stood as did the raise.

Thats what i'd want to happen, its the most simplistic ruling and as bad as it seems i'd rather have a consistent rule thoughout the industry for these types of situations as opposed to every different gaff coming up with a different idea about how to rule.

[AndrewT]

The ruling this time was that the card stood as did the raise.

Was the raiser allowed to find out what the exposed card was before he decided how much he had to bet?

[TightEnd]

How can the card stand if the person facing the raise knows what the turn card is when he is responding to the raise on the flop?

[Dingdell]

The ruling this time was that the card stood as did the raise.

Was the raiser allowed to find out what the exposed card was before he decided how much he had to bet?

Yes

[Dingdell]

ok - it went like this......

Flop    - two checks then raiser went to speak and as he did the  was dealt.

Ruling was that the 2 stood. The raiser raised all in, called by 1, the other folded.

The hands were - a flopped straight from the raiser, trip 2's for the caller who then protested that the 2 shouldn't have stood - although when he first saw it he wanted it to stand. So he was V unhappy and the raiser (dingdells bern) was v happy. Until the river came as a 2.

It was a very interesting drive home!

[matt674]

ok - it went like this......

Flop    - two checks then raiser went to speak and as he did the  was dealt.

Ruling was that the 2 stood. The raiser raised all in, called by 1, the other folded.

The hands were - a flopped straight from the raiser, trip 2's for the caller who then protested that the 2 shouldn't have stood - although when he first saw it he wanted it to stand. So he was V unhappy and the raiser (dingdells bern) was v happy. Until the river came as a 2.

It was a very interesting drive home!

Live poker is sooooooo RIGGED!!!

[londonpokergirl]

actually its slightly different!

The burn card is correct that stays as it is.  The card which was brought out gets the chance to be shuffled back into the deck.  However what you do, is let betting commence exactly as what should have happened.  Let players call etc, then  do a burn card and get the river card out(in place of the turn) , let betting commence and calling,  then reshuffle the cards with the turn card
don't burn a card as its already happened and the 1st card out is the new turn card but a river card

Hope that makes sense, its much easier to do than explain it!

[ariston]

never happens on the internet that.
ruling was incorrect and the 2 shouldn't have gone. It should have been shuffled back into the pack as tighty says but unfortunately Grosvenor uses the 3rd card from the bottom rule which means the 2 then becomes a dead card completely. Very stupid ruling that it stood and he got to see it before he announced his raise.

[doubleup]

This year I have played 17 ranking tournaments in 8 different countries.  I only played 1 tournament in England because I was getting a freeroll.  With rulings like this I don't really see any reason to change this behaviour.

[TightEnd]

never happens on the internet that.
ruling was incorrect and the 2 shouldn't have gone. It should have been shuffled back into the pack as tighty says but unfortunately Grosvenor uses the 3rd card from the bottom rule which means the 2 then becomes a dead card completely. Very stupid ruling that it stood and he got to see it before he announced his raise.

I AGREE WITH EVERY WORD OF THIS.

I am off for an urgent lie down.

[TightEnd]

actually its slightly different!

The burn card is correct that stays as it is.  The card which was brought out gets the chance to be shuffled back into the deck.  However what you do, is let betting commence exactly as what should have happened.  Let players call etc, then  do a burn card and get the river card out(in place of the turn) , let betting commence and calling,  then reshuffle the cards with the turn card
don't burn a card as its already happened and the 1st card out is the new turn card but a river card

Hope that makes sense, its much easier to do than explain it!

this seems far too complicated


I like what I saw applied somewhere the other week, burn card stands, raiser allowed to bet, callers allowed to act, deck get shuffled, proceed with turn, burn, river

[RioRodent]

actually its slightly different!

The burn card is correct that stays as it is.  The card which was brought out gets the chance to be shuffled back into the deck.  However what you do, is let betting commence exactly as what should have happened.  Let players call etc, then  do a burn card and get the river card out(in place of the turn) , let betting commence and calling,  then reshuffle the cards with the turn card
don't burn a card as its already happened and the 1st card out is the new turn card but a river card

Hope that makes sense, its much easier to do than explain it!

this seems far too complicated


I like what I saw applied somewhere the other week, burn card stands, raiser allowed to bet, callers allowed to act, deck get shuffled, proceed with turn, burn, river

As Mel says it is harder to put into words than to do... the reason for doing it the way Mel describes is so that 'as far as possible' the board cards are as they should be, albeit the original river card comes early on the turn, and the exposed card still has a chance of hitting the board after being shuffled back in.