His line suggests?

[TightEnd]

Game #4365458504: Hold'em NL ($1/$2) - 2007/02/01 - 13:34:11 (UK)
Table "Brazilianborn" Seat 5 is the button.
Seat 1: Castaway ($189.32 in chips)
Seat 2: hero ($338.50 in chips)
Seat 3: Yamoto ($282.99 in chips)
Seat 4: Treeny sits out
Seat 5: Salmi ($170.37 in chips)
Seat 6: Evinrude ($393.35 in chips)
Evinrude: posts small blind $1
Castaway: posts big blind $2
----- HOLE CARDS -----
dealt to hero [As ]
hero: raises to $7
Yamoto: folds
Salmi: folds
Evinrude: folds
Castaway: calls $5
----- FLOP ----- [ ]
Castaway: checks
hero: bets $14 c-betting
Castaway: calls $14
----- TURN ----- [ ][]
Castaway: checks
hero: bets $25 i hit
Castaway: calls $25 now I am wary of a two pair/set type hand
----- RIVER ----- [ ][]
Castaway: bets $143.32 and is all-in..he has to beat one pair or an overpair so
hero: folds
Returned uncalled bets $143.32 to Castaway
----- SHOW DOWN -----
Castaway: shows ??
Castaway collected $90 from Main pot


what do you think?

[boldie]

I'm assuming he knows you...8 T for the missed open ender?

[TightEnd]

I'm assuming he knows you...8 T for the missed open ender?

!!

we have never played before

solid ABC so far in session

[bobby1]

8 10 or maybe 10 jack

[TightEnd]

its never a made hand (set? two pair?) here...?

[kinboshi]

its never a made hand (set? two pair?) here...?

It could be.  But I bet it wasn't this time was it...?

[bobby1]

It is more likely to be a made hand but the problem with hand histories and hand analysis is that everyone looks for the trick or beat as in most cases hand analysis threads tend to be hands that end in being outdrawn or unlucky.

I would fancy him to raise on the turn with a set/two pair but as you have no info on him that is just a guess.

[TightEnd]

not necessarily

I only ask, inviting ridicule as usual from the normal suspects  , because at 1-2,2-4 check call twice and then push is in my experience usually indicative of a hand that beats TPTK here, I see it more so than people pushing with missed draws.

Different to higher levels perhaps, dunno

[boldie]

I still like the open ender here

[bobby1]

ridicule, not me sir.

Its would seem a strange way to play a strong hand here but as you say it could well be a strong hand.

As for hand analysis threads/conversations in general I have started reciting hands to my poker buddies from both hands point of view and almost without exception they play the hand looking for how the hand gets beaten and not how they would play it. It seems to be that the mentality is if the the hand is worth discussing then there must be something interesting happen at the end.( This is from the readers view not necessarily the posters view tho)

[boldie]

ridicule, not me sir.

Its would seem a strange way to play a strong hand here but as you say it could well be a strong hand.

As for hand analysis threads/conversations in general I have started reciting hands to my poker buddies from both hands point of view and almost without exception they play the hand looking for how the hand gets beaten and not how they would play it. It seems to be that the mentality is if the the hand is worth discussing then there must be something interesting happen at the end.( This is from the readers view not necessarily the posters view tho)

Yeah it is ussually the case that a hand posted on here gets beaten but that's why people wonder if they made a mistake.

 I think here the  laydown is a good one unless you have the oppo sussed.
 I still think a good player could make the push with 8-10 if he has tighty down as a player who can lay down a hand (IOW not a fish) and I reckon the 8-10 could therefore be a fairly likely holding.

[bobby1]

ridicule, not me sir.

Its would seem a strange way to play a strong hand here but as you say it could well be a strong hand.

As for hand analysis threads/conversations in general I have started reciting hands to my poker buddies from both hands point of view and almost without exception they play the hand looking for how the hand gets beaten and not how they would play it. It seems to be that the mentality is if the the hand is worth discussing then there must be something interesting happen at the end.( This is from the readers view not necessarily the posters view tho)

Yeah it is ussually the case that a hand posted on here gets beaten but that's why people wonder if they made a mistake.

 I think here the  laydown is a good one unless you have the oppo sussed.
 I still think a good player could make the push with 8-10 if he has tighty down as a player who can lay down a hand (IOW not a fish) and I reckon the 8-10 could therefore be a fairly likely holding.

Hi Boldie,

I am not just talking about hands on this board I am being general about hand stories be they face to face or online.

[TightEnd]

Thanks Phil

I find a slight problem with my posts in that they get too results orientated...i.e its difficult to post what you were thinking without being aware that knowledge that you have of the outcome influences your thoughts


In this case, It was an interesting conclusion.

He showed  . Talk about being bitch slapped.

Great bet sir.

[bobby1]

Thanks Phil

I find a slight problem with my posts in that they get too results orientated...i.e its difficult to post what you were thinking without being aware that knowledge that you have of the outcome influences your thoughts


In this case, It was an interesting conclusion.

He showed  . Talk about being bitch slapped.

Great bet sir.

The thing is it is sometimes tough to call in that spot even tho it does look like a 'frightener' push, he is lucky you are good enough to lay down a hand and good enough to know the value of picking your spots.

Can I ask one question, before you checked to him on the river did you have a plan in mind if he did make a bet of xx amount or all in. I find if my read is he has missed a draw and I am checking so he will bet(or check down) I am less scared by that kind of push as It can then convince me that my read could be right coz that is  *one* of the things I expect him to do if he has missed. If he makes a milking type bet here then I might be more afraid and pass if my read when I check is that he is slow playing a biggy.

I think this helps me to be clear in my mind when the oppo makes a bet in that spot.

[TightEnd]

He is first to act on the river, I have position (not that I use it on the end!)

He is lucky in a sense, a couple of months ago I was having problems paying off over-bets on the river (usually thinking they were busted draws, much like a tournament play would be I suppose)...people were pushing into me with "nut" type hands  and with help from conversations with totalise and a couple of others I tried to rationalise what the various overbets might mean on different types of boards and the premise behind which players would overbet rather than value bet.

I still maintain I see "strong" overbets on the end far more than "miss/weak" overbets

However this fella turned it upside down with his nice move on this hand