Tournament Prize Structures

[tikay]

On the Grosvenor Grand Prix Update, this Deal was reported by Floppy....

Ok, what I've garned from the deal is that £10k has been taken from 1st, and £5k from 2nd and 3rd each and redistributed to the lower places, so that 9th gets £9k, 8th gets £11k, 7th gets £13k and 6th gets £15k, same as 5th I think.

So I said......

Very wise, too. I think this is the best UK Comp of the year, & I'm sad I could not, for the first time ever, play it. (Due to work).

But this bit of "business" - which occurs annually in this Comp, & indeed most other big comps, surely tells us, & the organisers, (Grosvenor & Blue Square, both of whom do so much for Tourney Poker in the UK) that it's time to "flatten" the Prize Structures. At a guess, 80% of ALL comps in which I play end up in a chop or deal, which is all fine & dandy. But if the Prize Pool was better-structured to start with, this would not be necessary.

Then el blondie chimed in - & surely nobody has more experience of Final Tables - & said this.....

And just to explain to the Tourney organisors throughout the world of poker. 'Flatten' the structure doesnt mean pay more players.
What we need is the removal of 2nd place being double 3rd place, and 1st place being double 2nd. These should be 50% increases. Take the money off 1st and 2nd and add money to 4th to 9th places.
This would help remove the deal making from poker.

So - & forget - for NOW - what you think the %'s should be, but lets start with a simple yes or no......

Should Tournament Prize Pools for final Tables....

Remain as are.

Be flatter.

You can Vote via the Option at the top of the page.

[KarmaDope]

Be flatter. Kev posted a spreadsheet that iPoker were planning on using for their comps in the future, and the structures were pretty good. Pity these aren't universal.

[Flea]

On the Grosvenor Grand Prix Update, this Deal was reported by Floppy....

Ok, what I've garned from the deal is that £10k has been taken from 1st, and £5k from 2nd and 3rd each and redistributed to the lower places, so that 9th gets £9k, 8th gets £11k, 7th gets £13k and 6th gets £15k, same as 5th I think.

So I said......

Very wise, too. I think this is the best UK Comp of the year, & I'm sad I could not, for the first time ever, play it. (Due to work).

But this bit of "business" - which occurs annually in this Comp, & indeed most other big comps, surely tells us, & the organisers, (Grosvenor & Blue Square, both of whom do so much for Tourney Poker in the UK) that it's time to "flatten" the Prize Structures. At a guess, 80% of ALL comps in which I play end up in a chop or deal, which is all fine & dandy. But if the Prize Pool was better-structured to start with, this would not be necessary.

Then el blondie chimed in - & surely nobody has more experience of Final Tables - & said this.....

And just to explain to the Tourney organisors throughout the world of poker. 'Flatten' the structure doesnt mean pay more players.
What we need is the removal of 2nd place being double 3rd place, and 1st place being double 2nd. These should be 50% increases. Take the money off 1st and 2nd and add money to 4th to 9th places.
This would help remove the deal making from poker.

So - & forget - for NOW - what you think the %'s should be, but lets start with a simple yes or no......

Should Tournament Prize Pools for final Tables....

Remain as are.

Be flatter.

You can Vote via the Option at the top of the page.

 

That's one thing I've always wondered about with tournament payouts.

One question I have is, I play a lot of 6 seater STT's and only top 2 get paid which is fine but 2nd gets 1.5*buy-in whereas 1st gets 4.5*buy-in which seems somewhat disproportionate to me a 4:2 split seems fairer to me (I know it's not much difference but it just seems harsh to get to heads-up and then only get 1.5*buy-in).

[tikay]

Please note, this Poll refers to LIVE Poker Only. And why? Because most Online Cardrooms already do it better. Sorry, Flatter.....

[KarmaDope]

There are a few people who have voted against the structure being flatter? If this is you, why?

[technolog]

I voted for flatter but those jumps sure are nice to make!

[tikay]

Meanwhile, over at Walsall, The Grand Prix Final continues, & the players have just done their FOURTH different "deal" since the Final began, in each case, to flatten the Prize Money.

[sharky_uk]

APAT live events have a flatter structure (sort of!!). 4th-9th receiving exactly the same payout.

Is that the sort of structure you would prefer? Surely that's even worse than the payout structure of an event like the Grand Prix!

[RichEO]

As you've brought it up, I don't like the APAT structure. Flat is good. No jumps in prize money at all - I'm not so keen.

[Ironside]

As you've brought it up, I don't like the APAT structure. Flat is good. No jumps in prize money at all - I'm not so keen.

yeah i agree

but with apat the money is needed to pay that way so that you can pay off alot of your costs with a final table

i certainly wouldnt play in a bigger buy in event with that flat a structure

[TightEnd]

As you've brought it up, I don't like the APAT structure. Flat is good. No jumps in prize money at all - I'm not so keen.

the concept..right or wrong...is 1st 2nd and 3rd get medals and the like, below that the money is flat...


most of the problem in traditional payout structures to my mind is the big leap from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd which makes deals inevitable, no one (or few) want to gamble on say a coin flip headsa up when double the prize money is at stake 1st to 2nd

At least APAT has significantly flattened these leaps

[sharky_uk]

most of the problem in traditional payout structures to my mind is the big leap from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd which makes deals inevitable, no one (or few) want to gamble on say a coin flip headsa up when double the prize money is at stake 1st to 2nd

At least APAT has significantly flattened these leaps

Not really!

APAT payout structure is: (Taken from www.apat.com)
1st - 50% of stakes (2.5 * 2nd) + Added Prize
2nd - 20% of stakes (2 * 3rd)
3rd - 10% of stakes

4th-9th (Equal share of 20% of stakes)

Maybe APAT could lead the way by producing the ideal live tournament payout structure.

[Ironside]

most of the problem in traditional payout structures to my mind is the big leap from 1st to 2nd and 2nd to 3rd which makes deals inevitable, no one (or few) want to gamble on say a coin flip headsa up when double the prize money is at stake 1st to 2nd

At least APAT has significantly flattened these leaps

Not really!

APAT payout structure is: (Taken from www.apat.com)
1st - 50% of stakes (2.5 * 2nd) + Added Prize
2nd - 20% of stakes (2 * 3rd)
3rd - 10% of stakes

4th-9th (Equal share of 20% of stakes)

Maybe APAT could lead the way by producing the ideal live tournament payout structure.

how can they do that

then they dont have a headline figure to put in the press saying £7500 for the winner or £5000 depending on the runners

justl like all promoters they look at first prize instead of the overall prize pool of £15k + seat

4k 3k 2k 1k for a 200 runner comp would be much better inho with 500 down to 10th and 200 from 11th to 20

for amatures this make more sence

[TightEnd]

Actually I think the section Sharky refers to needs to be updated

Next weekend's championships at Walsall has 200 runners at £75=£15,000

1st £3,500 (23%) plus a GUKPT seat woth £1,500, admittedly

2nd £2,250 (15%)

3rd £1,250 (sub 10%)

then flat to 9th, then paying a smaller amount to 10-18th

this is what my comment "significant flattening" refers to
 

[Ironside]

Actually I think the section Sharky refers to needs to be updated

Next weekend's championships at Walsall has 200 runners at £75=£15,000

1st £3,500 (23%) plus a GUKPT seat woth £1,500, admittedly

2nd £2,250 (15%)

3rd £1,250 (sub 10%)

then flat

this is what my comment "significant flattening" refers to
 

that sounds much better again for amatuers only