why the death penalty is a bad idea

[Newmanseye]

Yeah but rushing all those executions through in Texas got George Bush jnr a decent rep as a hardliner which got him eventually elected as president, so it was gods will. It doesn't matter that some of them were innocent, don't you just love america.

Rushing through the executions did not get George Bush elected, it was a multitude of things like some Arab money, a well connected Daddy, A brother that helps make ballots favorable.

Yes i know is one of the many conspiracy theorys, however there are a lot of coincidences when you look at all of the facts presented during the reign of G W Bush. What i found incredible was G W Bush allowed the entire Bin Laden family out of the USA when all aircraft was supposedly grounded, He flew them out!!

I also think its disturbing that his daddy g Bush Sr  was meeting with the bin laden family, this guy has and uses his access to CIA briefing files, one of the few past presidents to use his access as it happens.

From the outside it looks like the bush family are playing havoc with a country to further their own wealth, and not content on ruining the country of their birth,  they set their sights on pillaging other countries.

arrgh i got in to a rant there.

[steeveg]

the usa legal system is a joke, i cant blame the oj simpson jury for finding him innocent even if they thought he was guilty, at the time of the trial they where expecting a lot of riots and killings if he was found guilty, so how did the usa protect this jury, they allowed cnn and the media to camp out outside the houses of people on that jury,

any Jury system is severely flawed and I can not believe a civilised country still goes with it.

alternative being? relying on the views of a small panel of judges?

i was on jury duty for a week 10 years ago and gave what you say a lot of thought, there is no perfect legal system, i suppose  you can only make it as good as you can, trouble is maybe anyone on a professional jury would become very cynical, but then again they would at least follow the case properly and if i was innocent and was on trial, yes i would prefer a professional type of jury big or small.,i was sickened at the attitude of some of the people on jury duty and still think its wrong that people on jury duty are allowed to go the pub in there dinner break, i remember a couple of times people saying things like, never heard a word the last hour i was falling asleep and laughing,only half the jury really put any facts for argument when we considered verdict. so its down to a luck what type of people you get to decide your fate

[Acidmouse]

Thats why most lawyers in this country try and get the defendant to plead before it goes to jury, they make alot more money that way and alot less time having to defend someone against a stupid jury.

[madasahatstand]

the usa legal system is a joke, i cant blame the oj simpson jury for finding him innocent even if they thought he was guilty, at the time of the trial they where expecting a lot of riots and killings if he was found guilty, so how did the usa protect this jury, they allowed cnn and the media to camp out outside the houses of people on that jury,

any Jury system is severely flawed and I can not believe a civilised country still goes with it.

alternative being? relying on the views of a small panel of judges?

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a decision. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

That old chestnut again? I know many sun readers who are more intelligent than the broadsheet readers. You are sooo judgemental my dutch friend

As for the old boys club having the decisions at their hands, I'd prefer an army of sun readers any day of the week. Most of them don't have skeletons or position to lose if they make the 'wrong' decisions. I wouldn't trust that setup with a bargepole, unless of course I was part of the old boys club

[boldie]

the usa legal system is a joke, i cant blame the oj simpson jury for finding him innocent even if they thought he was guilty, at the time of the trial they where expecting a lot of riots and killings if he was found guilty, so how did the usa protect this jury, they allowed cnn and the media to camp out outside the houses of people on that jury,

any Jury system is severely flawed and I can not believe a civilised country still goes with it.

alternative being? relying on the views of a small panel of judges?

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a decision. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

That old chestnut again? I know many sun readers who are more intelligent than the broadsheet readers. You are sooo judgemental my dutch friend

As for the old boys club having the decisions at their hands, I'd prefer an army of sun readers any day of the week. Most of them don't have skeletons or position to lose if they make the 'wrong' decisions. I wouldn't trust that setup with a bargepole, unless of course I was part of the old boys club

An Army of Sun readers to judge you?..yikes!

[Newmanseye]

Raises an interesting question, can we have an impartial press coverage without agenda?

[madasahatstand]

the usa legal system is a joke, i cant blame the oj simpson jury for finding him innocent even if they thought he was guilty, at the time of the trial they where expecting a lot of riots and killings if he was found guilty, so how did the usa protect this jury, they allowed cnn and the media to camp out outside the houses of people on that jury,

any Jury system is severely flawed and I can not believe a civilised country still goes with it.

alternative being? relying on the views of a small panel of judges?

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a decision. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

That old chestnut again? I know many sun readers who are more intelligent than the broadsheet readers. You are sooo judgemental my dutch friend

As for the old boys club having the decisions at their hands, I'd prefer an army of sun readers any day of the week. Most of them don't have skeletons or position to lose if they make the 'wrong' decisions. I wouldn't trust that setup with a bargepole, unless of course I was part of the old boys club

An Army of Sun readers to judge you?..yikes!

yes and Id be 'not guilty' every time my friend

[madasahatstand]

Raises an interesting question, can we have an impartial press coverage without agenda?

not while it makes money from lies and deception

[boldie]

the usa legal system is a joke, i cant blame the oj simpson jury for finding him innocent even if they thought he was guilty, at the time of the trial they where expecting a lot of riots and killings if he was found guilty, so how did the usa protect this jury, they allowed cnn and the media to camp out outside the houses of people on that jury,

any Jury system is severely flawed and I can not believe a civilised country still goes with it.

alternative being? relying on the views of a small panel of judges?

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a decision. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

That old chestnut again? I know many sun readers who are more intelligent than the broadsheet readers. You are sooo judgemental my dutch friend

As for the old boys club having the decisions at their hands, I'd prefer an army of sun readers any day of the week. Most of them don't have skeletons or position to lose if they make the 'wrong' decisions. I wouldn't trust that setup with a bargepole, unless of course I was part of the old boys club

An Army of Sun readers to judge you?..yikes!

yes and Id be 'not guilty' every time my friend

True..I'd be screwed though

[madasahatstand]

the usa legal system is a joke, i cant blame the oj simpson jury for finding him innocent even if they thought he was guilty, at the time of the trial they where expecting a lot of riots and killings if he was found guilty, so how did the usa protect this jury, they allowed cnn and the media to camp out outside the houses of people on that jury,

any Jury system is severely flawed and I can not believe a civilised country still goes with it.

alternative being? relying on the views of a small panel of judges?

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a decision. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

That old chestnut again? I know many sun readers who are more intelligent than the broadsheet readers. You are sooo judgemental my dutch friend

As for the old boys club having the decisions at their hands, I'd prefer an army of sun readers any day of the week. Most of them don't have skeletons or position to lose if they make the 'wrong' decisions. I wouldn't trust that setup with a bargepole, unless of course I was part of the old boys club

An Army of Sun readers to judge you?..yikes!

yes and Id be 'not guilty' every time my friend

True..I'd be screwed though

Well get rid of the jury system, get into this lot and I'm sure you will be sorted:)

[taximan007]

I think a lot of peoples views on the death penalty change (if against it in the 1st place),  if the "victim" of such a crime worthy of this sentence is one of their own.

[wader leg]

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a desicion. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

The trouble with experts is that they might turn out to be like the one in the Kieren Fallon case or maybe  Professor Roy Meadows whose expert views convinced a jury to convict an innocent woman of murdering her children.



Not Sun readers this time! was it not Mail readers who were feeling the brunt of your sweeping generalisations a couple of weeks ago?
If you personally know people who read these papers and they fall into the derogatory categories that you like to put them in, then maybe it says more about the company you keep than the mindset of the millions of readers in total that these newspapers have.

[boldie]

Small panel of judges (3-5) with 2 independent people (again experts) attending the trial to check and see that the judges don't go out of line..yeah I think that's better than having people with no knowledge about, sometimes, very complex issues making a desicion. (You should also know that I consider most people too thick to understand even the most basic things..which is why they read the Sun)

The trouble with experts is that they might turn out to be like the one in the Kieren Fallon case or maybe  Professor Roy Meadows whose expert views convinced a jury to convict an innocent woman of murdering her children.



Not Sun readers this time! was it not Mail readers who were feeling the brunt of your sweeping generalisations a couple of weeks ago?
If you personally know people who read these papers and they fall into the derogatory categories that you like to put them in, then maybe it says more about the company you keep than the mindset of the millions of readers in total that these newspapers have.

The experts would be keeping an eye on the judges to make sure they don't do anything you'd only find in a banana republic call them independent observers. they would not be active particapants in the trial.. I apologize if I didn't make that clear.


Sun readers AND Mail readers, my friend..I discriminate and insult equally and could include a lot more papers in that list I consider most of mankind to be; Self-obsessed, cruel, uncaring, stupid, greedy, ignorant and lazy. (I could throw some more terms in there but I think you get the jist.)

I see the proof for this on a daily bases; everywhere around me I see dodgy politicians not taking any responsibilities for their actions and the public doesn't care..they still vote them in. The same public cares more about who wins the X-factor, pop idol or Big brother and therefore that attracts more votes than a general election.
More money is made from 1 season of the X-factor than is made from Children in need or Comic Relief.

The public is more concerned about what's going on with Britney Spears than what's going on in Sierra Leone or Kenya. As long as the house prices don't drop people are happy. They are all pissed off with all the immigrants coming over here..BUT don't want to do the shitty jobs and would immediatly hire a Polish labourer and pay him cash if it meant they could have an extention built for 3k less.

The general public as an entity is a brainless sheep that does what it is told to do. I know many smart individuals but the general public is as thick as pigshit and it does not care about anything other than itsself.
The Sun is the UK's most read "newspaper" and therefore it can be said that IF the public is indeed thick the people who read the Sun are also thick. They just want to stare at some titties on page three and hear what Angela (23 from London) thinks about Britney shaving her head than they want to read about things that actually matter..as long as they can go on with their little lives they don't give a shit.

Bit of a mysanthrope?..yeah I probably am..but kid yourself not mate..if you fell down on an average street in a big city in the UK people would just walk past you and most of them would give you a wide birth..rather than checking to see if anything might be wrong. The world is a truly shitty place at the moment (maybe it has always been, I don't  know..it just seems more uncaring lately) and people don't give a crap...I think the public (and the Sun readers) well and truly deserve to be treated with contempt and should get a  kick up the arse, and wake up and do something.

Just my two cents obviously

[wader leg]

Well aren't you a ray of sunshine!
The people who I work with that buy the Sun seem to read the sport pages and do the crossword in their dinner break, I'm pretty sure they don't buy it to keep abreast of International conflicts or Political shenanigans, just a bit of entertainment in their working day, they could have Sky news or BBC news 24 on constantly at home for all I know or maybe they secretly get the Guardian or FT delivered but don't bring it to work in case they get the piss taken out of them by people who judge a persons political persuasions, intelligence and morals by the newspaper that they read.
There were two letters in my local paper over Christmas that were quite heartwarming, one from a lady who had fallen outside a local supermarket and was writing to thank the strangers who came to her aid and one from a lady who had lost her purse and someone had handed it in to market staff who were able to call the purse owner over the Tannoy and return it to her, both letters ended with the statement that they had their "faith in human nature restored".
If all you look for is doom and gloom that's all your going to get and it's true that muggings and thefts get bigger headlines than the thank you letters but there are good people out there, you just have to look a little harder for them.

[madasahatstand]

Well aren't you a ray of sunshine!
The people who I work with that buy the Sun seem to read the sport pages and do the crossword in their dinner break, I'm pretty sure they don't buy it to keep abreast of International conflicts or Political shenanigans, just a bit of entertainment in their working day, they could have Sky news or BBC news 24 on constantly at home for all I know or maybe they secretly get the Guardian or FT delivered but don't bring it to work in case they get the piss taken out of them by people who judge a persons political persuasions, intelligence and morals by the newspaper that they read.
There were two letters in my local paper over Christmas that were quite heartwarming, one from a lady who had fallen outside a local supermarket and was writing to thank the strangers who came to her aid and one from a lady who had lost her purse and someone had handed it in to market staff who were able to call the purse owner over the Tannoy and return it to her, both letters ended with the statement that they had their "faith in human nature restored".
If all you look for is doom and gloom that's all your going to get and it's true that muggings and thefts get bigger headlines than the thank you letters but there are good people out there, you just have to look a little harder for them.

aye:)