police march

[Claw75]

As I type I can see thousands of police officers marching their way past my office.  I think the way they have been treated over their pay is scandalous, and believe they thoroughly deserve a better wage.  I hope something is achieved through their efforts today.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7203839.stm#map

[Dingdell]

It would be very funny if when they get there they are met by a load of miners blocking their path. Well I thought it would be funny. 

[Claw75]

It would be very funny if when they get there they are met by a load of miners blocking their path. Well I thought it would be funny. 

lmao

just had a look - no miners.  Shame!

[boldie]

As I type I can see thousands of police officers marching their way past my office.  I think the way they have been treated over their pay is scandalous, and believe they thoroughly deserve a better wage.  I hope something is achieved through their efforts today.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7203839.stm#map

the pay should indeed be backdated to sept 1st..they do get a decent wage though @24k ish a year.

[Claw75]

£24k is below the UK average earnings and well below the average wage for London.  Do you not think that the police deserve at least the average wage for the jobs they do?

[Graham C]

I can't decide where I am on things like this.  Sure I want everyone to do well, but you take a job on knowing what the pay and conditions/hours are like.  In the private sector, if you don't like it, you move on.

[TightEnd]

£24k is below the UK average earnings and well below the average wage for London.  Do you not think that the police deserve at least the average wage for the jobs they do?

A Sergeant in London gets  £45k

I'm not dis-agreeing with your question though

the excuses given by Jacqui Smith as to why not to backdate seem unsatisfactory to me

[Bongo]

What is the average salary for the UK?

A quick google seems to suggest 22-24k, but nothing concrete.

[boldie]

£24k is below the UK average earnings and well below the average wage for London.  Do you not think that the police deserve at least the average wage for the jobs they do?

I'm always baffled by people saying 24k is below the average UK income..surely in the north it's not and Lord knows in scotland it's not. The 24k a year might not be hgih compared to the average income in the South -East (and all stats to do with "average UK anythings" are heavily influenced towards the situation in the South-East so I take those figures with a grain of salt.
24K a year really is a perfectly fine income in most parts of the country.

Should a police officer in London make more than his colleague in rural Northern England? Yes....but that doesn't mean the guy in rural Northern England is not getting a fair wage when he's on 24k a year.

[Claw75]

according to the ONS website, median weekly wages (for 2007) are:

UK - £487
London - £581

making median annual salaries £25,324 and £30,212 respectively

[Claw75]

I take your point boldie.  Presumably the average UK salary includes those in London - it would be interesting to see a 'rest of the UK' average (possibly without the whole South East included)

edit: the ONS report the above figures come from does include average salaries by region

edit again: North East England and Northern Ireland have the lowest average salaries in the Country at just under £21k

[TightEnd]

Police officers are staging a massive march in London amid their continuing row with the government over their pay award.

What is the row over?

Last year Home Secretary Jacqui Smith decided not to backdate to September a 2.5% pay rise for police in England, Wales and Northern Ireland.

The police say this means their rise, only paid from December 2007, in reality amounts to 1.9% and that the Home Office has therefore breached an agreed deal.

In other words, the dispute is not over the increase set by the Police Arbitration Tribunal, but the manner in which the Home Office has decided to pay it.

What are officers paid at the moment?

Prior to this rise, new police constables began on £21,009. At the moment this could rise to £32,985, depending on length of service.

The pay increase sees all constables paid a minimum of £21,500, with those with the longest service receiving £33,800.

The Home Office says constables have seen a 36% wage increase since 1997, which is 10% above inflation.

Sergeants currently start on £32,985, and inspectors on £42,264.

Superintendents begin on £56,274, rising to £65,565 and chief superintendents have a starting salary of £67,200, rising to £71,031.

Why did the government decide to delay the Police pay rise?

Prime Minister Gordon Brown decided to stage public sector pay rises when he was still chancellor.

He said staging pay awards was an "essential part" of controlling inflation, keeping interest rates low and creating more jobs. He also said he would "do nothing" that he believed would put economic stability or low interest rates at risk.

However, officers in Scotland have had the full award as Scottish ministers have accepted the decision of the Police Arbitration Tribunal.

Can police strike?

No. The police are banned striking by an Act of Parliament. However, some members of the Police Federation are now calling for this ban to be removed because they say they are now being treated the same as other public sector workers - and should therefore have the same rights.

Can police take any form of protest action?

Thousands of police officers from across the country have organised a protest march in London over the issue. The Police Federation is also warning that it plans to ballot officers over whether they want to seek full industrial rights. That vote may happen in February.

Chris Herbert, editor of Police Review, said there were a few "fairly limited" ways in which the police could express their anger.

He said: "They could go back to their members to see if they wanted to take a ballot on whether they should have the right to strike or not.

"That could be the most high-profile, headline-grabbing thing they could do.

"Or they could withdraw their labour for voluntary posts or jobs that come up. Or they could do what's called working to minimum standards.

This would see officers following procedures "to the absolute minute, so it in a sense jams up the system, so that all the jobs they have to do would take a lot longer".

Is this dispute a one-off?

No, the row is part of a much larger dispute. Since 1980, pay has been set after talks in a special industrial relations body called the Police Negotiating Board.

The Police Federation supports the PNB, saying it provides a good negotiating environment with both sides around the table. Secondly, if the two sides fail to agree, the matter is referred to the independent Police Arbitration Tribunal for a binding decision.

There has been no dispute for years because both sides have abided by its rulings.

So what went wrong?

The Home Office said it wanted to replace this system with a pay review body closer to those in other areas of the public services, partly because of the need to keep public spending in check.

But the federation warned that such a body would ultimately ignore a principle of police pay - that they are no ordinary public servants. Ultimately a standard pay review body would not have the support of officers, it claimed.

The government's first move away from the old system went to arbitration after months of deadlock and ultimately led to the current crisis.

The home secretary has commissioned a further report into police pay. It is understood to recommend the public sector-style pay body that the government wants - but the detail has not yet been made public.

Chancellor of the Exchequer Alastair Darling has also floated the idea of three-year pay deals, similar to how other public sector spending is broadly set. Unions have not ruled it out - but are worried that living standards could slip if inflation were to outstrip the agreed awards.


bbc

[Jon MW]

according to the ONS website, median weekly wages (for 2007) are:

UK - £487
London - £581

making median annual salaries £25,324 and £30,212 respectively

I've had a look at this before (a year or 2 back)

To give an indication of just how much earnings are skewed by the South East as well as just London, I think the general figure for what most people earn is around £16k. But TBH there are so many ways of working it out that you could make it any number between about £12k and £30.

[boldie]

according to the ONS website, median weekly wages (for 2007) are:

UK - £487
London - £581

making median annual salaries £25,324 and £30,212 respectively

I've had a look at this before (a year or 2 back)

To give an indication of just how much earnings are skewed by the South East as well as just London, I think the general figure for what most people earn is around £16k. But TBH there are so many ways of working it out that you could make it any number between about £12k and £30.

I think 16k is indeed a lot closer to being accurate. so 24k isn't bad at all.

[AndrewT]

The thing I found most surprising about this is that they managed to find 22,500 actual police officers to march.

Whenever I see one of them on the street it always turns out to be one of the community support pseudo-police people.