UEFA CUP FINAL!

[celtic]

Rod - How can Rangers fans police who supports them or decides to latch on to them? These people don't care about the team, all they care about is making their presence felt and spout their bile cause they think its clever.

[The Baron]

And I'm sorry if it offends you but you can guarantee posts from english football fans that only serve to show the posters complete lack of knowledge when scots football is being discussed. As a contrast when there are arguments about english football the scots posts usually are relevant.

Fair point Rod - I wont claim to know enough about the SPL to post regularly on those threads. But the point applies to almost everyone on here who talks about a league outside of their home league. And that does include some of the comments about the EPL I've read on this forum which are just complete nonsense and seem to be nothing more than an attempted dig at the English. We all do it mate.

[bobby1]

Celtic, Rod,

You have made some good points and the use of the phrase Scots does read a little all encompassing but the crux of this is that of the trouble makers on Weds night a massive % were Scottish Rangers fans, I admit there will be an elemant of 'others' in there looking for trouble but it is such a small % in the grand scheme.

I used to watch Leeds Utd with a Norwegian mate, If he suddenly stood up and started hurling seats into the away end you wouldn't say'It was the Norwegians that started the trouble, we would say it was the Leeds fans'

Obv Rangers fans will have a big following in England too but at the end of the day they are again a small % of the total crowd on Weds night.

Glasgow Bandit made some good points, in 2002 when Rangers and Aberdeen fans kicked off in the ground at Aberdeen the Record and other rags shamefully claimed that it was English fans in Chelsea shirts that had started the trouble. As Glasgow pointed out it is the same old tired excuse instead of taking the responsibility and looking at the Rangers fans.

Before this looks like xenophobia the way that trouble at football grounds is treated these days by firstly the sports media and secondly the print media is getting the same as the Records approach.

When Liverpool fans were rushing the gates at the Champions League final last year all we read about afterwards was that the ground wasn't up to the correct standard and the policing was no good, but that doesn't change the fact that ticketless Liverpool fans were basically attacking turnstiles as a group working on the 'some of us will get in and some wont' mentality. That was barely mentioned by the Sports TV stations and the rags that in the same ownership as they have pumped wads of cash into English footy and treat it like its 'their product'.In no way will they cover it in a bad light and that is how the Scots media have covered Weds night, any excuses bar the obvious that Rangers fans were bang out of order.

[Rooky9]

The whole thing isn't at all surpising though is it. 100k people, 12 hours of drinking, team losing = trouble. It doesn't matter if they were scottish or english - its pretty inevitable.

I don't really understand why 100k people decided to desend on Manchester, apart from having to compete with a previous level set by their competitors. I think its in part because I've been spoilt by always being at the games but I have never really undestood people wanting to give themselves the worst position possible to actually watch a game of football, in search for 'atmosphere'. If they were such big fans they would be inside the stadium anyway(with the exception of 20-30k of regular attenders who couldnt get tickets).

[bobby1]

I have actually fallen for it myself and quoted the 100k figure but you are right, Celtic said 80k went to Seville, so we gotta beat that, in 5 years time Celtic will be taking 250k to an away match in Basle coz Rangers said 200k went to Zagreb the year before.

Its just another example of the oneupmanship that exists.

[Rod Paradise]

Rod - How can Rangers fans police who supports them or decides to latch on to them? These people don't care about the team, all they care about is making their presence felt and spout their bile cause they think its clever.

The same way Celtic policed the Casuals - when they step out of line they are warned, then they get the crap kicked out of them.

I saw police standing applauding the Celtic support while they threw out every casual who were running for help after trying to start a fight at Hibs.

Maybe not legal - but if the police see that - they're happy enough.

[Rod Paradise]

And I'm sorry if it offends you but you can guarantee posts from english football fans that only serve to show the posters complete lack of knowledge when scots football is being discussed. As a contrast when there are arguments about english football the scots posts usually are relevant.

Fair point Rod - I wont claim to know enough about the SPL to post regularly on those threads. But the point applies to almost everyone on here who talks about a league outside of their home league. And that does include some of the comments about the EPL I've read on this forum which are just complete nonsense and seem to be nothing more than an attempted dig at the English. We all do it mate.

If it's a Scots v English league argument then the decision on nonsense depends on who's deciding. In a general Spurs - Arsenal, Man U Liverpool I don't think the same amount of nonsense is posted, because the Scots football fans pay more attention to other leagues in general than the English IMHO. Whether that is due to the deficiencies in our leagues, a higher interest in football in general, or the flood of claims to the epl being the best in the world leading English fans to not look abroad as much I don't know. Probably a bit of all of them.

BTW there's some really knowledgeable English football fans on the board - I'm not including them in the above argument.

[celtic]

The whole thing isn't at all surpising though is it. 100k people, 12 hours of drinking, team losing = trouble. It doesn't matter if they were scottish or english - its pretty inevitable.
I don't really understand why 100k people decided to desend on Manchester, apart from having to compete with a previous level set by their competitors. I think its in part because I've been spoilt by always being at the games but I have never really undestood people wanting to give themselves the worst position possible to actually watch a game of football, in search for 'atmosphere'. If they were such big fans they would be inside the stadium anyway(with the exception of 20-30k of regular attenders who couldnt get tickets).

this has been proven to not be the case in the past.

[Rooky9]

The whole thing isn't at all surpising though is it. 100k people, 12 hours of drinking, team losing = trouble. It doesn't matter if they were scottish or english - its pretty inevitable.
I don't really understand why 100k people decided to desend on Manchester, apart from having to compete with a previous level set by their competitors. I think its in part because I've been spoilt by always being at the games but I have never really undestood people wanting to give themselves the worst position possible to actually watch a game of football, in search for 'atmosphere'. If they were such big fans they would be inside the stadium anyway(with the exception of 20-30k of regular attenders who couldnt get tickets).

this have proven to not be the case in the past.

like where?

[celtic]

u want me to state the obvious?

[Rooky9]

u want me to state the obvious?

Yes... you didn't have 100k if your talking about Celtic. I also don't think that direct comparison works that well because they were in different locations - people tend to act differently depending on the culture they are surounded by...and their distance from home/comfort.

[Rod Paradise]

u want me to state the obvious?

Yes... you didn't have 100k if your talking about Celtic. I also don't think that direct comparison works that well because they were in different locations - people tend to act differently depending on the culture they are surounded by...and their distance from home/comfort.

How do you know how many were there? - there are varying counts from 80K to 125K.

The rest is nonsense. Football hooligans affected by the culture? WTF?

BTW one of the screens failed in a fans zone in Seville - during the match.

[celtic]

fail to see why its not comparable. 85k or 100k still equals a large amount of people in the same area imo.

[GlasgowBandit]

Rod the issue with the Celtic Casuals at Easter Road is only one example of the scarfers trying to police the support, in truth many of our scarfers are the ones that cause any trouble that kicks off when we are out on day trips or jolly's abroad and then leave it to the more militant element to clean it up, within that I don't just mean the casuals but politically minded Celtic Fans who where involved with AFA/RA and even the Republican element. 

I have been involved in a number of scraps with Celtic fans who where quite simply scum but as you know we have an element within our own support who won't accept racial abuse or don't take kindly to some of the 90 minute bigot brigade who want to give it large about God Blessing the Pope and all that nonsense.

As to Celtic, its easy to police yer own fans mate, all you do is get a hold of the scallies that look like they are going to start bother with other scarfers or the good people of wherever we are visting and give them a slap if they go too far.   

If lads want to go out and cause it with other lads then I don't have an issue with that and they can find places to have it off without involving the main element of the support or indeed the poor public going about their daily routine.

But please folks, lets not kid ourselves it wasn't the ICF or C18 that kicked this carnage off other day look at the video footage the ones causing the trouble where clowns decked out in blue with Union Jacks and Scarfs. 

As I said in my other post this is a problem Rangers have had for years, everywhere they go they cause trouble.

Remember two things:

They where the first British team to be banned from Europe for causing it in Barcelons in 1972
They managed to get themselves banned from England, the country many of them feel so patriotic about a number of years back also.

Add to this the carnage they caused in Barcelona, Pamplona and Villareal in recent years, also remember when they played an Irish team the home leg for the irish was moved to Tranmere because they feared from the visiting hordes.

[henrik777]

Sandy