Our Troops - My Thoughts

[trafficjam]

I read this thread some time ago but did not post my thoughts at the time.  I have re-read this again today and find it hard to put into words how I feel, as it brought some of my childhood memories back, especially the cheese incident, though mine was very mild to yours.

My father was killed at the Battle of Casino in WWII and it was reported that the Americans were bombing indiscriminately and many the allied troops were killed.  My mother was left with four of us under the age of eight. She had it very hard and of course was very strict with us but was very fair and although money was short, she treated us all the same.  One day an apple went missing from the bowl on the table. She lined us all up and asked us individually who took it. Of course, we all denied taking the apple. Finally she said alright if you don't own up she would smack my youngest brother.  This shook us all, as although she was strict, she never hit us, her anger was enough for us to behave.  I admitted at taking the apple as I couldn't see my little brother getting a smack and I had to go to bed without any tea.  It was the next day as I was sweeping the floor (I was only about 7 years old at the time but we all had our jobs to do), I found the apple under the armchair. I cannot remember my mother's reaction as it was so long ago.

Fortunately, my mother got help through SSAFA and we all went to military boarding schools where we all took pride in our family regiments. I went to the Royal Soldiers Daughters' School at Hampstead, one brother went to the Duke of Yorks Royal Military School at Dover, one to The Gordon Boys School in Surrey and the other to King Edwards School in Surrey.  Most of the children at these schools had either lost their father during the war or were serving overseas. My eldest brother did National Service in the Army and my two other brothers signed up to the army and served in Cyprus and Germany.

Thank you Geo for sharing your stories.

[trafficjam]

Oh and you were right about Fagins ... down the steps then you had to negotiate the stickiest carpet in the world... LOL what a shit hole that was ... its closed down now, the owners of molly malones turned it into a poker room would you believe ... lasted about 3 months as it was never advertised or promoted.

lol we had a Fagans locally and that was the same, your shoes stuck to the carpet!

[trafficjam]

My Dad served with the Royal Fusiliers, went in on National service, and ended up staying in for a god few years. I dont know if basic training has changed much, but he used to tell me that the first mission for the instructors was to break each person down to rock bottom and then build them back up again in the "army" way ... my old man was (and still is) as fit as a butchers dog, and even he struggled to get through it !

He saw active service in North Africa among other places, but generally was a peace time Soldier ... despite him loving his time serving his country, he didnt encourage either myself or my brother to join up, in fact I would say he did his best to make sure we didnt.

My Brother Joined the ATC and was a gnats cock away from joining the RAF ... Beer & Girls saved him LOL. He still flies regularly though and is a qualified Glider pilot and has a light aircraft pilots license.

This is the first time I have heard that expression outside my house.  My husband always uses that expression when referring to something very small, he says it is a saying they used when he was in production engineering.

[thetank]

Just signed a petition for a pal. A few pubs in Arbroath banned all army personnel which seems a little off to me.

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/forcesban/?signed=f13ead1.e51cb9

Is this sort of thing common in towns near army bases? Fair play to ban individuals who cause trouble, that's their right as a buisness and what have you, but to not let someone into a pub because of their profession is mad is it not? Do pubs in other areas of the country get away with this kind of stuff?

[Geo the Sarge]

Just signed a petition for a pal. A few pubs in Arbroath banned all army personnel which seems a little off to me.

http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/forcesban/?signed=f13ead1.e51cb9

Is this sort of thing common in towns near army bases? Fair play to ban individuals who cause trouble, that's their right as a buisness and what have you, but to not let someone into a pub because of their profession is mad is it not? Do pubs in other areas of the country get away with this kind of stuff?

Unfortunately it is all too common. There was a thread up a while back about the soldier who was refused accom at, I think, a travelodge as they had a bit of trouble previously with a group of soldiers.

Every Garrison town has many bars/clubs that do not allow Soldiers. The Army don't help themselves either when they produce lists of clubs where the junior ranks are forbidden to go but the Senior ranks/Officers can, in order to prevent fraternisation between the ranks etc. It was mostly so they could have the best haunts without the possible hassle of the drunken junior rank spoiling their night. Some of these young officers were actually far worse, believe me.

Soldiers will be overly boisterous at times and tbh many of them are well OTT, however a blanket ban is just the easy way out

We had the same problem in Colchester, however a couple of the pubs there recognised that some SNCO's frequented often and actually gave them offers of cheap/free drink to keep the soldiers in line. Win/win as the landlord got plenty of business with minimum of hassle and the SNCO would get free nights on the booze.

The biggest problem I found that existed between the soldiers and local lads was the fact that the soldiers were easy meat for the local lassies. Lots of free drink and a fit young man to do the business should they want it, as opposed to Mr tight wad, beer belly slobber in the alley local (not all cases.)

Thanks for highlighting Tank.

Geo

[RED-DOG]

You're such an eloquent "Explainer" Geo, (Does that come from shouting at squaddies?) 

I wish you would write more.



BTW- this is a different situation, but I know how it feels....

[Geo the Sarge]

You're such an eloquent "Explainer" Geo, (Does that come from shouting at squaddies?)  

I wish you would write more.



BTW- this is a different situation, but I know how it feels....

Thanks Tom (edit: although I feel there is a wee bit tongue in cheek there)

Know exactly what it feels like, seen many such posters but substitute Gypsy/Traveller with soldier. Unlike you guys, we usually had many other alternatives to go to.

BTW, just like the upper case "G" in Gypsy and use of other words to describe Gypsies/Travellers, for most soldiers, "Squaddies" is taken as derogatory too, doesn't bother me too much as I know in most cases it isn't meant badly, however the word does make me a cringe a bit.


Geo

[AndrewT]

BTW- this is a different situation, but I know how it feels....

Isn't it the case that, as Gypsies are recognised as a separate ethnic group, this poster is actually illegal?

But if they'd just said Travellers, it would be OK, as they're not, so it would be the same as banning soldiers or away fans at pubs near football grounds.

[RED-DOG]

You're such an eloquent "Explainer" Geo, (Does that come from shouting at squaddies?)  

I wish you would write more.



BTW- this is a different situation, but I know how it feels....

Thanks Tom (edit: although I feel there is a wee bit tongue in cheek there)

Know exactly what it feels like, seen many such posters but substitute Gypsy/Traveller with soldier. Unlike you guys, we usually had many other alternatives to go to.

BTW, just like the upper case "G" in Gypsy and use of other words to describe Gypsies/Travellers, for most soldiers, "Squaddies" is taken as derogatory too, doesn't bother me too much as I know in most cases it isn't meant badly, however the word does make me a cringe a bit.


Geo

Not tongue in cheek at all Geo and I take your "Squaddies" point.

[RED-DOG]

BTW- this is a different situation, but I know how it feels....

Isn't it the case that, as Gypsies are recognised as a separate ethnic group, this poster is actually illegal?

But if they'd just said Travellers, it would be OK, as they're not, so it would be the same as banning soldiers or away fans at pubs near football grounds.

Andrew is correct. (As usual)

[Geo the Sarge]

You're such an eloquent "Explainer" Geo, (Does that come from shouting at squaddies?)  

I wish you would write more.



BTW- this is a different situation, but I know how it feels....

Thanks Tom (edit: although I feel there is a wee bit tongue in cheek there)

Know exactly what it feels like, seen many such posters but substitute Gypsy/Traveller with soldier. Unlike you guys, we usually had many other alternatives to go to.

BTW, just like the upper case "G" in Gypsy and use of other words to describe Gypsies/Travellers, for most soldiers, "Squaddies" is taken as derogatory too, doesn't bother me too much as I know in most cases it isn't meant badly, however the word does make me a cringe a bit.


Geo

Not tongue in cheek at all Geo and I take your "Squaddies" point.

Sorry mate,

I'd describe my writing as being more concise than eloquent, you do eloquent. Thats why I thought you had inverted the explainer bit.

Always welcome your feedback.

Am encouraged to maybe add another couple of posts.

Geo

[RED-DOG]

Concise is a great word. Karabiner, (the master when it comes to finding precisely the right word) would have used it.

However, your writing is not concise rather than eloquent, it is concise and eloquent.

(And before you ask, the answer is no, my tongue is still not in my cheek).

Now write some more please.

[Geo the Sarge]

For Rodney:

Like everyone else who followed the thread about Rodney and Cassie I was devastated when Turney broke the sad news that Rodney had to be put to sleep after his horrific injury. I owe a great debt to the ITB crew, as a newbie I had decided at the last minute to attend BB4 at Luton. Knowing no-one, I was quite apprehensive when we all met up on the Friday night and went to the Chinese buffet.

I took a seat amongst the ITB crew and was welcomed instantly into the fold, had a great laugh, was introduced to many fantastic people and had one of the greatest weekends all the way through till the early hours of Sunday morning. This is my dog story and I write this post in thanks to you all.

Early in 1981 I made my way to Ballykinler in Co. Down in Northern Ireland for a 2 year stint. In the June of that year Mrs Geo and I married and we took up quarters on the estate within the camp.

The Regiment where there as the “Resident Battalion” and our tasks were varied, predominately reacting to large terrorist events, policing marches and riots and providing cover for various units during their periods of rest and recuperation. Every few months or so, each company would deploy to one of the border outposts such as Forkhill, Fermanagh, Crossmaglen or Middletown. These deployments could last anywhere between a fortnight to a month.

The purposes of these deployments were primarily to be in-situ as a quick reaction force to any incident within the area and also to provide frequent patrols to let the locals and the terrorists know that we had a presence there (reassurance for the locals and hopefully dissuasion for the terrorists.) From these bases we also carried out quite a few ambush operations, where information had been received of possible explosive/arms movements taking place or indeed the possibility of an attack on local Army/RUC bases or local dignitaries or politicians (we called this babysitting.)

As she was new to Army life and didn’t really know anyone, Mrs Geo had asked if she could get a dog as a companion for when I would be away and we agreed to start looking for a suitable beast.

We had seen an advertising card in the local NAAFI stating that a litter of pups would soon become available so we decided to check them out. The owner of the bitch that had just produced the litter was the Regimental butcher, a massive bloke called Shuggie Rice and the dame herself was a beautiful black Labrador which we had seen many times on the estate and had often stopped to admire and stroke.

The old adage of “as fit as a butcher’s dog” was well suited in this case. A large but muscular beast she had obviously been fed and exercised well, Ballykinler was a great place for this, with a large beach and rolling grassy dunes at the back gate of the camp which formed part of Dundrum Bay which sits at the foot of the stunning Mourne Mountains.

[Geo the Sarge]

We visited Shuggie that night and on introducing us to the litter he explained that the mother had actually absconded one night and had been ‘caught’ by one of the patrol Alsatians owned by a member of the Provost Staff who had been out walking his dog that night.

They were a beautiful litter, all jet black like their mother with varying splashes of white. We took a fancy to one particular bitch which had a splash of white on her breast and her left hind leg. After spending a good while chatting to Shuggie and his wife and having a great time with the litter, we agreed that we would take our chosen pup when they became available in a week or so.

We collected her when ready and we named her Roxy (Mrs Geo had been a great Bryan Ferry fan.) We all settled in well together and it was obvious from the start that Roxy was a great learner. House trained within a short time and was soon obeying all sorts of commands: sit, stay, lie down and of course “dads slippers.”

She was a beautiful beast, Labrador in body, with the longer, tapered, face of the Alsatian. She seemed to take on the temperament of her Labrador mother and the intelligence of her Alsatian father. I may look out some photos and hopefully add to the thread although I’m not sure I have any that truly do her justice, for whatever reason, whenever you pointed a camera at here she would curl her lips, bare her teeth and shy away.

We had one really bad experience with her when she was about 9 months old. I had actually been attending a football training session with the Regimental squad and was heading back into camp. The wife and Roxy had been to the local shops and were also approaching the main gates of the camp but on the opposite side of the road. Roxy spotted me and dashed across the road towards me, unfortunately right into the path of a ¾ ton MOD land Rover. Luckily the guy had braked fairly sharpish and there wasn’t as great an impact as there could have been. However she had one of her hind legs caught under one of the rear wheels.

There we were, me and the Mrs, trying to lift the rear of a ¾ ton Land Rover to release the dog whilst screaming at the driver to move the vehicle slightly to help release her. The driver jumps out to see what is happening only for Mrs Geo to holler at him “Get back in and move this fucking thing off my dog!!” Poor guy, it was totally our fault and he’s receiving the wrath of Mrs Geo (not a nice experience I can assure you.) We got her released and to the vet pretty sharpish to find out she was lucky not to have broken anything although there was a huge gash in her hind leg. It cost us something like £200 at the time, which was a helluva lot to us then but proved to be well worth it.

[Geo the Sarge]

Fast forward about 6 months and I am to deploy to Middletown for a 6 week period.

We would be using the RUC station there as a base for patrolling the border area, setting up vehicle checkpoints, doing farm searches and similar tasks. Mrs Geo was planning on returning to Edinburgh during this period as a cousin of hers was getting married, however we had the problem as to who would look after the dog. The ferry was out of the question as the whole journey to Larne – Stranraer and on to Edinburgh was a task in itself whereas the flight from Belfast to Edinburgh was much more convenient and even in those days, much cheaper.

I spoke to my Platoon commander and he agreed that I could take Roxy with me to Middletown as, for the majority of the time we would only be out of camp for a couple of hours at a time and there would always be someone there to keep an eye on her. So it was that we headed to Middletown in the back of a Pantech:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pantechnicon

Hard to believe that this was 2 years after the Warrenpoint ambush and we were still using road transport for large troop movements.

We settled down into the accommodation in the RUC station with Roxy taking her then usual place at the foot of my bed. Since a pup she had always shared our bed, however as she was growing we had to limit her to the foot of the bed, although more often than not she would still manage to end up sliding up to lie between Mrs Geo and I during the night. Best substitute for a water bottle ever! A position she would maintain throughout her life.

There was plenty of room around the base for her to exercise and never a shortage of volunteers to not only look after her when I was out but to take her for some exercise, normally running her ragged with a well worn cricket ball playing fetch.