Collusion

[snoopy1239]

This topic has always nagged away at me, but I've never come to any conclusions.

I can't count the amount of times I've witnessed collusion of some sort or another.

A friend of mine was telling me a story last night. I'm gonna refrain from giving spefic details to avoid offending anyone.

He was playing at a certain casino and reached the final table. That table also consisted of buddies. When one guy went all-in, his mate folded on the big blind when the pot was around 10 times more than what was required to call. The big blind had plenty of chips and he would obviously had made the call with any other player.

Anyway, there was a bit of a kaffufle but nothing was done to punish what I consider to be blatant collusion which occurs frequently in local casinos.

However, a part of me says that this activity simply can't be proved. What if a big blind player claims to not really know what he is doing. Saw a 2-7 off suit and just folded instinctively. Or perhaps he could say that he just didn't realise the player was all-in. blah blah blah etc.

So my question is, can this sort of collusion ever be outed from the game, or will it always exist? I've been a victim of it myself and it can be very frustrating. Plus, can you actually prove anything? Sometimes I think twice about complaining as there is little that can be done. All that will happen is that you'll make enemies at your table, which is never sensible.

I also remember Tony telling me a story of how a guy folded two aces to his friend. I think he said someone just turned over his cards. Has anyone encountered similar incidents?

[redsimon]

Unfortunately it does happen. The only "cure" is player vigilance. Complain to the Cardroom supervisor, make a fuss! It might get grunts and muttering from the "same village" players but if it cleans up the game and turns it back into poker then all to the good.

[tikay]

Ah, "collusuion" a hobby-horse of mine. Redsimon has it spot on, you cant stop it, but make a fuss.

The incident snoopy refers to? I dion't recall the two A's incident, but I do remember this.

We were down to 7 in a Final at Notts, blinds were 4k-2k. Short stack moves in for his entire stack - 5k. All pass to his buddy in the BB. Buddy has 90k, & only has to put iin 1k to call the all-in R by billy short stack. So there is 6k worth of blinds sitting in the middle, & for the deep stacked BB to call, he has to put 1k of his 90k in & is getting odds of 11-1. Even 7-2 off is not 11-1 against AA, & remember the BB has 90k - and passed!

I grabbed his cards as he mucked them & turned them over - K-7. I called the Manager, but he said he could not do anything about it.

I looked for support from the rest of the table - silence. But after the comp finished, they all came up to me & said "you were right to make the point".....

The next hand, another short stack got busted out by the guy who had won the dodgy hand - so he had every right to feel aggrieved. But he did not complain because HE has a couple of "same village" buddies as well....!

So I confronted the deep-stacked colluder afterwards, & called him a cheat, quite openly. He could not accept he had cheated, "everybody does it, & anyway, he (biilly low stack) is giving me a lift home"......

So now, 6 months later, I still openly call this guy a cheat every time I see him, especially at the table, & I warn the other players that this guy colludes. It annoys the life out of him - "leave it, will you", & hopefully, by continually embarrassing him about it, he will refrain from doing so in future.

I must confess that not all my friends agree that I am right to call this guy a cheat, they think thats a bit strong, but that's the way I see it. If everybody took my line & exposed these guys, it would certainly help the situation.

2 other guys I know regularly do it too, & they genuinely do not accept that they are doing wrong. But they are.

And it's quite usual for a guy to whisper in my ear, "lets not be silly, if you & me get involved in a pot, let's check it down". No thanks buddy, forget it.

Does this happen at the higher levels? For sure it does, but not as much, as far as I can see, but it does happen.

So, as Redsimon says, "make a fuss" when you see it happening.