Michael Jackson dies of Heart Attack

[MANTIS01]

I agree with Tank in this debate. The abuse allegation was brought to the table by Jordan Chandler's Dad...over a year after the abuse supposedly happened...Michael Jackson's legal team settled with Jordan Chandler's legal team for $22million. I reckon the only abuse to be found here would have been in the meeting between the Dad and the 2 legal teams when they decided what figure to sting Jackson for and how to carve it up amongst themselves. With that much easy money on the table I would humbly suggest corruption is inevitable. Chandler's Dad would never accept money if he believed his son had been abused. Would any of you guys accept money if your child had been abused?? Jackson died skint. He sure got the right advice from the people around him who obv always had his best interests at heart.

lol... just lol

On a slightly more descriptive note.

If you were in that position and offered a $1m then you'd say no
if they then offered $2m - and you said no
they then offered $4m - and you said no
then $8m - and you said no

Are you saying it's entirely unfeasible that they couldn't get to a figure that eventually would keep you and your extended family financially secure for life plus plenty left over for luxuries - and you'd never give in?

If your son was sexually abused Jon, how many luxuries would need to be offered before you gave in?

[TightEnd]

Guys

Its a tricky thread in places.

I've deleted one of the very close to the bone tasteless post death jokes, just now

Time and a place and all that I think, lets not stretch the boundaries of good taste on here please

[EvilPie]

I agree with Tank in this debate. The abuse allegation was brought to the table by Jordan Chandler's Dad...over a year after the abuse supposedly happened...Michael Jackson's legal team settled with Jordan Chandler's legal team for $22million. I reckon the only abuse to be found here would have been in the meeting between the Dad and the 2 legal teams when they decided what figure to sting Jackson for and how to carve it up amongst themselves. With that much easy money on the table I would humbly suggest corruption is inevitable. Chandler's Dad would never accept money if he believed his son had been abused. Would any of you guys accept money if your child had been abused?? Jackson died skint. He sure got the right advice from the people around him who obv always had his best interests at heart.

lol... just lol

On a slightly more descriptive note.

If you were in that position and offered a $1m then you'd say no
if they then offered $2m - and you said no
they then offered $4m - and you said no
then $8m - and you said no

Are you saying it's entirely unfeasible that they couldn't get to a figure that eventually would keep you and your extended family financially secure for life plus plenty left over for luxuries - and you'd never give in?

If I had a child and some paedo had fiddled with him / her I guarantee that I would want the c**t dead.

If that wasn't possible then locked up for ever.

No amount of money would ever be enough unless I was going to use it to hire a hitman to kill the twat.

However. If I was a deceitful bastard with no morals who's son happened to know a rich person who was open to a cheeky bit of extortion then yes I believe there's a figure I would settle at. I probably wouldn't care about facts or anything like that, as long as my son hadn't actually been abused then just the cash would do.

[Jon MW]

I agree with Tank in this debate. The abuse allegation was brought to the table by Jordan Chandler's Dad...over a year after the abuse supposedly happened...Michael Jackson's legal team settled with Jordan Chandler's legal team for $22million. I reckon the only abuse to be found here would have been in the meeting between the Dad and the 2 legal teams when they decided what figure to sting Jackson for and how to carve it up amongst themselves. With that much easy money on the table I would humbly suggest corruption is inevitable. Chandler's Dad would never accept money if he believed his son had been abused. Would any of you guys accept money if your child had been abused?? Jackson died skint. He sure got the right advice from the people around him who obv always had his best interests at heart.

lol... just lol

On a slightly more descriptive note.

If you were in that position and offered a $1m then you'd say no
if they then offered $2m - and you said no
they then offered $4m - and you said no
then $8m - and you said no

Are you saying it's entirely unfeasible that they couldn't get to a figure that eventually would keep you and your extended family financially secure for life plus plenty left over for luxuries - and you'd never give in?

If your son was sexually abused Jon, how many luxuries would need to be offered before you gave in?

If you had a choice between being poor and possibly losing your home if you ever lost your job - but the abuser would get sent to prison

or

Being financially secure and not having to worry about money, and your children not ever having to worry about money, and possibly their children never having to worry about money - but he doesn't get sent to prison

you'd still rather he went to prison?

What is justice?
If his payout ensures you're safe from any recession and you're never going to go hungry or homeless or have to rely on benefits - doesn't that count as atonement?
Or does justice have to equal punishment and revenge?

Isn't a payoff a much more constructive way of atoning than being locked up?

[George2Loose]

MJ obv had a "suspicious" relationship with children but this does not mean he necessarily abused them.

It was never proven in court and I find it a contradiction that people say if he was innocent he wouldn't pay the money- If he was guilty surely the parents shouldn't have accepted the money?

I personally agree with Matt- I would want him dead or locked away so he could never do it again and no amount of money would change that.

[Geo the Sarge]

I agree with Tank in this debate. The abuse allegation was brought to the table by Jordan Chandler's Dad...over a year after the abuse supposedly happened...Michael Jackson's legal team settled with Jordan Chandler's legal team for $22million. I reckon the only abuse to be found here would have been in the meeting between the Dad and the 2 legal teams when they decided what figure to sting Jackson for and how to carve it up amongst themselves. With that much easy money on the table I would humbly suggest corruption is inevitable. Chandler's Dad would never accept money if he believed his son had been abused. Would any of you guys accept money if your child had been abused?? Jackson died skint. He sure got the right advice from the people around him who obv always had his best interests at heart.

lol... just lol

On a slightly more descriptive note.

If you were in that position and offered a $1m then you'd say no
if they then offered $2m - and you said no
they then offered $4m - and you said no
then $8m - and you said no

Are you saying it's entirely unfeasible that they couldn't get to a figure that eventually would keep you and your extended family financially secure for life plus plenty left over for luxuries - and you'd never give in?

If your son was sexually abused Jon, how many luxuries would need to be offered before you gave in?

If you had a choice between being poor and possibly losing your home if you ever lost your job - but the abuser would get sent to prison

or

Being financially secure and not having to worry about money, and your children not ever having to worry about money, and possibly their children never having to worry about money - but he doesn't get sent to prison

you'd still rather he went to prison?

What is justice?
If his payout ensures you're safe from any recession and you're never going to go hungry or homeless or have to rely on benefits - doesn't that count as atonement?
Or does justice have to equal punishment and revenge?

Isn't a payoff a much more constructive way of atoning than being locked up?

No

Geo

[Jon MW]

...

If your son was sexually abused Jon, how many luxuries would need to be offered before you gave in?

in answer to that specifically - I haven't given an opinion, I've just asked questions.

personally my view is similar to EvilPie's

[Claw75]

I'm pretty sure we've had the 'was Michael Jackson guilty' debate on here before.  No one's going to change their beliefs on that one, and truth is no one but the accused or Michael Jackson knows 100% whether those allegations were well-founded.  Rest of this is all my opinion, of course.

I don't think he was guilty.  I think he was a strange man.  He had no childhood to speak of, and he forged what were perhaps unwise and certainly naive friendships with young children in his adult life as in many ways he was a child himself.  Settling out of court with the Chandlers was not, imo, an admission of guilt.  Whatever your views, imagine for a minute that you are in MJs shoes and guilty of nothing more than forming a friendship with a boy that is not considered 'normal' for a man of your age.  God knows what kind of stress something like that would put on your personal life.  You might also feel a lot of sympathy for your friend being put through the ordeal, particularly if you thought his parents were the puppet masters.  You just might think it's worth paying to make it go away.

As Mantis said - if those parents truely believed Jackson had absued their son, no amount of money would persuade them to 'settle' out of court.  Their sole aim would be to get the case heard in court, and to do everything in their power to ensure that their son's abuser was put in jail and no one else suffered.

Maybe we'll never know the truth, maybe we will.  Whatever the case, being Michael Jackson must have been a hell of a burden a lot of the time.  I hope he's at rest.

[Acidmouse]

I agree with Tank in this debate. The abuse allegation was brought to the table by Jordan Chandler's Dad...over a year after the abuse supposedly happened...Michael Jackson's legal team settled with Jordan Chandler's legal team for $22million. I reckon the only abuse to be found here would have been in the meeting between the Dad and the 2 legal teams when they decided what figure to sting Jackson for and how to carve it up amongst themselves. With that much easy money on the table I would humbly suggest corruption is inevitable. Chandler's Dad would never accept money if he believed his son had been abused. Would any of you guys accept money if your child had been abused?? Jackson died skint. He sure got the right advice from the people around him who obv always had his best interests at heart.

lol... just lol

On a slightly more descriptive note.

If you were in that position and offered a $1m then you'd say no
if they then offered $2m - and you said no
they then offered $4m - and you said no
then $8m - and you said no

Are you saying it's entirely unfeasible that they couldn't get to a figure that eventually would keep you and your extended family financially secure for life plus plenty left over for luxuries - and you'd never give in?

If your son was sexually abused Jon, how many luxuries would need to be offered before you gave in?

If you had a choice between being poor and possibly losing your home if you ever lost your job - but the abuser would get sent to prison

or

Being financially secure and not having to worry about money, and your children not ever having to worry about money, and possibly their children never having to worry about money - but he doesn't get sent to prison

you'd still rather he went to prison?

What is justice?
If his payout ensures you're safe from any recession and you're never going to go hungry or homeless or have to rely on benefits - doesn't that count as atonement?
Or does justice have to equal punishment and revenge?

Isn't a payoff a much more constructive way of atoning than being locked up?

It was a civil case, it was not a case of going to get locked up or not. He paid him off in the civil action brought against him.  So people posting on here saying the parents should not have accepted the money but instead push to get him sent down need to stop, its irrelevent.

[George2Loose]

I agree with Tank in this debate. The abuse allegation was brought to the table by Jordan Chandler's Dad...over a year after the abuse supposedly happened...Michael Jackson's legal team settled with Jordan Chandler's legal team for $22million. I reckon the only abuse to be found here would have been in the meeting between the Dad and the 2 legal teams when they decided what figure to sting Jackson for and how to carve it up amongst themselves. With that much easy money on the table I would humbly suggest corruption is inevitable. Chandler's Dad would never accept money if he believed his son had been abused. Would any of you guys accept money if your child had been abused?? Jackson died skint. He sure got the right advice from the people around him who obv always had his best interests at heart.

lol... just lol

On a slightly more descriptive note.

If you were in that position and offered a $1m then you'd say no
if they then offered $2m - and you said no
they then offered $4m - and you said no
then $8m - and you said no

Are you saying it's entirely unfeasible that they couldn't get to a figure that eventually would keep you and your extended family financially secure for life plus plenty left over for luxuries - and you'd never give in?

If your son was sexually abused Jon, how many luxuries would need to be offered before you gave in?

If you had a choice between being poor and possibly losing your home if you ever lost your job - but the abuser would get sent to prison

or

Being financially secure and not having to worry about money, and your children not ever having to worry about money, and possibly their children never having to worry about money - but he doesn't get sent to prison

you'd still rather he went to prison?

What is justice?
If his payout ensures you're safe from any recession and you're never going to go hungry or homeless or have to rely on benefits - doesn't that count as atonement?
Or does justice have to equal punishment and revenge?

Isn't a payoff a much more constructive way of atoning than being locked up?

It was a civil case, it was not a case of going to get locked up or not. He paid him off in the civil action brought against him.  So people posting on here saying the parents should not have accepted the money but instead push to get him sent down need to stop, its irrelevent.

Surely if they won the civil case instead of settling it would lead to legal action?

[Acidmouse]

No.

[phatomch]

Guys

Its a tricky thread in places.

I've deleted one of the very close to the bone tasteless post death jokes, just now

Time and a place and all that I think, lets not stretch the boundaries of good taste on here please

this was me i think, but I he doesn't deserve this coverage after what he has done he doesnt deserve to be protected. Again would this topic be different if Gary Glitter had died?

[TightEnd]

Guys

Its a tricky thread in places.

I've deleted one of the very close to the bone tasteless post death jokes, just now

Time and a place and all that I think, lets not stretch the boundaries of good taste on here please

this was me i think, but I he doesn't deserve this coverage after what he has done he doesnt deserve to be protected. Again would this topic be different if Gary Glitter had died?

There's rarely a time and a place for bad taste jokes about paedophilia

This certainly isn't the forum for them. Thanks

[George2Loose]

No.

So basically if there's civil action there's never any criminal repurcussions afterward?

[Acidmouse]

No.

So basically if there's civil action there's never any criminal repurcussions afterward?

The two are totally different. You see many civil cases brought against people who have been proven innocent in a court case.