ICM Question

[Blatch]

i think you are looking at thos too marginally

If you hadnt made the money - i would agree u could fold TT

HOWEVER - you have, and you are talking about pay scales. The one thing which strict ICM calculations dont tell you is what happens if you win.

If he has been open shoving his range is ATC. TT has this so crushed that this is a fist pump snap call (whereas if you havent made the  money it is a trivial fold).

There is not enough chip disparity between you and the others to make this a fold EVER

if it was like

CL = 500k
you 350k
v1 = 120k
v2 = 95k

then you could argue there was a possible fold. In this case you can never fold.

This makes no sense to me... if I hadn't made the money then I would be trying to accumulate chips as normal by getting it in with the best of it.... ie This situation would be a clear call as I am ~2/1 fav against the range i used....... Its because of the fact that we are in the money and the decision has a bearing on the amount we going to make that its a borderline decison

If were on the bubble then TT is an instant fold to the chip leader shove, were only considering it now as were in the money

[outragous76]

The one thing which strict ICM calculations dont tell you is what happens if you win.

What?

Its either a call or a fold based on the remaining payouts.  What more info is required?

+1 to the what? ...

In this case, one of the things it's taking into account is that the rewards of winning this hand with TT aren't actually that massive - we'll go from 2nd in chips to a non-dominant chip lead. In other circumstances, with different chip stacks, of course the answer would be different.

(

You raised the point i was making - but i think get it wrong!

Having twice 2nd place's stack leaves you at a huge advantage - infact you essentially swap places with him. So you end up with a very dominant position by calling and winning

The point I am making here is that the tourney situation changes dramatically with you as a huge CL

ICM NEVER factors this in, but in this situation it is critically important, especially with everyone in the money