UKIPT Brighton Day 2 Bust hand: fold to 3 bet?

[OJ]

Busted on this hand during UKIPT Brighton n was wondering if i overplay my hand here:

Stacks
Hero: 83k
Villian: 150k

Blinds: 800/1600 100 Ante on 9 handed table

Hero: utg

I opened UTG for 4200 and it got folded to the BU, Sam Grafton. If you know him, you'll know he's a fairly active player especially in position. He had 3bet me a bunch and I had folded and 4 bet an equal amount imo.

He 3bets me to 10,500. My thinking was that he probably 3bets about 20% here on my EP raise. I didn't like cold call cuz he c-bets pretty much 100% of his range on any board texture. Also, havn to call down at least 2 barrels OOP wasn't something i was too comfy with.
Now, 4 bet didnt seem like a very good option because to get him to fold IP with the stack sizes being very deep  id hav to 4bet nearly 30k? or could I min 4 bet/fold to like 19? Whats he folding out here IP to a small 4bet with such implieds and position?

3rd option was folding to the 3bet...didn't really like that either as I knew he was 3betting a bunch and it seemed so weak to just muck.

And last option was to 4bet shove, which is what I did. I think hes folding out up to JJ, AQs type of hands here for half his stack or would he call alot wider here? If so maybe I should just fold to the small 3 bet? Seems so weak though

Outcome aside (ran into QQ), is this just a fairly high variance spot and I got the worst of it or am I overplaying my hand here with about 50BB deep.

thoughts?

[celtic]

Errr, i just open fold 10 J utg. Seems the best option. Once 3 bet then i'm def folding.

[AndrewT]

Don't like the UTG raise with JTo on a 9-handed table.

Is button really 3-betting 20% of UTG raises with hands that will fold to a 4bet? How many times has he 3bet your UTG raises?

This just seems complete spew - fold pre, as played fold to 3bet.

[OJ]

Just saw the template post so here some more side info:

1k buy-in main event

62 runners left
32 cash

no specific reads on villian other than him being fairly laggy IP and first in the pot in LP.

hand occured about 3levels into Day 2. I hadn't been too active in EP as both players on my left were players I didn't want to play post flop OOP a bunch (Channing and Brammer).

[OJ]

Don't like the UTG raise with JTo on a 9-handed table.

Is button really 3-betting 20% of UTG raises with hands that will fold to a 4bet? How many times has he 3bet your UTG raises?

This just seems complete spew - fold pre, as played fold to 3bet.

sorry that is a typo

its 

[MC]

Don't like the overshove. 20% seems like a high estimation of his 3betting range to an UTG open. You basically fold out all hands that you beat and all hands that have you crushed call.

I also don't like 4-bet folding.

That leaves calling the 3-bet or folding.

Both these options kinda suck. Calling feels like you're set mining not getting great odds OOP. Folding a hand as strong as tens feels pretty weak against said opponent.

[OJ]

Don't like the overshove. 20% seems like a high estimation of his 3betting range to an UTG open. You basically fold out all hands that you beat and all hands that have you crushed call.

I also don't like 4-bet folding.

That leaves calling the 3-bet or folding.

Both these options kinda suck. Calling feels like you're set mining not getting great odds OOP. Folding a hand as strong as tens feels pretty weak against said opponent.

I realise that 20% is a bunch but there is definitely suited connecters, mid pairs as well as the top end in his 3bet range even to utg open.

Not quite sure if filtered out what I shoulda done in your opinion?

[MC]

Don't like the overshove. 20% seems like a high estimation of his 3betting range to an UTG open. You basically fold out all hands that you beat and all hands that have you crushed call.

I also don't like 4-bet folding.

That leaves calling the 3-bet or folding.

Both these options kinda suck. Calling feels like you're set mining not getting great odds OOP. Folding a hand as strong as tens feels pretty weak against said opponent.

I realise that 20% is a bunch but there is definitely suited connecters, mid pairs as well as the top end in his 3bet range even to utg open.

Not quite sure if filtered out what I shoulda done in your opinion?

I'd probably call, but I'm not sure it's the best play.

[NigDawG]

think i'd 4bet call vs villain but then i probably have a different dynamic vs him than you might at this point

a shove has less variance (since he won't be calling off with as many spew overs as a 5bet shove of his) but TT is def strong enough to induce with imo.

you say in op that you folded and 4 bet in equal amounts...what did sam do when you 4bet previously?

[OJ]

Don't like the overshove. 20% seems like a high estimation of his 3betting range to an UTG open. You basically fold out all hands that you beat and all hands that have you crushed call.

I also don't like 4-bet folding.

That leaves calling the 3-bet or folding.

Both these options kinda suck. Calling feels like you're set mining not getting great odds OOP. Folding a hand as strong as tens feels pretty weak against said opponent.

I realise that 20% is a bunch but there is definitely suited connecters, mid pairs as well as the top end in his 3bet range even to utg open.

Not quite sure if filtered out what I shoulda done in your opinion?

I'd probably call, but I'm not sure it's the best play.

the thing i didnt like about calling was the fact that he c-bets pretty much 100%. Check raise on the flop is too pot commiting. I guess I could play stop and go and donk a low flop fairly big and fold if he puts me in.

think i'd 4bet call vs villain but then i probably have a different dynamic vs him than you might at this point

a shove has less variance (since he won't be calling off with as many spew overs as a 5bet shove of his) but TT is def strong enough to induce with imo.

you say in op that you folded and 4 bet in equal amounts...what did sam do when you 4bet previously?

He folded twice pre flop and 5bet shoved once but that was post flop play so doesn't relate too much imo.

[NigDawG]

Don't like the overshove. 20% seems like a high estimation of his 3betting range to an UTG open. You basically fold out all hands that you beat and all hands that have you crushed call.

I also don't like 4-bet folding.

That leaves calling the 3-bet or folding.

Both these options kinda suck. Calling feels like you're set mining not getting great odds OOP. Folding a hand as strong as tens feels pretty weak against said opponent.

I realise that 20% is a bunch but there is definitely suited connecters, mid pairs as well as the top end in his 3bet range even to utg open.

Not quite sure if filtered out what I shoulda done in your opinion?

I'd probably call, but I'm not sure it's the best play.

the thing i didnt like about calling was the fact that he c-bets pretty much 100%. Check raise on the flop is too pot commiting. I guess I could play stop and go and donk a low flop fairly big and fold if he puts me in.

not too sure why you'd ever want to bet/fold vs sam

[OJ]

Don't like the overshove. 20% seems like a high estimation of his 3betting range to an UTG open. You basically fold out all hands that you beat and all hands that have you crushed call.

I also don't like 4-bet folding.

That leaves calling the 3-bet or folding.

Both these options kinda suck. Calling feels like you're set mining not getting great odds OOP. Folding a hand as strong as tens feels pretty weak against said opponent.

I realise that 20% is a bunch but there is definitely suited connecters, mid pairs as well as the top end in his 3bet range even to utg open.

Not quite sure if filtered out what I shoulda done in your opinion?

I'd probably call, but I'm not sure it's the best play.

the thing i didnt like about calling was the fact that he c-bets pretty much 100%. Check raise on the flop is too pot commiting. I guess I could play stop and go and donk a low flop fairly big and fold if he puts me in.

not too sure why you'd ever want to bet/fold vs sam

lol point taken...

[NigDawG]

you are probably going to get a lot of results orientated replies which is why it's usually best to not include results in the op!

but honestly, sam is aggressive and creative. i'd not be looking to fold TT to him preflop. i think you have too many bigs to make shoving pre optimal but vs a button 3bet of his it will certainly still be profitable.

calling the 3bet is fine by me, but like you said, you will have to call down on scary boards quite a bit, and a lot of players will not be comfortable doing this. there is also the possibility that you actually end up folding the best hand to him postflop.

therefore, i like 4bet/calling pre best, since it takes back control of the pot and puts the pressure back on him. there is also the added bonus of him spazzing out pre with any number of hands which your holding will play quite well against.

sucks you got coolered but don't think you could overplay your hand just 50bb deep here

[George2Loose]

Vs Sam I think this is deffo a cooler. 4 bet get it in imo

[OJ]

you are probably going to get a lot of results orientated replies which is why it's usually best to not include results in the op!

but honestly, sam is aggressive and creative. i'd not be looking to fold TT to him preflop. i think you have too many bigs to make shoving pre optimal but vs a button 3bet of his it will certainly still be profitable.

calling the 3bet is fine by me, but like you said, you will have to call down on scary boards quite a bit, and a lot of players will not be comfortable doing this. there is also the possibility that you actually end up folding the best hand to him postflop.

therefore, i like 4bet/calling pre best, since it takes back control of the pot and puts the pressure back on him. there is also the added bonus of him spazzing out pre with any number of hands which your holding will play quite well against.

sucks you got coolered but don't think you could overplay your hand just 50bb deep here

what about caling the 3bet and donking a low board? or is he too spazzo to let go if he doesn connect? cuz that again could create some nasty post flop spots. I dont mind hero-ing him on 2 streets but im not deep enuf to get away from it after turn imo.

as for 4bet pre: would u 4bet small for shove induce with broadways and smaller pairs? or bigger for to give him less fold equity and take it down pre?

but yea my thinking was too that 10's is pretty much crushing his 3betting range here.