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Author Topic: New Super-Casinos  (Read 4779 times)
Karabiner
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« on: February 23, 2005, 02:01:34 PM »

If these new 'super' casinos are going to provide cardrooms and competition for the established venues,
I'm all for them.

Who knows they may provide dealers, add money, have enough space to promote big-field tourneys etc.

This kind of competition could only have a positive impact on poker.

Personally I can see no downside to them.
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Ironside
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« Reply #1 on: February 23, 2005, 03:43:17 PM »

the down side to them is poker wont get huge card rooms in them infact poker might not even get small card rooms in these super casinos

casinos use poker to draw people in play the house games, poker makes them very little if not any money so they would rather do with out bulky card rooms taking up space where they can fit huge amounts of machines what are in effect cash cows to the casino.

now these super casinos wont need to draw poker players into them as they will already have none gambling draws (50% of the casinos floor space has to be put aside for nin-gambling atractions ie resturants and concert halls) so why would they want to use up a large area of the gambling space for poker players when they will already be able to attract punters by less expensive ways

so in other words bigger casinos with more attractions mean smaller card rooms and less poker (unless Tv poker goes manistream very unlikely)
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tikay
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« Reply #2 on: February 23, 2005, 03:44:57 PM »

Thanks Ralph.

You may well be right, but at this point in time, I disagree.

The large multi-national casinos - & to a lesser extent, the existing regional ones too - measure "income per square foot" (or metre, or whatever it is these days).

So slots generate an income to the casino of x per square metre per annum, gaming tables ditto, etc, etc.

And how much does the competition cardroom generate? Zilch, zero. The reg fee barely pays for the dealers, never mind the free drinks, sarnies & valet service. And it's worse than that. Slots & gaming tables operate for every hour the casino is open. Cardrooms are only used 50% of the time AT BEST, in some casinos, say, one that has 3 comps a week, it's far, far, less. And it's full when the comp starts, half empty by midnight, & down to 1 tabvle at 4am. All that expensive space, generating nothing, whilst the slots & tables are churning out money hour after hour.

OK, there is an indirect "plus" in that poker players use the breaks, & time pre & post comp to fritter away their money on the wheel & blackjack, but it's nowhere near as cost effective as it would be if all the space was available to slots & gaming 24/7.

As a side issue, the room in which last week's Deauville comp was held was NOT a casino room, it was more of a grand ballroom type of place. But it's hard to imagine a better venue for competition poker. Plenty of space. Good acoustics & aesthetics. Just lovely. Maybe that's the way forward.......But where did the money come from to pay for that lovely room last week? Us? No. The Hotel? No. The casino? No. Television.

So I urge caution if you do not wish to support the regional casinos. We cant afford to bite the hand that feeds us.....

I shall now retire to a dark room to await a deluge of criticism for my views. I mean, fancy someone taking the side of those utterly dreadful casinos, where we get all that fun for free, eh?

Thanks for your contributuon Ralph. I fancy this may run & run.....

Will you be coming over to Walsall this week?
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Karabiner
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« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2005, 04:49:51 PM »

Sorry for plonking this in the wrong forum Tony.

 Embarrassed

Quite fancied playing tonight's freezeout, but you guys play way past my bedtime !

Good luck to you though, I don't know where you get all that energy at our age !!!
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« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2005, 05:28:36 PM »

Huh, we give you TWO Forums & you choose the wrong one....... Roll Eyes

"at OUR age"Huh???. Me 35, and act like 16........Cant be doing with growing old gracefully & with dignity.

So can I assume you agree with me on my view on Super-Casinos then........
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« Reply #5 on: February 24, 2005, 02:08:44 AM »

Interesting debate, from a competition prospective the UK gaming industry does need a kick up the backside. The big operators enjoy local monopolies treat the customers and staff badly and put the minimum amount of investment into their properties. The only reason I would ever set foot in a UK casino is to play poker.  That said if there is to be liberalization of the gaming rules then the existing operators should be allowed to compete on an equal footing.

With regard to the Super Casino's I think some of the thinking is a little muddled here. Essentially the style is based on the US resort casino which is holiday destination. This works in the States because while gaming is spreading outside of Las Vegas and Atlantic City there are still vast tracts of Middle America were there are no Casinos or pretty much any form of legalized gambling. Compare this to the UK were about 90% of the population lives no more than an hour away from an existing Casino and there are plenty of alternative opportunities to gamble. Unless the operators are careful in locating their properties they could end up with 8 very expensive and very empty white elephants. It doesnt matter what games or machines a Casino installs it will go broke if it is empty.

How will this impact poker? Difficult to say if the regional casinos wake up to the fact that Poker is growing and that tournaments are a very effective (and cheap) way of getting people into the property  then maybe we will get  more rather than less card rooms.

Personally, I would rather play in dedicated Poker clubs like the Gutshot where I am paying more to play poker rather being subsidized by those players who cannot resist the lure of the Craps, Roulette and Black Jack tables. There are drawbacks and while growing the player pool does not readily sustain the Capital investment to fund decent playing facilities in all but a few locations.

Unfortunately this leaves me supporting the short sighted and mean spirited UK gaming industry.


     


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