Another spot beyond SNG Wiz?

[MC]

Thought the discussion in the last thread I posted was really good/useful so thought I might post up a little more often.


18-man final table, 4 paid.

You have to give people ranges that I think are unrealistically tight for you to get SNG Wiz to say you can shove in this spot.

However, I don't see how it's possible for us not to shove (well I actually make it 2400). We absolutely have to shove here right? I want to puke when I see that I folded here.

Folding here means we are committed to calling in the big blind if we get jammed on. So is there not an argument for going with any above average hand here? Folding here to get dealt T3os in the next hand doesn't seem very appealing.

What should we do with T7s, J4s, Q7os, A2os for example?

Why does SNG Wiz mess with my head like this!

Click to see full-size image.

PokerStars Game #57857617707: Tournament #365998563, $25+$2 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level X (400/800) - 2011/02/18 8:48:48 WET [2011/02/18 3:48:48 ET]
Table '365998563 1' 9-max Seat #6 is the button
Seat 1: epitomised (2735 in chips)
Seat 3: NotFor_long1 (9150 in chips)
Seat 5: giRL90ihqdaa (6385 in chips)
Seat 6: bdubs3737 (2025 in chips)
Seat 7: Tigra6691 (3195 in chips)
Seat 8: opdeflop (3510 in chips)
epitomised: posts the ante 50
NotFor_long1: posts the ante 50
giRL90ihqdaa: posts the ante 50
bdubs3737: posts the ante 50
Tigra6691: posts the ante 50
opdeflop: posts the ante 50
Tigra6691: posts small blind 400
opdeflop: posts big blind 800
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to epitomised [ ]
epitomised: folds
NotFor_long1: folds
giRL90ihqdaa: raises 5535 to 6335 and is all-in
bdubs3737: folds
Tigra6691: folds
opdeflop: folds
Uncalled bet (5535) returned to giRL90ihqdaa
giRL90ihqdaa collected 2300 from pot
giRL90ihqdaa: doesn't show hand
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2300 | Rake 0
Seat 1: epitomised folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: NotFor_long1 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: giRL90ihqdaa collected (2300)
Seat 6: bdubs3737 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: Tigra6691 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 8: opdeflop (big blind) folded before Flop

[boldie]

I shove here...but then again I'm tez

[Longy]

Yeah i like getting this in, make it 2400 

Sngwiz is terrible at these spots as it doesn't take into account you are about to have your stack decimated by the blinds. You basically have 2 choices to ship this or call the next hand, j8s with some (not a lot) of FE is deffo better than waiting imo.

[baltic_blonde]

Easy push. You only have just over 3bb and you want to put pressure on another small stack on the table (bb) whilst you can, and J8 suited plays well against small pocket pairs or overcards.

[MC]

Yeah i like getting this in, make it 2400  

Sngwiz is terrible at these spots as it doesn't take into account you are about to have your stack decimated by the blinds. You basically have 2 choices to ship this or call the next hand, j8s with some (not a lot) of FE is deffo better than waiting imo.

Recently I've just been trying to play too much like SNG Wiz, and it's rubbed off on me so much that I fold here when I would never have done before.  

Have been playing more of my own game the last few days and I feel like it's going so much better because of it.

I always thought break-even regs were stupid because they didn't bother to review their hands in SNGWiz, maybe it's the complete opposite!

[outragous76]

This is super close but I fold here!

[boldie]

This is super close but I fold here!

So would you call the next hand that you're in the blinds? And what would your range for calling the next hand be?

[outragous76]

I think the next hand is super interesting, cause good regs know you are calling. However if we are lucky enough to fold to sb, he could walk us due to the other Shorties.

My calling range is prob

22+
A2+
k7+
q8+
An assortmment of suited connectors 67+

I guess that's like top 65%?

[Longy]

I think the chances of us getting a walk next hand, are very small indeed. Couple of reasonable regs at this table.

[SuuPRlim]

Ok, Im so far under qualified to comment on your SNG stuff, but I'm enjoying reading them

How does the stack sizes of the BTN/SB/BB affect the dynamic here?

Does the BB have to fold ridic tight here, because the BTN and SB have to go through the blinds before him?

Does the BTN have to super widen up in these spots because you should be shoving wide and he can not sustain another round through the blinds?

And the guy with 6k, he has to fold out virtually all stuff for ICM yes?

If these 1 and 3 of these things are all correct, should this widen your range to nearly any two here?
If btn is calling off wide, how much should this tighten your range?

[DMorgan]

Shoving here all day, folding would be tez imo

Beautiful situation to shove here because big stack can't call light with 4 people behind and BTN/blinds can't call light due to stack size

Suprised to see bdubs there, he was grinding $60 9mans same as me 18 months ago, is he a reg in 18 mans now?

[outragous76]

I actually don't think I fold any K or Q

[Longy]

Suprised to see bdubs there, he was grinding $60 9mans same as me 18 months ago, is he a reg in 18 mans now?

I saw bdubs in a 45man think it was a 27/38, he any good?

I actually don't think I fold any K or Q

j8s better shoving hand than k2, k3, q4 etc.

[outragous76]

Suprised to see bdubs there, he was grinding $60 9mans same as me 18 months ago, is he a reg in 18 mans now?

I saw bdubs in a 45man think it was a 27/38, he any good?

I actually don't think I fold any K or Q

j8s better shoving hand than k2, k3, q4 etc.

I still mean next hand obv

[baltic_blonde]

Shoving here all day, folding would be tez imo

Beautiful situation to shove here because big stack can't call light with 4 people behind and BTN/blinds can't call light due to stack size

Totally agree, and even if you are called, it's likely to be a race,which you should be happy to take considering your stack size.