Public Sector Strikes

[boldie]

i am not a pie in the sky 'tax the rich' lefty btw, although i do think they should be taxed more!

Please expand on why you think this.

I wonder how many people who think the 'rich' should be taxed more - know how much they're being taxed at the moment?

I strongly suspect that their view is pretty much - however much they're paying now, they should be paying more.

Yeah just kind of makes me sick to hear that someone thinks that in return for creating 70 jobs I should be taxed even more than I am now.

Noone thinks that you should be taxed more because you create 70 extra jobs...we just think you should be taxed more because we like to shaft you and cus we're jealous as you live the drrrrrrrrrrrrreaaaaaaaaaam


Seriously though, I do agree that those better off need to pay a bit more.

MrsB and myself are fairly comfortable, I wouldn't have an issue paying 1% more in tax TBH. It wouldn't make a difference to the way we spend our money (I might buy a doughnut less when we go to NY in May but noone will go bust).
Those better off than MrsB and myself (and there are a few obv as we're very middleclass) should be taxed more than we are. Nothing massive, I don't think you should have to give up one of your 5 holidays a year () but if you are paying loads of tax you probably have a pretty poor financial advisor (or you've taken a decision to not exploit every angle the govt offers you).

It's about a fair system for all; I think you should be rewarded for doing well, so you should have 5 holidays a year and go out to dinner 4 times a week. Happy days, I hope to be able to do the same one of these days and it is obv stimulating the economy. I think that's massively important.

BUT; Taxing you an extra 2% might help the govt sell taxing me an extra 1% and, let's be honest, the 1% people like myself would be paying more is the stuff that would make a difference.
Your 2% doesn't make much difference as the "well off" or "rich" (What a terrible phrase BTW) nr much fewer than the middle classes but you have to sell a tax increase to the middle classes to get the money in you actually need.


edit; Just read that back...Not having a pop at you or the life you have ATM Bopkin, hope it doesn't come across as such.

[smashedagain]

i am not a pie in the sky 'tax the rich' lefty btw, although i do think they should be taxed more!

Please expand on why you think this.

Maybe he means they should lower the taxes for the rich as that makes them pay more?

Why don't you post some opinions that can be dissected instead of throwing in the odd pointless post that makes you look like a twat.

I am happy to extend on my opinions, and happy for them to be disected I wont even call anyone a twat.

I own part of a company with 2 other people.

The company creates 70 jobs, and through these and the corporation tax and VAT bills we chuck a cheeky mirrion into the government pot.

They then ask me after all of that for an obscene chunk of anything I try to take myself.

I like to think that creating all that tax is a little help to them, to the point that maybe we should be let off a little bit of our own tax, but you seem to think I should be taxed even more which I find a little unfair and that's what I was interested in.

Tax me much more and I will have to go and live somewhere else!

wow, are you really rich .....and even boldie is middleclass
and as you did not like the banker joke, judge this one
great news for all my poker insomniac friends......only 4 more sleeps till christmas

[Bongo]

Not sure you're right there boldie (about the middle's 1% being more than the top's 2%), apparently the top 1% of earners pay 25% of income tax:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/consumertips/tax/8321369/Top-1-of-workers-pay-quarter-of-all-income-tax.html

[redsimon]

Not sure you're right there boldie (about the middle's 1% being more than the top's 2%), apparently the top 1% of earners pay 25% of income tax:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/consumertips/tax/8321369/Top-1-of-workers-pay-quarter-of-all-income-tax.html

How much of the total income do they earn though? Otherwise the stat is meaningless

[EvilPie]

Lol at Hopkin being rich.

Do you not realise how much he spends following Boldie's tips?

[EvilPie]

I wish there was somebody else on Ace2m's side here because then it would seem like more of a debate than a gang rape.

Unfortunately as nobody agrees with him he's going to have to continue to bend over and take one for the public sector team.

[StuartHopkin]

i am not a pie in the sky 'tax the rich' lefty btw, although i do think they should be taxed more!

Please expand on why you think this.

I wonder how many people who think the 'rich' should be taxed more - know how much they're being taxed at the moment?

I strongly suspect that their view is pretty much - however much they're paying now, they should be paying more.

Yeah just kind of makes me sick to hear that someone thinks that in return for creating 70 jobs I should be taxed even more than I am now.

Noone thinks that you should be taxed more because you create 70 extra jobs...we just think you should be taxed more because we like to shaft you and cus we're jealous as you live the drrrrrrrrrrrrreaaaaaaaaaam


Seriously though, I do agree that those better off need to pay a bit more.

MrsB and myself are fairly comfortable, I wouldn't have an issue paying 1% more in tax TBH. It wouldn't make a difference to the way we spend our money (I might buy a doughnut less when we go to NY in May but noone will go bust).
Those better off than MrsB and myself (and there are a few obv as we're very middleclass) should be taxed more than we are. Nothing massive, I don't think you should have to give up one of your 5 holidays a year () but if you are paying loads of tax you probably have a pretty poor financial advisor (or you've taken a decision to not exploit every angle the govt offers you).

It's about a fair system for all; I think you should be rewarded for doing well, so you should have 5 holidays a year and go out to dinner 4 times a week. Happy days, I hope to be able to do the same one of these days and it is obv stimulating the economy. I think that's massively important.

BUT; Taxing you an extra 2% might help the govt sell taxing me an extra 1% and, let's be honest, the 1% people like myself would be paying more is the stuff that would make a difference.
Your 2% doesn't make much difference as the "well off" or "rich" (What a terrible phrase BTW) nr much fewer than the middle classes but you have to sell a tax increase to the middle classes to get the money in you actually need.


edit; Just read that back...Not having a pop at you or the life you have ATM Bopkin, hope it doesn't come across as such.

No offence at all Bold one. Least thinly veiled brag thread ever obv! (I get a fair bit of tax advice )

It gets my back up and I obvioulsy want to respond to statements like Ace2M's but I am more than happy to take any replies and posts from people I know in the faith they are just for debating. Anyone else's I will take in the general jestaments that is the internetz.

My question would be where do you draw the line then? You could tax me an extra 5% or maybe they were going to make it 48% previously but then they have already added an extra 2%

Would someone earning £250 a week really notice £2.50 less a week?

[boldie]

Not sure you're right there boldie (about the middle's 1% being more than the top's 2%), apparently the top 1% of earners pay 25% of income tax:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/consumertips/tax/8321369/Top-1-of-workers-pay-quarter-of-all-income-tax.html

Yeah you're right, sorry. Shows you how long it's been since I studied anything to do with economics.

 This is where that figure comes from;


http://www.ifs.org.uk/bns/bn09.pdf

Of a UK adult population of around 51 million, it is estimated that there
will be 29.9 million taxpayers in 2011–12. Around 3.7 million of these will
pay tax at the higher rate, providing 34.3% of total income tax revenue,
and 308,000 taxpayers will pay tax at the additional rate, providing 28.1%
of total income tax revenue.

That also states;

Although less than 14% of income taxpayers face higher rates of income
tax, that group pays a very large share of the total amount of income tax
that is paid. Table 15 shows that the top 10% of income taxpayers now pay
over half of all the income tax paid, and the top 1% (most of whom face the
additional 50% marginal tax rate) pay 28% of all that is paid. These shares
have risen substantially since 1978–79, despite reductions in the higher
rates.


Screw that then, if people in my bracket already contribute to 50% + of the income tax intake that's enough.

It does show though that only the rich can be taxed more to effectively get more money in.
For the rest it's easier to just cut spending.

[redsimon]

I think most views on   this are pretty entrenched, so "debate" has just become "I'm right" "no, I'm right" rather than a debate?

[smashedagain]

Lol at Hopkin being rich.

Do you not realise how much he spends following Boldie's tips?

lol. i have an idea how much he spends on alcohol
to most people earning £250 a week that £2.50 makes a massive difference because it means that they go over their overdraft facility by £2.49 sometime mid week and get a letter informing them of the £35 charge for doing so

[outragous76]

I think most views on   this are pretty entrenched, so "debate" has just become "I'm right" "no, I'm right" rather than a debate?

I half agree so I will reiterate 1 point from the OP (fair play to ace2m btw)

"I am yet to hear a SINGLE argument which has convinced me that this is a worthwhile and justified action."

[redsimon]

Lol at Hopkin being rich.

Do you not realise how much he spends following Boldie's tips?

The shrewd among us just lay those tips and coin it

[boldie]

My question would be where do you draw the line then? You could tax me an extra 5% or maybe they were going to make it 48% previously but then they have already added an extra 2%

Would someone earning £250 a week really notice £2.50 less a week?

We can't tax the crap out of you obviously. You are in the position to just naff off to another country and take your business with you. But a tiny squeeze here and there, as long as it doesn't affect your business (and this is the main thing..less Tax for business more for individuals means you can pay yourself more moneeeeeeeeeeeeeys), will have a decent impact and will allow the govt to squeeze spending harder.

TBH, the main problem I have with tax increases is that they are ussually hailed as temporary...and they never reverse them which is massively dissapointing.

[boldie]

Lol at Hopkin being rich.

Do you not realise how much he spends following Boldie's tips?

The shrewd among us just lay those tips and coin it

lolz, harsh but fair.

[Bongo]

It does show though that only the rich can be taxed more to effectively get more money in.

That was a point of mine earlier, increasing tax might not increase revenues and vice versa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve)

Or, to quote JFK:
"It is a paradoxical truth that tax rates are too high and tax revenues are too low and the soundest way to raise the revenues in the long run is to cut the rates now ... Cutting taxes now is not to incur a budget deficit, but to achieve the more prosperous, expanding economy which can bring a budget surplus."

Now I can't be sure that applies now but it seems, politically, discussion about whether or not we could increase revenues by cutting taxes is unpalatable.