Junk v min r

[RED-DOG]

During the mid-stages / last 3rd of tournaments, playing ~ 40 - 60 bigs, how do you deal with min raises on your bb when you have junk, (Which is most of the time) especially v serial offenders?

I do have a default strategy which I try to adapt to suit individual opponents, but would be interested to hear your views on defending against frequent min raisers.



 

[outragous76]

Very much villain dependant, and obv their stack size

If the Villain is a frequent opener I will 3 bet liberally

Things that will stop be 3 betting any 2:

1. If they have a perfect 4 bet stack
2. If I think they are remotely capable of 4 betting light
3. If we are a big stack and the bubble period is coming shortly
4. if I think that their 4 bet will tilt me into a 5 bet jam (this is very me specific)

With big stacks this is very much a game flow decission

[SuuPRlim]

(for the purpose of this post im assuming junk = no hand at all)
Just fold. regardless of what anyone says this is not a spot where you are being exploited by folding bad hands, deciding that because someone is opening a lot and 3betting them with J6o is a bad play and just ego driven imo.

There is a reason why people open a wide range mid-late position, it's because if you're a good player you only defend strong hands from the blinds (so you'll fold more) and if you're a bad player you'll defend too many hands (so you'll b playing bad hands OOP position and psunking money off) which do you wanna be?

I would however look to start 3betting if someone is persistently min'ing into my blinds (not for ego reason's but because it is a good spot to get a 3bet through if you've been folding a lot) I''d never pick any 2 cards though, I'd look for a hand that flops well vs a wide range, but I think is JUST A BIT TOO WEAK too call with,    would be ideal for me.

Make sure the adaptation you make IS NOT to start calling wider vs a good player 60bb's min deep as you'll find this will put you in horrible horrible spots.

but if hes raised your blinf the last 20 times in a row and you look down on time#21 at then JUST FOLD - WE DIDNT COME TO PLAY BAD HANDS OUT OF POSITION, WE CAME TO WIN

[rfgqqabc]

(for the purpose of this post im assuming junk = no hand at all)
Just fold. regardless of what anyone says this is not a spot where you are being exploited by folding bad hands, deciding that because someone is opening a lot and 3betting them with J6o is a bad play and just ego driven imo.

There is a reason why people open a wide range mid-late position, it's because if you're a good player you only defend strong hands from the blinds (so you'll fold more) and if you're a bad player you'll defend too many hands (so you'll b playing bad hands OOP position and psunking money off) which do you wanna be?

I would however look to start 3betting if someone is persistently min'ing into my blinds (not for ego reason's but because it is a good spot to get a 3bet through if you've been folding a lot) I''d never pick any 2 cards though, I'd look for a hand that flops well vs a wide range, but I think is JUST A BIT TOO WEAK too call with,    would be ideal for me.

Make sure the adaptation you make IS NOT to start calling wider vs a good player 60bb's min deep as you'll find this will put you in horrible horrible spots.

but if hes raised your blinf the last 20 times in a row and you look down on time#21 at then JUST FOLD - WE DIDNT COME TO PLAY BAD HANDS OUT OF POSITION, WE CAME TO WIN

was going to highlight the best bits, but its all perfect

[RED-DOG]

(for the purpose of this post im assuming junk = no hand at all)
Just fold. regardless of what anyone says this is not a spot where you are being exploited by folding bad hands, deciding that because someone is opening a lot and 3betting them with J6o is a bad play and just ego driven imo.

There is a reason why people open a wide range mid-late position, it's because if you're a good player you only defend strong hands from the blinds (so you'll fold more) and if you're a bad player you'll defend too many hands (so you'll b playing bad hands OOP position and psunking money off) which do you wanna be?

I would however look to start 3betting if someone is persistently min'ing into my blinds (not for ego reason's but because it is a good spot to get a 3bet through if you've been folding a lot) I''d never pick any 2 cards though, I'd look for a hand that flops well vs a wide range, but I think is JUST A BIT TOO WEAK too call with,    would be ideal for me.

Make sure the adaptation you make IS NOT to start calling wider vs a good player 60bb's min deep as you'll find this will put you in horrible horrible spots.

but if hes raised your blinf the last 20 times in a row and you look down on time#21 at then JUST FOLD - WE DIDNT COME TO PLAY BAD HANDS OUT OF POSITION, WE CAME TO WIN

I love this reply.

I think it's because I wanted someone to give me permission to keep folding the crap.

[cambridgealex]

Yup Dave covered it all.

I think the 84hh in the MC was a fold as well Tom with your stack size, I'd really like a jam actually with yr image and stack size - so much dead money and they'll respect your push.

[outragous76]

The reason Tom should consider introducing a wider 3 bet range this deep  (lets perhaps call it a 3b/fold range) is to ensure he gets paid when he has a hand.

It doesnt matter if periodcially he loses 6bbs, providing that is balanced with picking up 40bbs from time to time against either a spazz range or an AJ/<55 type holding.

Therefore assuming we are just talking about playing from the bb dynamic against 1 villain, this is going to have to include some degree of junk holdings. The important part is that if he gets called and is OOP  that he remembers that it was a bluff and not to lose em all (like getting married to a flopped pair)

Daves advice is solid Tom but dont be the guy who never gets paid

[doubleup]

Daves advice is solid Tom but dont be the guy who never gets paid

In my experience this isn't true.  Complete spazz monkeys "get paid" because 80% of the time they are 3/4 betting with garbage.  Any player percieved as competent will be respected to the extent that although his range will contain weak hands, there won't be enough of them for an opponent to stack off lightly. 

[outragous76]

Daves advice is solid Tom but dont be the guy who never gets paid

In my experience this isn't true.  Complete spazz monkeys "get paid" because 80% of the time they are 3/4 betting with garbage.  Any player percieved as competent will be respected to the extent that although his range will contain weak hands, there won't be enough of them for an opponent to stack off lightly. 

We play different games then

[muckthenuts]

With 40-60bb there's no need to get fancy and force an issue with marginal hands oop. Dave makes a good point about 3betting more with hands that contain a blocker or play well enough postflop without being quite good enough to flat if you want to send out a message. But overall i wouldn't worry about people taking advantage too much and simply preserve your stack to open up your game in other positions.

Anything over 40bb's is a comfortable stack size. You can resteal with the intention of folding, you can raise pre, get 3-bet, and 4-bet hoping to cause a fold, you can flat call in position, and you can open your full range. Don't punt it