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[zerofive]

PokerStars Hand #80018974572: Tournament #2012050021, $25+$2 USD Hold'em No Limit - Level III (40/80) - 2012/05/06 20:13:10 WET [2012/05/06 15:13:10 ET]
Table '2012050021 2232' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: For2nArtem (18214 in chips)
Seat 2: Sent1mental (9810 in chips)
Seat 3: Deus 2011 (8755 in chips)
Seat 4: Live is Best (16305 in chips)
Seat 5: podhhe (9278 in chips)
Seat 6: demographix (11345 in chips)
Seat 7: Kruemmel111 (8942 in chips)
Seat 8: Praktikant09 (9270 in chips)
Seat 9: AntoniONik87 (10265 in chips)
For2nArtem: posts small blind 40
Sent1mental: posts big blind 80
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to demographix [ ]
Deus 2011: folds
Live is Best: folds
podhhe: folds
demographix: raises 95 to 175
Kruemmel111: calls 175
Praktikant09: folds
AntoniONik87: calls 175
For2nArtem: folds
Sent1mental: calls 95
*** FLOP *** [ ]
Sent1mental: checks
demographix: bets 480
Kruemmel111: calls 480
AntoniONik87: folds
Sent1mental: folds
*** TURN *** [ ] []
demographix: bets 886
Kruemmel111: calls 886
*** RIVER *** [ ] []
demographix: checks
Kruemmel111: checks

Basically no info on villain, checkfolding river. Fine?

[pleno1]

yes. slightly bigger on the turn maybe. maybe a little bigger pre

[MC]

looks good to me

[Rupert]

Raise way more pre.  Check the flop.  As played check the turn.  You played the river well.

[pleno1]

why check turn, i agree with pre and think flop is reasonable, but as played I think turn is a bet/fold.

[cambridgealex]

190 pre, check flop, as played bet turn bigger 920, check river is fine/standard.

[WotRTheChances]

190 pre, check flop, as played bet turn bigger 920, check river is fine/standard.

Played fine imo, pre is fine, can check flop, but this line is fine too.

[Rupert]

pre is def terrible ur 120bb deep with a bunch of fish

[cambridgealex]

pre is def terrible ur 120bb deep with a bunch of fish

3x here Rupert?

[SuuPRlim]

yh i just dont get these tiny pre-flop raises in tournaments when you're super deep pre-antes.

[Skippy]

Here's something I don't understand. Why do/should we raise smaller when there are antes? There is more money in the pot pre after all. Can anyone explain.

Personally I 3x it when I have more than 30bb, and 2.5x when I have 30bb or fewer (down to about 14bb, when I am open shoving, depending on how big the antes are relative to the big blind). All the cool people min-raise nowadays though, and I feel as old as Tikay. Anybody fancy giving me some explanation?

[cambridgealex]

Here's something I don't understand. Why do/should we raise smaller when there are antes? There is more money in the pot pre after all. Can anyone explain.

Personally I 3x it when I have more than 30bb, and 2.5x when I have 30bb or fewer (down to about 14bb, when I am open shoving, depending on how big the antes are relative to the big blind). All the cool people min-raise nowadays though, and I feel as old as Tikay. Anybody fancy giving me some explanation?

Whilst far from being the best person to answer this, I'll have a go.

One reason people minraise because it gives them a better price on a steal. Risking 2bbs to win 2.5bbs (blinds+antes), it doesn't need to work as often as risking 3 to win 2.5.

So they have to minraise with they monsters for balance of course.

You risk less of your stack each time, so when you only have 30bigs, it's quite a significant difference losing 2bb compared to 3.

It also achieves more or less the same result, so there just isn't any point in the extra bb, it's just a waste.

The deeper you are, the bigger you should open pre, and when the antes kick in, you're shallower than preantes so that's why ppl minraise more post antes than pre antes.

Hope that helps.

[Pugwashed]

Here's something I don't understand. Why do/should we raise smaller when there are antes? There is more money in the pot pre after all. Can anyone explain.

Personally I 3x it when I have more than 30bb, and 2.5x when I have 30bb or fewer (down to about 14bb, when I am open shoving, depending on how big the antes are relative to the big blind). All the cool people min-raise nowadays though, and I feel as old as Tikay. Anybody fancy giving me some explanation?

Whilst far from being the best person to answer this, I'll have a go.

One reason people minraise because it gives them a better price on a steal. Risking 2bbs to win 2.5bbs (blinds+antes), it doesn't need to work as often as risking 3 to win 2.5.

So they have to minraise with they monsters for balance of course.

You risk less of your stack each time, so when you only have 30bigs, it's quite a significant difference losing 2bb compared to 3.

It also achieves more or less the same result, so there just isn't any point in the extra bb, it's just a waste.

The deeper you are, the bigger you should open pre, and when the antes kick in, you're shallower than preantes so that's why ppl minraise more post antes than pre antes.

Hope that helps.

Also worth mentioning that generally, the smaller you're opening the wider you can be opening without making yourself exploitable

[LonOhRay]

Here's something I don't understand. Why do/should we raise smaller when there are antes? There is more money in the pot pre after all. Can anyone explain.

Personally I 3x it when I have more than 30bb, and 2.5x when I have 30bb or fewer (down to about 14bb, when I am open shoving, depending on how big the antes are relative to the big blind). All the cool people min-raise nowadays though, and I feel as old as Tikay. Anybody fancy giving me some explanation?

Pre antes, such as this hand average stacks are going to be huge - 100bb.

When we have 100bb at t30 t50 t80 whatever and that is the average stack our opens will be weighted to value hands, there is simply no value to adding 120 chips to a 10k stack as a steal pre whilst inflating your vpip and pfr.

When antes and blinds are bigger and average stacks are a lot smaller it is far more profitable to add 2.5bbs to a 30bb stack via stealing the blinds. - We open our range up a lot in later stages of the tournament as these blinds and antes are a lot more valuable.

As Alex said, we want to risk the minimum with our (assumed) weaker range to get steals through so opening min is the cheapest way we can do this and has been "standard" for a good while now.

Generally need ~43% of a success rate to break even on a min open as a steal pre with normal sized antes.

It is a very basic concept and I laugh when I see regs opening to 100/125 UTG first level of the million for example.



As played river is a check fold

[pleno1]

Here's something I don't understand. Why do/should we raise smaller when there are antes? There is more money in the pot pre after all. Can anyone explain.

Personally I 3x it when I have more than 30bb, and 2.5x when I have 30bb or fewer (down to about 14bb, when I am open shoving, depending on how big the antes are relative to the big blind). All the cool people min-raise nowadays though, and I feel as old as Tikay. Anybody fancy giving me some explanation?

Whilst far from being the best person to answer this, I'll have a go.

One reason people minraise because it gives them a better price on a steal. Risking 2bbs to win 2.5bbs (blinds+antes), it doesn't need to work as often as risking 3 to win 2.5.

So they have to minraise with they monsters for balance of course.

You risk less of your stack each time, so when you only have 30bigs, it's quite a significant difference losing 2bb compared to 3.

It also achieves more or less the same result, so there just isn't any point in the extra bb, it's just a waste.

The deeper you are, the bigger you should open pre, and when the antes kick in, you're shallower than preantes so that's why ppl minraise more post antes than pre antes.

Hope that helps.

I know a Rastafarian gentleman who would be inclined to disagree with you there whiiiteeee boyyyy