We hit the nuts!

[BorntoBubble]

Evening.

Been pondering this for a while now about hitting big draws and then how to extract max value. Since coming back to Sheffield its back to cash tables where its normal to see 6 to the flop with lots of BB's in the middle rather than the 3/4/5/6/7/8/9 bet nonsense in Nottingham. Which means i am getting in more spots where we have like bare nut flush draw on the flop and instead of taking off we can just call lots as its often going to be 3/4 to the turn.

So this is a hand from last night which kinda shows the plot....

1/2 Table i am SB with Kh4h

Early position Limp Mid position Limp Button makes it 7. We flat BB flats and two limpers flat.

5 way to the flop Pot =£28.

  .

Everyone checks to button who makes it £12, I flat Mid position calls everyone else folds.

Turn Pot = £64

 

Everyone checks.

River  

Now what?

I have about £220 back and both players cover.

Both players have not been seen to "Blow up" "Go Mental" etc. Which is the case in most of these games in Sheffield, people prefer to call rather than bluff it seems.

(Exact details of the hand may not be 100% correct but its close enough)

[pleno1]

Huh? Fold pre?

[SuuPRlim]

agree pre-flop seems a little spewy, you should prolly fold or 3bet...

HOWEVER we;ve called and made the nuts which is lovely.

OK so the BTN has no real hand, or if he does it's a very strange one as he elected not to bet the turn, seems unlikely he has a unless it's Q9 Q8 98 98 97 I think any flush hand with the or the would bet the turn again IP for sure, and I dont think he'd nessercarily ISO the BTN with 46suited or such hands. If he had Ax or two pair or a set he'd 100% bet the turn, so most likely he has a hand like 88 or 99 or KJ and he has given up interest in this pot. The next guy (MP) can have a flush, we assume he'd raise AT/A6/66 OTF and doesn't have TT or AA so his range is pretty weak as well, he prolly wouldnt limp AJ pf either so likely doesnt have that but he might have turned JT and he doesn't have JJ or 22, but turned JT or rivered A2 is really the best of his non flush hands - HOWEVER he CAN defo have a flush as well, as limping 45s 56s 46s 57s even bigger 78s and 89s connectors is not un-common, or hands like J8s Q9s and so forth that he will certainly play this way postflop.

So, I think a smaller bet is the way to go here, say £25, that way the MP will almost certainly have to raise his flushes (and we can then go all-in and prolly stack him) and you might get a crying call form some weaker showdown stuff from the BTN, or from a ropey ACE from MP. The only thing a smaller bet doens't punish is the JT and A2 hands from the MP player.

I think betting big is just plain gambling MP has a flush and his range is a lot wider than that.

[NoCardDSC]

Also agree with folding pre, this just seems bad as your hand does not flop well whatsoever. Having said that, you have flopped nuts.

So, where to go from here, I'm betting small as I really don't think these guys seem like they will bet 2nd pair etc but are more inclined to calling. Also, if it does so happen they have a flush, you have a better chance getting it in than if you were to check.

[theprawnidentity]

Agree with fold pre.

£25-30 now and hope you get a bro coming at ya.

[rfgqqabc]

£177, I think we get paid by all flushes, maybe even get some heroes too. We get a pretty crazy image when it folds round too. If anyone says something, we just say how else can i get you to fold.

Fold pre aniec. Bad hand, bad position etc.

[BorntoBubble]

Cheers guys.

I agree fold pre but im a fish and i was going in 3 hands or so so was in play every hand mode! - Obviously not a leak!

I made it £25 on the river. The button clicked it to 55 so i jammed like £180 and he tanked and called with the Qhigh flush. So i think Adam's 177 would have got a call from the button anyway!

[cambridgealex]

I call pre here vs the right players. What's the problem?!

It's £6 more going 4 or 5 ways vs very wide ranges plenty of dominated hearts and implied odds of flush over flushing someone or just making a flush and getting paid by one pair imo outweigh the reverse implied odds (which im oi anyway as you know) of losing 1 or 2 bets on Kxx.

You can easily c/fold K95 to just one bet in some circumstances. I don't see the big deal with pre. Would 100% peel if we were IP. The thing is you're not very deep. I think you probably have to be £500 deep to peel here. But vs the right people (ie people going broke with one pair if you make a flush or two pair+) then why the hell not.

Plus, most importantly, you get to join in and be part of that hand and SEE A FLOP!

[aaron1867]

fold  pre in sheffield?

it's a fkin premium

who are in the hand?

[BorntoBubble]

fold  pre in sheffield?

it's a fkin premium

who are in the hand?

Button was a unknown player who was on buisness in sheffield BB was simon fairhurst and MP and EP were two young lads that i didn't know but were nothing to be feared high probability student loan money

[BorntoBubble]

I call pre here vs the right players. What's the problem?!

It's £6 more going 4 or 5 ways vs very wide ranges plenty of dominated hearts and implied odds of flush over flushing someone or just making a flush and getting paid by one pair imo outweigh the reverse implied odds (which im oi anyway as you know) of losing 1 or 2 bets on Kxx.

You can easily c/fold K95 to just one bet in some circumstances. I don't see the big deal with pre. Would 100% peel if we were IP. The thing is you're not very deep. I think you probably have to be £500 deep to peel here. But vs the right people (ie people going broke with one pair if you make a flush or two pair+) then why the hell not.

Plus, most importantly, you get to join in and be part of that hand and SEE A FLOP!

Seeing flops is fun especially when i have spent a year in Nottingham getting reeled into games where the players never let me see flops! and when they do they never let me get there for cheap. Wankers.

[Bully87]

I'm over betting, not sure on sizing. I like rfgqqabcs idea but not sure how often it'll work.

[SuuPRlim]

Plus, most importantly, you get to join in and be part of that hand and SEE A FLOP!

this is true, if you fold you dont get to be involved for like 2-5minutes. zzzzzzzzzzz

[BorntoBubble]

Plus, most importantly, you get to join in and be part of that hand and SEE A FLOP!

this is true, if you fold you dont get to be involved for like 2-5minutes. zzzzzzzzzzz

Live pokers problems

[muckthenuts]

Overbetting to get called by what though, how many combos do we expect them to have that checks turn but can call £177 on a deuce river? Flushes should raise £25 anyway as will 2pairs+ at least sometimes, and we get a call more often by weaker hands which should make up the majority of our opponents ranges