more than two hours a day?

[doubleup]

(so he has to earn circa £25-30k before tax just to pay for this before parking at station and tube from Euston to Harrow). 

I would guess expensive commutes are one of the reasons that personal service companies are popular.

[NoCardDSC]

I either work in central Milton Keynes (living in a surrounding town) which takes me ~25mins OR central London (Farringdon) which takes me ~90mins. If working in MK I am struck by heavy traffic which is just a huge annoyance and when in London a fairly nice easy commute.

So I would say once taking all factors into consideration; they are both as bad as each other and I don't mind which one I do.

[edgascoigne]

The school (fees) point is hugely significant.

Fees alone for two children (day school only) will run you £25k. By the time that is from taxed income, even if 40% payer then you're in for £43k gross earnings on fees.

Hence the catchment area merry go round goes completely ballistic.

I would disagree with an earlier point on thread though re: current government policy sustaining house prices - if you look at tax changes to non-does (now CGT-able) and the coming changes on mortgage interest offset (will hit buy to let investors hard) I genuinely feel there's been a realisation that a slight cooling of the market is desirable.

[aaron1867]

Those doing commutes; do you take the commute time in to account when working out your hourly rate?

If you're doing 1 hour a day commute + an 8 hour day would you consider a pay cut for a 5 minute commute and an 8 hour day?

Conversely would you consider a job for more money if it meant an even longer commute?

We have a guy at our place who does about 90 minutes each way from Cambridge to Nottingham. Don't know how he does it but apparently you just get used to it and it becomes the norm.

When I work in Manchester (I live in Sheffield), I always take in the commute and sometimes hotels costs. It's an hour each way and if I am not "around" Manchester, I would ask for inbetween £4-8ph.

I was in Madrid a few weeks ago, working in Madrid for a nightclub. First time in Europe & they couldn't grasp the travel and extra cost. I put into that an extra few hundred pound.

I don't think I could do a commute for long though unless I am on £30k+ year.

A relevant example for us all, is Raf White, a well known poker player. He is Sheffield's Genting deputy general manager. He does the commute from Manchester-Sheffield 5 days a week. I do believe he is on £50k+.

Although for some people surely an hour on the train to work there and back is potentially an hour working anyway?

[AlunB]

I lived in Twickenham and commuted to Farringdon for about 18 months.

Train was 35 mins, walk to station was about 5 mins. Rather than get the tube at the other end I would walk from Waterloo - took me about 25 mins. Whole thing was just over an hour. So two hours a day. Minimum. In reality when adding in waiting for trains either end and some delays was normally 2.30 - 3.00 hours a day.

Flats in Twickenham start at 500k. If you live any closer it's much more expensive and actually a worse commute as you have to stand the entire way.

About a year and a bit ago we moved to Cheshire. I commuted four days a week. 1hr 40 on the train. Probably 2.30h each way door to desk. I really enjoyed my job, but that commute was just a killer. Maybe if I was younger I could have coped but the total absence of any time to myself during the week really got to me.

I would say the Twickenham commute never really bothered me. Occasionally it was a pain, but for London I would say that's getting towards a typical commuting time for most.

[muckthenuts]

Personally:

50k a year for a 5 minute commute > 75k a year for 2 hours each way on the tube.

Or maybe im just too young to appreciate the increased salary at the moment, but right now it wouldnt be worth it to me.

[DungBeetle]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

[AlunB]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

Doesn't even come close to being worth it.

Should really be looked at as double time as it's massively detrimental to your personal life and mental wellbeing.

I'm not young and I couldn't agree with him more. In fact I'd change them to 30k and 50k and still agree.

[EvilPie]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

£15.40 after tax though because you're well and truly in to that 40% band.

Even as a single bloke with no kids my time is worth far more than that. If I was a family man it wouldn't get a second thought.

[arbboy]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

£15.40 after tax though because you're well and truly in to that 40% band.

Even as a single bloke with no kids my time is worth far more than that. If I was a family man it wouldn't get a second thought.

This.  Plus you have to deduct the cost of the 2 hour train/tube fare from the hourly after tax.  Pretty hard to be on a tube for 2 hours so a train fare would be included on top of the tube fare.  Pretty sure after that is deducted in most cases you will be earning nothing and/or paying to sit on the train/tube 4 hours a day as well as losing 20 hours of your week before/after work.

If i was still an accountant (prior moving to the betting industry) i often think i could commute door to door in 2 hours each way from where i live now to my old firms right outside Euston station (stafford to euston direct on virgin trains).  This would cost me £15k a year after tax to do for the season ticket.  I wouldn't do it if you paid me another £50k a year to what i earn now even if the train fare was included for free (which it isn't).  The thought of leaving home at 6am every morning and getting home at 8.30pm every night isn't worth it imo.  I would just rather be worse off and go without material things i don't really need.

[Marky147]

I used to drive home 2/3 times a week when I was based in Pompey, and that was alright for a bit.

Wouldn't fancy doing it every night of the week though, as getting up at 6am to drive back in the mornings was never much fun.

That's only Dorchester-Portsmouth, too. In the end, I sacked it off, and just came home weekends.

When I got moved to Chicksands, I didn't even bother with every weekend.

[AlunB]

Thing is though, with the cost of living rise in London and the increasing number of jobs that are in the capital compared to elsewhere it's not really an option for a lot of people. If you want to live in anything other than a tiny rented flat (or for some people just to afford that) you have to live a long long way out of town.

[vegaslover]

20-25 mins for me. 30-40 if traffic is bad, though I work shifts so not in bad traffic usually. Even that amount of time annoys me if traffic is bad. Fk doing a daily commute to London. Bad enough coming up for sporting events.

Not enough people really count the cost of travel time in terms of their wages imo

[DungBeetle]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

Doesn't even come close to being worth it.

Should really be looked at as double time as it's massively detrimental to your personal life and mental wellbeing.

I'm not young and I couldn't agree with him more. In fact I'd change them to 30k and 50k and still agree.

It's the same situation as would you take a job involving 4 hours extra work a day for £25k extra.  It's not double time - mentally shut down and read a book. 

Arb boy makes a good point though that you have to offset the extra (often outrageous) train fare.

[DungBeetle]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

£15.40 after tax though because you're well and truly in to that 40% band.

Even as a single bloke with no kids my time is worth far more than that. If I was a family man it wouldn't get a second thought.

Perhaps - but you're effectively saying it's not worth your time working for £28 per hour.  Given minimum wage is £7 or whatever it is, that's quite a statement.  Most people work for way less.