more than two hours a day?

[Woodsey]

Getting to be a regular occurance now, probably 3 days a week I do 4+ hours a day travelling, fucking knackering, not sure I can keep it up in the long run to be honest.

[AlunB]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

Doesn't even come close to being worth it.

Should really be looked at as double time as it's massively detrimental to your personal life and mental wellbeing.

I'm not young and I couldn't agree with him more. In fact I'd change them to 30k and 50k and still agree.

It's the same situation as would you take a job involving 4 hours extra work a day for £25k extra.  It's not double time - mentally shut down and read a book.  

Arb boy makes a good point though that you have to offset the extra (often outrageous) train fare.

I'm speaking from personal experience here. I'm telling you for a fact I would make that decision.

edit: Not saying that's the right decision for everyone obv.

[AlunB]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

£15.40 after tax though because you're well and truly in to that 40% band.

Even as a single bloke with no kids my time is worth far more than that. If I was a family man it wouldn't get a second thought.

Perhaps - but you're effectively saying it's not worth your time working for £28 per hour.  Given minimum wage is £7 or whatever it is, that's quite a statement.  Most people work for way less.

That works out at £58k a year based on a 40hr working week. So less than the hypothetical 75k a year job you're supposed to be commuting to

[DungBeetle]

Showed my calcs earlier.  If the 50k job and 75k are identical except for the commute of 4 hours each day, then I assumed a 45 weeks of work (might be a bit generous with the 6 weeks hols plus bank holidays so let's make it a 47 week working year).  So 47 x 4 x 5 hours is what we have to put in for our 25k.  So that's now £26.60 an hour.

[DungBeetle]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

Doesn't even come close to being worth it.

Should really be looked at as double time as it's massively detrimental to your personal life and mental wellbeing.

I'm not young and I couldn't agree with him more. In fact I'd change them to 30k and 50k and still agree.

It's the same situation as would you take a job involving 4 hours extra work a day for £25k extra.  It's not double time - mentally shut down and read a book.  

Arb boy makes a good point though that you have to offset the extra (often outrageous) train fare.

I'm speaking from personal experience here. I'm telling you for a fact I would make that decision.

edit: Not saying that's the right decision for everyone obv.

And that's fine.  You value your time at more than the £26/£28 an hour.  So do I.  But some (many?) people wouldn't.

Of course the extra cost of the train likely blows the argument away anyway.  Tax on the £26 per hour then pay an extra £3k per year for the travelling and it's not so appealing.  It's probably £1k net in your bank per month you are giving up for extra 4 hours per day. 

[EvilPie]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

£15.40 after tax though because you're well and truly in to that 40% band.

Even as a single bloke with no kids my time is worth far more than that. If I was a family man it wouldn't get a second thought.

Perhaps - but you're effectively saying it's not worth your time working for £28 per hour.  Given minimum wage is £7 or whatever it is, that's quite a statement.  Most people work for way less.

No I'm not. I'd happily work a 40 hour week for significantly less than £28/hr. I'd maybe go as low as £13 or so at a push as I could live on that.

Offer me twice as much per hour for twice as many hours though and I'd turn you down flat.

There's a balance somewhere and everybody has their own dependant on what they want or need.

[nirvana]

I've always had a notional limit in mind of about an hour each way as the max I'd ever do. I've never been one for working a massive excess of hours for perception's sake - not for 25 years or so anyway, so this means in most circs I can be home by around 6 and if I really want to do some more work I'd rather do a bit from home.

Having worked in and around London for the bulk of my working life an hour doesn't mean very far necessarily if travelling by car. Had a spell of driving 4 hrs a day for a short while (perhaps a year and a half) and it ruined me - plus had an RX8 (mid life crisis) and the farkin petrol bill was rather high :-)

Business recently moved to Elstree and living in 'emel it's 20 mins at the right time and around 40 with traffic. Closest i've ever lived to work other than 4 years working at home and it's hard to describe what a benefit it feels. There is literally, yep, literally, no amount of money that would make me exceed the 45 mins to an hour ever again as a regular daily thing.

[AlunB]

Showed my calcs earlier.  If the 50k job and 75k are identical except for the commute of 4 hours each day, then I assumed a 45 weeks of work (might be a bit generous with the 6 weeks hols plus bank holidays so let's make it a 47 week working year).  So 47 x 4 x 5 hours is what we have to put in for our 25k.  So that's now £26.60 an hour.

Got you. Missed that. Apologies.

[AlunB]

If it's 4 hours each day on tube for a 45 week working year that's 900 hours on the tube.  So you'd be turning down about £28 an hour before tax to sit on the tube (assuming working day is the same between the 2 jobs).

£15.40 after tax though because you're well and truly in to that 40% band.

Even as a single bloke with no kids my time is worth far more than that. If I was a family man it wouldn't get a second thought.

Perhaps - but you're effectively saying it's not worth your time working for £28 per hour.  Given minimum wage is £7 or whatever it is, that's quite a statement.  Most people work for way less.

No I'm not. I'd happily work a 40 hour week for significantly less than £28/hr. I'd maybe go as low as £13 or so at a push as I could live on that.

Offer me twice as much per hour for twice as many hours though and I'd turn you down flat.

There's a balance somewhere and everybody has their own dependant on what they want or need.

Very much this. Agree with almost every word.

[edgascoigne]

In running a calc on earnings ALONE vs. Commute time however you are ignoring the (admittedly less tangible) benefits working in such a job may deliver moving forward.

I completely get that people have a £x amount they are unhappy travelling for, but if you work in a set up where your earnings can increase considerably over time then turning down the commute day one can shift from being a rational, to an irrational, decision as you never realise the increased earnings.

On a similar note my old man explains very well the true 'cost' of playing poker in one's younger years. Naturally it can still be the right decision for some, but we both feel the variable people incorrectly calculate is not earnings now (let's say a poker pro can make £50k pa with minimal expenses Vs £25k pa with commute/time constraints etc, "it's a no brainier".) but rather over time as one fights to increase earnings in a shrinking, increasingly competitive marketplace Vs. being on a career 'track' that has natural increases over time.

[nirvana]

In running a calc on earnings ALONE vs. Commute time however you are ignoring the (admittedly less tangible) benefits working in such a job may deliver moving forward.

This is an understandable point at your age, at mine it's less relevant  - it's genuinely hard for me to conceive how an extra amount of money either in a lump sum or on a continuing basis would make me feel more content/happy etc

[bobAlike]

Currently travel to Derby (51 miles) 2 days/week and Hucknall (70 miles) 2 days/week, Derby takes 1hr 20 on a good day. Hucknall 1hr 45.
Previous;
2 years Rotherham 4 days/week (91 miles) 2hrs on a good day 3 million hrs on a bad one.
1 1/2 years Bristol 4 days/week (85 miles) 1hr 30 average

I usually aim to be on site 8am and finish whenever I can.

Luckily I charge 45p/mile for 10k miles and 25 p/mile the rest + I charge per hour as soon as I leave my front door and return

[arbboy]

Getting to be a regular occurance now, probably 3 days a week I do 4+ hours a day travelling, fucking knackering, not sure I can keep it up in the long run to be honest.

I got a couple of mates who do 25 hours a week travelling but that is part of their travelling salesman jobs.  Assume your travelling is the same (ie built into your 40 hour week).  You don't do 8 hours a day plus an hour for lunch with 4 hours travelling on top of that 4 days a week surely woodsey?  You seem to be on holiday on the other side of the globe half the year to me!!!! 

[Woodsey]

Getting to be a regular occurance now, probably 3 days a week I do 4+ hours a day travelling, fucking knackering, not sure I can keep it up in the long run to be honest.

I got a couple of mates who do 25 hours a week travelling but that is part of their travelling salesman jobs.  Assume your travelling is the same (ie built into your 40 hour week).  You don't do 8 hours a day plus an hour for lunch with 4 hours travelling on top of that 4 days a week surely woodsey?  You seem to be on holiday on the other side of the globe half the year to me!!!!  

I'm up the greasy pole these days, as a sales person I rarely got near 40 hours a week including travelling lol. I'm now a national sales manager for a sales team across the UK and am probably out with the guys 2-3 days a week plus other meetings I have to travel to. Only been doing it about a year, resisted it till now but finally thought I'd step up. Dont mind admitting I'm finding it really hard, the travellling is really hard even though I'm used to travelling and use the train a fair bit. The jury is out at the moment about this newish job with all the extra travelling, but I'm currently leaning towards its not worth the extra money. Maybe if I can do it for 5-10 years to get some extra money in the pension then step back down, dunno we'll see. I'm a sales guy at heart and love the day to day interation with customers and hearing about the difference some of our medicines make to peoples lives and the challenge of getting docs bought into new ones, I lose some of that in my current job.

[Marky147]

Getting to be a regular occurance now, probably 3 days a week I do 4+ hours a day travelling, fucking knackering, not sure I can keep it up in the long run to be honest.

I got a couple of mates who do 25 hours a week travelling but that is part of their travelling salesman jobs.  Assume your travelling is the same (ie built into your 40 hour week).  You don't do 8 hours a day plus an hour for lunch with 4 hours travelling on top of that 4 days a week surely woodsey?  You seem to be on holiday on the other side of the globe half the year to me!!!! 

I'm up the greasy pole these days, as a sales person I rarely got near 40 hours a week including travelling lol. I'm now a national sales manager for a sales team across the UK and am probably out with the guys 2-3 days a week plus other meetings I have to travel to. Only been doing it about a year, resisted it till now but finally thought I'd step up. Dont mind admitting I'm finding it really hard, the travellling is really hard even though I'm used to travelling and use the train a fair bit. The jury is out at the moment, but I'm currently leaning towards its not worth the extra money. Maybe if I can do it for 5-10 years to get some extra money in the pension then step back down, dunno we'll see. I'm a sales guy at heart and love the day to day interation with customers and hearing about the difference some of our medicines make to peoples lives and the challenge of getting docs bought into new ones.

My neuro has had a mare trying to sort me out, so pop us some Sativex in the post if you could please, Woodsey