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ruud
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« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2017, 12:38:23 PM »

Have started writing a long piece about the squad in my view - will post later.

In the meantime, you need to leave 2 of those at home Rich. Gatland pretty clear on the fact he is taking 37 players.....

Who gets the chop?!
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« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2017, 12:51:35 PM »

Have started writing a long piece about the squad in my view - will post later.

In the meantime, you need to leave 2 of those at home Rich. Gatland pretty clear on the fact he is taking 37 players.....

Who gets the chop?!

the fourth winger, so Watson maybe (Liam williams covers wing and 3rd full back)

maybe the sixth prop, Fargerson

its not easy to keep it to 37. leaving a lot of good players behind

the following don't make my squad

Rob Evans
Healy
Hartley
Henderson
Kruis
Lawes
Haskell
Robshaw
Watson
Barclay
Heaslip
Biggar
Ford
Scott Williams
Ringrose
Kearney

suppose thats good as typically 8-10 are lost to injury, so the standby list is always fully used
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« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2017, 09:57:26 AM »

Rugby Union Weekly has picked a whole Lions squad. Get the podcast here: http://bbc.in/2nE2FUg

 Click to see full-size image.
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« Reply #18 on: April 03, 2017, 01:24:01 PM »



Lions 2017

So the final meaningful round of games has passed in terms of Lions selection and it’s time to finally consider a squad of 37 to attempt to live with the might of the All Blacks. Here’s my choice of men for Warren Gatland to consider worthy of the highest honour rugby can bestow. It will be done in two parts, forwards first and then the backs.

Loosehead Prop
Jack McGrath has been immense for Ireland and Leinster all season and travels as first choice. Mako Vunipola offers drive and dynamism in the loose and is a natural second option. The third decision is more difficult. If he’d been fit enough to play international rugby this spring, Gethin Jenkins would have a great option due to his experience, ability to play both sides, and leadership qualities. Rob Evans has done a fine job deputising in the Six Nations and has added some great work in the loose in to his game. Joe Marler is solid in the scrum but is less of an impact off the bench and this needs to be considered here. Cian Healy has re-invented himself as a fine impact prop who is combative, strong in the scrum and experienced in the heat of battle. He grabs the third spot on the plane for me.

Hooker
A position that can be looked at two ways - either a position of weakness due to no true stand-out candidate, or a position of strength due to the wide variety of options available. Rory Best, captain of Ireland in their famous sweeping aside of the All Blacks in Chicago in the Autumn, has to tour. He was brilliant against England in Dublin and seems to rise to the biggest of occasions. Ken Owens was perhaps the finest hooker in the Six Nations and has played himself onto the plane, though Richard Hibbard is extremely unlucky as he still looks like the best Welsh hooker available. However, his exile from the national fold means he hasn’t been tested at this level for too long. He would certainly be my first option if injury befalls any of the chosen hookers. The third spot is a shootout between the two English hookers, and Jamie George edges Dylan Hartley due to his superior set piece and potential impact from the bench.

Tighthead Prop
Tadhg Furlong and Dan Cole have been inked in for this position for over 6 months and nothing has changed in the intervening period to change things. The third spot is more tricky. Had he been fit, WP Nel would mean taking three immensely strong tight heads to upset the New Zealand scrum was a real option. As it is, no other starting number 3 has shone enough to merit real inclusion. The amount of penalties conceded by Tomas Francis has counted against him, while Zander Fagerson looks a little short of the quality required. A left-field choice could be John Ryan of Munster who has improved immensely this season, but the potential impact offered by Kyle Sinckler from the bench, and the point of difference his ball-carrying skills offer puts him on the plane with a chance to make a real impression. Don’t be surprised if he has the number 18 shirt come the test series.

2nd Row
An incredibly competitive position where some people are going to be very unfortunate to be staying at home. Maro Itoje and Joe Launchbury have played themselves into the touring party, and potentially the test team, through their ball carrying and defensive work all season long, and are absolute definite choices for me. Alun Wyn Jones may have had his leadership questioned on a couple of occasions but it is imperative to take players who know what this tours entail, how to prepare on them and what is required in terms of supporting the whole squad. He has been there and done it all in this respect and deserves his spot on the plane again. Devin Toner and Iain Henderson are right on the cusp of touring and in any other year they, along with Richie Gray and Courtney Lawes, would be shoe-ins. However, the form of the younger Gray brother, Johnny gets him  on the plane just in front. Finally, winning in New Zealand requires dictating the set-piece and there is no better exponent of the line-out than George Kruis. If fit, he will offer a combination physicality and cuteness in the air which could have the All Blacks scratching  their heads and having to think on their feet.

Back Row
7 from the 15 or so potential options was always going to be difficult. Sam Warburton has had a 6 Nations up there with his best ever and could find himself starting the Test Series back in his favoured number 7 shirt. Billy Vunipola can compete with Kieran Read as a truly world-class number 8 and simply must travel. C J Stander may play at 6 for Ireland, but his ability to cover 8 means that both Jamie Heaslip and Ross Moriarty stay at home. Taulupe Faletau will be staying them due to not being the player he can be over the past 12 months. Justin Tipuric is exciting in the loose, a fine ball player and a clever line-out option who edges Hamish Watson on experience too. In a better club side, Watson will be an excellent prospect in 4 year’s time. After recent weeks, to ignore Peter O’Mahony would seem madness at this moment in time. He offers very similar qualities to Tipuric whilst wearing 6 on his back, but has that added menace to his game which could certainly upset the All Blacks when they try to play the expansive style they are so used to. Further to this, taking a 6 who will do all the dirty work that goes unnoticed while tackling himself to a standstill will be vital. Chris Robshaw does this in spades and would bring great leadership to the midweek team if he misses out on test selection. And so to the final forward spot. Sean O’Brien covers the entire back row and on his day is a fine harrier who links play at the same time as smashing anything in sight. His form has been patchy this season though, and there have been days where he perhaps played himself out of the tour. In a similar vein, James Haskell has his good days and bad. His potential qualities as a tourist, coupled with his ability to impact games from the bench makes him a very close, but potentially very vital, selection.

Please feel free to offer comments and opinions before I post my backs in a couple of day's time....

In summary:

McGrath
M Vunipola
Healy
Best
Owens
George
Furlong
Cole
Sinckler
Itoje
Launchbury
A-W Jones
J Gray
Kruis
Warburton
B Vunipola
Stander
Tipuric
O'Mahony
Robshaw
Haskell
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« Reply #19 on: April 03, 2017, 01:40:14 PM »

You've only picked one number 8

surely one of faletau (one of his favourites), heaslip or moriarty has to go as billy's back up?
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« Reply #20 on: April 03, 2017, 01:49:37 PM »

You've only picked one number 8

surely one of faletau (one of his favourites), heaslip or moriarty has to go as billy's back up?

Stander plays 8 week in week out for Munster.

Haskell or Warburton would be fine there too I think tbh. Heaslip for Haskell perhaps......
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« Reply #21 on: April 03, 2017, 01:57:46 PM »

You've only picked one number 8

surely one of faletau (one of his favourites), heaslip or moriarty has to go as billy's back up?

Stander plays 8 week in week out for Munster.

Haskell or Warburton would be fine there too I think tbh. Heaslip for Haskell perhaps......

stander's in my test team at 6. wouldn't have him in the midweek team at 8

i would have an 8 for haskell (or robshaw) yes
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« Reply #22 on: April 03, 2017, 06:44:33 PM »

Nice write up. I'd be shocked if Robshaw or Haskell are close to selection. Both are average backrowers, made to look better by a sensational 8 and magnificent second row.
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« Reply #23 on: April 05, 2017, 01:15:18 PM »

And the backs....

Scrum-Half
Grieg Laidlaw has been unfortunate to be injured at a vital point in the season. Certainly, his leadership would be valuable, but he isn’t quite the quality of the other options available. Conor Murray is perhaps the finest number 9 in world rugby and will be a strong favourite to start the Test Series. His excellent kicking game will be crucial in the territorial battle. Rhys Webb continues to be an imaginative attacking threat, especially in broken field, and his form alone warrants selection. Again, there is an English shootout for the third spot. Danny Care is more similar to Webb, sniping around the fringes and always on the lookout for a gap. There are unlikely to be such spaces to exploit against the All Blacks though, and so the extra control, experience and leadership offered by Ben Youngs gets him on the plane instead.

Fly-Half
Jonny Sexton will start the Test Series at 10. He is a battle-hardened warrior who gets hit time and time again and still keeps his sides moving in the right direction. His goal kicking has also improved over the past 4 years and he would be a fine option if required in this regard. Owen Farrell has matured as a playmaker in the past 12 months to the extent that he could start at either 10 or 12 and be the most influential player on the pitch. His composure under pressure as a goal kicker is second to none and he will likely be the kicker come the 1st Test, though with 12 on his back. With Sexton and Farrell both in the Test side, a third fly half is imperative. George Ford has been influential in a winning England team, but importantly, he has had the comfort of a playmaking 12 next to him. He won’t have this in New Zealand, and therefore finds himself heading to Argentina with England instead. It’s a close call between Dan Biggar and Finn Russell, but Russell’s attacking intent and ability to stand out even in defeat earns him the chance to make a real name for himself this summer.

Centre
Robbie Henshaw has been the form centre of the past 12 months and could play at either 12 or 13 at Test level. He can truck it up if required but also has subtlety and a clever kicking game which can unlock high quality defences. His club and country partner, Garry Ringrose, has been a revelation and could be a real bolter for the Test side at 13. His selection ahead of Jonathan Joseph may raise eyebrows, but Jospeh’s best recent performances have come against wide-open Italy and Scotland defences which certainly won’t be replicated in New Zealand. Scott Williams didn’t have the 6 Nations he needed to be considered and Alex Dunbar unfortunately looks slightly one-dimensional to tour. There’s nothing wrong with an inside-centre who is physical and runs straight lines to makes space for others, but if taking one of those, why not a man who has toured successfully before? A man who understands what it takes to be a Lion, who could lead a midweek team by example and be a sounding-board for younger players on tour. Jamie Roberts offers all of this and more, and is worthy of a place on tour with so many options in midfield. Jonathan Davies had a great tour 4 years ago but has had a poor 6 Nations. The flexibility offered by Elliot Daly, and his ability to play in so many different roles couple with his wand of a left boot, makes him a natural choice to tour, and another real option for the 13 shirt come the Test Series.

Wing
George North needs no introduction. If his form gets anywhere near his best, and he comes alive as he did 4 years ago, he will start the Test Series on one wing. The other side will be more challenging. Anthony Watson is a fine athlete, quicker than any other potential tourist, and has the ability and qualities to play at full-back if required. Jack Nowell offers a different dimension to all other wingers. He bounces off tackles like they aren’t there, works incredibly selflessly for the team, and is rock-solid in defence. His potential impact on games late on makes him a genuine candidate for the 23 shirt in the Test Series. The final spot is very tricky indeed. Denny Solomona, with another 6 months in the sport, could be a brilliantly maverick choice. Tim Visser and Christian Wade are both incredibly good finishers, but neither has ever consistently delivered at international level. Sean Maitland is strong and tireless, much like Nowell, but does not have the finisher’s instinct of others. Chris Ashton is close, very close. He seeks out work, he is an incredible finisher, his defence is actually better than people give him credit for. But he is shaky under the high ball. Ben Smith will be testing the Lions back three all series and therefore it is imperative for the wingers to be strong in this area. It is a long time since a winger has come out of Scotland's good in the air as Tommy Seymour. Not only does he tour, he may well start the Test Series.

Full-Back
Nowell, Watson and Daly at a push, can play at full-back, so only 2 will travel. Mike Brown has lost form and perhaps confidence recently, and Rob Kearney comes with his own injury worries. They will have to wait by the phone in case of a raft of casualties. Stuart Hogg was again a standout player in the 6 Nations, exhilarating in attack and brave from as deep as his own line. His defence will need work if he is to start the Tests but he tours nonetheless. Leigh Halfpenny was superb 4 years ago, but he has only shown patches of that form in the past 2 years and his goal kicking is now less of requirement with the improvement shown by both Farrell and Sexton. Instead, his countryman, Liam Williams must travel in his favoured 15 shirt. His rangy running style, fierce defence and eye for the try-line means he must be considered a real front-runner for the Test spot.

So that’s my backs done, please feel free to comment and let me know your thoughts….

In summary:
Murray
Webb
Youngs
Sexton
Farrell
Russell
Henshaw
Ringrose
Roberts
Daly
North
Watson
Nowell
Seymour
Hogg
Williams


To finish, a potential Test 23:
1. McGrath
2. Best
3. Furlong
4. Itoje
5. Jones (c)
6. Stander
7. Warburton
8. B Vunipola
9. Murray
10. Sexton
11. North
12. Farrell
13. Henshaw
14. Seymour
15. Williams

16. George
17. M Vunipola
18. Sinckler
19. Kruis
20. O’Mahony
21. Webb
22. Daly
23. Nowell

And a Midweek Massive:
1. Healy
2. Owens
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. J Gray
6. Robshaw
7. Tipuric
8. Haskell
9. Youngs
10. Russell
11. Daly/Nowell
12. Roberts
13. Ringrose
14. Watson
15. Hogg
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« Reply #24 on: April 05, 2017, 01:46:44 PM »

The only bone of contention i have is jamie roberts in and jospeh out

with farrell like at inside centre for the tests and henshaw the obvious choice if he has to mov inside, roberts is a luxury pick. i don't see farrell playing inside and henshaw playing outside, got to have more pace than that to help free a potent looking back 3

joseph is a potential match winner and has to go and will go

jonathan davies would get picked ahead of roberts too...matchwinners at outside centre more needed than another battering ram


i think he might be sorely tempted to pick Chris Ashton too

and i couldn't have best as test hooker

oh and the whispers are that warburton is captain again

apart from all that, good job!
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« Reply #25 on: April 18, 2017, 09:32:55 AM »

squad tomorrow and there are leaks

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/rugby-union/2017/04/17/jonathan-joseph-george-ford-chris-robshaw-among-englands-six/

no launchbury? i would be stunned

no joseph? surprised. ben te'o ahead of Joseph? stunned again

and more besides
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« Reply #26 on: April 18, 2017, 09:40:42 AM »

 Click to see full-size image.
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« Reply #27 on: April 19, 2017, 09:53:16 AM »

12pm today.

rumours

15 englishmen

1 scotsman, hogg

which means 21 irish and welsh

and some big names haven't made it,now said to include Hartley
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« Reply #28 on: April 19, 2017, 12:22:25 PM »

British and Irish Lions 2017 squad

Forwards:

Rory Best (Ireland), Dan Cole (England), Taulupe Faletau (Wales), Tadhg Furlong (Ireland), Jamie George (England), Iain Henderson (Ireland), Maro Itoje (England), Alun Wyn Jones (Wales), George Kruis (England), Courtney Lawes (England), Joe Marler (England), Jack McGrath (Ireland), Ross Moriarty (Wales), Sean O'Brien (Ireland), Peter O'Mahony (Ireland), Ken Owens (Wales), Kyle Sinckler (England), Stander (Ireland), Justin Tipuric (Wales), Billy Vunipola (England), Mako Vunipola (England), Sam Warburton (Wales)

Backs:

Dan Biggar (Wales), Elliot Daly (England), Jonathan Davies (Wales), Owen Farrell (England), Leigh Halfpenny (Wales), Robbie Henshaw (Ireland), Stuart Hogg (Scotland), Jonathan Joseph (England), Conor Murray (Ireland), George North (Wales), Jack Nowell (England), Jared Payne (Ireland), Jonathan Sexton (Ireland), Tommy Seymour (Scotland), Ben Te'o (England), Anthony Watson (England), Rhys Webb (Wales), Liam Williams (Wales), Ben Youngs (England)
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« Reply #29 on: April 19, 2017, 12:28:30 PM »

So

loosehead

Marler
McGrath
mako

tighthead

furlong
cole
sinckler

hooker

best
george
owens

lock

AWJ
Itoje
lawes
henderson
kruis

flank

stander
o'mahoney
warburton
o'brien
tipuric

8

billy v
moriarty
faletau

9

webb
murray
youngs

10

sexton
biggar
farrell

12-13

joseph
henshaw
j davies
te'o
payne

11-14

north
seymour
nowell
watson

utility

daly
l williams

15

hogg
halfpenny



two i didn't seewere te'o and payne

joe launchbury my biggest surprise


no robshaw,haskell, finn russell,hartley, gray brothers

2 scots


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