Hand from Main event Blackpool

[MrDigital]

Played the main event @ Blackpool last night good blind structure no need to get too involved early on i tell myself...

Blinds are 25/50 10k starting stack i am UTG with after 15 minutes of play and raise to 4 x BB UTG+1 calls and 2 other players in late position call also. Too early for any major info however i percieve late position caller (Villain) to be an aggressive type .

Flop  I Lead out and bet 600 UTG+1 calls next player folds and (villain) re-raises to 1200

I call UTG +1 folds and the turn brings the 

I Check and (Villain) bets 2k which I call.  Now I think i'm behind here and I want the board to pair or maybe a check check situation on the river (this is my thinking at the time) Anyway River comes  I check and (villain) bets 5k

I muck my cards Face up and he say's good fold and shows  and a well played hand from him...

Whats's your opinions on how i played it ?

[ifm]

The only thing i will say is that the turn call is very loose, the flop is scary but the turn is terrifying!!
I would've given up on the turn because there are too many cards beating you and for him to be betting into that board must tell you something.

[tikay]

Yes, scary scary flop, turn & river, but it's so tough to put hands like yours down, even though you kinda know you must. Them's the breaks.

Big hands early on can be a problem, with blnds at 25-50 & the starting stack 10k, you are always likely to get multi-way action.

[temp0r]

alarm bells would be really ringin' all over the place for me. the minimum re-raise. the third diamond hits. i'm folding on the turn. but probably re-raising the flop.

[Highstack]

You didn't do an awful lot wrong there Toshi. His 4bb pre call with KT is not the best from ep, but after that he has played the hand well. You were almost priced in for the 2k also. With 6k out there you were only about 7/2 to improve ahead of him with fh or quads and when you consider the implied odds that you may be able to collect on the river if you manage to fill up, then I am probably in too. The pass was obviously correct as the board was far too scary at the end.

[MrDigital]

Ty for replies... Highstack that was my thinking that if the board paired can he get away if he's made the nut flush/straight so I have a chance to bust him... It was just soooo early ...

I wondered if this situation would be played different by me in the later stages of a tourney and there are too many variables to consider.  However, he'd probably be more reluctant to call 4 x BB with that same hand..

10 minutes later after a mid pos limper I looked down to find 10 10 and raised 6 x bb this time and mid limp-er called...

 Flop Q 10 2 I raise he re-raises i push and take an early batch as he shows QQ for a nice set

Ah well hope it spins round for the WSOP

[MrDigital]

OK I would like to add a comment from an online internet pro/sponsored circuit pro who said to me "if you want it in all brutality i think you played it too strong,  these tournaments aren't won in the 1st half hour".

I replied "you mean I should have checked the flop and tried keep the pot size minimal?" and he replied "yes even though i'm not condemning your play".

I can see his stance here and in hindsight think I should have checked the flop and taken it from there.  The hand later Q 10 X is where I think I would go broke on the very first hand in any tourney as the texture is much better.  My thoughts lie with the board and the premise that very early in a main event there's not going to be much representation going off as opposed to later.

I commented that I needed a strategy re-think because I would go bust with this hand late on in a tourney and he replied "yes, so would I"... 

[Highstack]

Well I apologise if it is someone who posts on here Toshi, but I totally disagree. That board is not nice and you can't check and allow free cards there (albeit that you were already behind, but you couldn't possibly know it).

I thought that you played the had correctly and it was just unfortunate. That will happen all the time and no amount of strategy rethink is going to persuade me otherwise.

[ariston]

I agree totally with what you were told Tosh. You cannot win an event in the first half hour but you can get to the rail very quick if you want to. It is a Marathon not a sprint and with a ridiculous number of BBs in your stack I feel you are better to avoid playing big pots too early. If you play a big pot v a good player this early he has a monster too so how good does your hand look now? The best players getting the biggest results on the UK circuit are players like Mickey "the legend"- do you think he would risk his tournament this early? If you dont ever lay a hand down that would have been a winning hand you will never win a big tournament- sometimes laying big hands down keeps you in long enough to get a better opportunity (I forget the exact wording Mickey uses) to get all your chips in. Check call the flop for me then check call the turn and fold the river- you lose far less chips and are still playing for his entire stack if you fill up.

[Highstack]

What about the free cards that you are giving for KK TT or two diamonds to hit a straight or flush draw? There is a not a chance after a pre-flop raise like that he cvan give the guy KT and must assume that he is in front.

The reason for the lead out on that board for me is to take the pot there. I am not looking to play a big pot as it already looks scary enough. I think I am winning and I want the pot.

What about the cardplayer article that suggests you should even take a small edge earlier as it will count as a big edge later (particularly if you are a decent player)? I don't wholly agree with the sentiments of that statement, but I do think I am in front with my middle set here.

[bhoywonder]

great hand and a great fold


very well played

It dawned on you that the str8 or flush was already made by your opponent and i cant fault you looking to pair the board for that extra 2k...you would prob have got all his chips..your opponent seems a solid player..how did he/you get on?

[ariston]

Highstack by assuming you are in front when you flop the 3rd nuts is how you will go out of a lot of events early. If your bet on the flop was for information (ie probe bet - do you have AA/KT/flush draw) then fair enough but if it was a bet because you assume you are in front then you are going to find trouble in a lot of events. Tosh is trying to improve his game before the world series and all I am trying to do his make him think what he is doing with his bets rather than just betting regardless. If you are going to make a bet on the flop decide why you are betting and what you will do if played back at. Tosh hasn't played many slow structured events yet and I am trying to get him used to the fact that you can only go broke early- you cant win anything until the end of day2/day3 etc.

[tikay]

I agree totally with what you were told Tosh. You cannot win an event in the first half hour but you can get to the rail very quick if you want to. It is a Marathon not a sprint and with a ridiculous number of BBs in your stack I feel you are better to avoid playing big pots too early. If you play a big pot v a good player this early he has a monster too so how good does your hand look now? The best players getting the biggest results on the UK circuit are players like Mickey "the legend"- do you think he would risk his tournament this early? If you dont ever lay a hand down that would have been a winning hand you will never win a big tournament- sometimes laying big hands down keeps you in long enough to get a better opportunity (I forget the exact wording Mickey uses) to get all your chips in. Check call the flop for me then check call the turn and fold the river- you lose far less chips and are still playing for his entire stack if you fill up.

The Lord Wernick phrase Ariston is looking for is..."Better Situation?" when considering the play of ANY hand at any stage.

5 days ago I put Micky all-in (we both had 10k+ with blinds at 100-200, & there was 1,800 in the Pot before I jammed) and he passed TT on a 7-8-9 flop. His thinking, he later told me, was simple - "Better Situation". (For all his chips, & his entire tourney in Level 1).

If it's good enough for Micky, it will do for me!

[Highstack]

Fair point TK and I agree with Micky there - we have all passed overpairs to a flop in the face of large overbets in needless situations, but there is a whole world of difference between TT and a set of Q's. The only hand I can give him credit for that is beating QQQ there is a a set of aces and he didn't play like I would expect him to with AA pre so I think my Q's are probably good.

@ Ariston, I take your point about not being able to win from the rail, but the point that I am trying to make is that I am not raising QQ pre and then checking when I flop a set on a scary board.