blonde poker forum

This is quite a difficult post for me to write, and I don't really know why I'm doing it or what I'm looking for.  I suspect I'm not the only one in this position though, and hopefully someone can give me some advice.

Until the end part of last year I never played poker that was outside my means - I've never had a bankroll as such or a lot of spare cash, and was perfectly happy playing $5 tournaments online and going out to play a £30 freezeout (self deal crapshoot) once a month to get my live fix.  Towards the end of the year I had a bit of spare cash around, and started popping up to Luton to play the bigger buy in games now and again.  Over the following months I started going to Luton more often, had a stab at the first equal chance monthly event, and played a few of the bigger tournaments at DTD.  I was loving playing the bigger games - such a refreshing change from the self-dealt crapshoots I was used to, and I was doing well out of them too.  However, poker aside, I was not well off financially any longer, and once I'd treated myself to a few luxury items the money I won from poker had to be used for bills etc.  Going back to the £30 self dealt crapshoots once a month just didn't appeal anymore - I tried a £20 rebuy at the Western one week and hated every minute of it - the table know-it-alls, the bickering, the rudeness.  I donked off purposefully and went home.

On the other hand, the bigger games at Luton with the friendly atmosphere had become like a drug to me.  I have had days where I've been almost physically itching to go and play poker.   When I play I love every minute of it, win or lose, until the next day when the realisation sinks in that I'm just getting myself into further trouble money-wise.  It's now been a couple of months since I had a touch (a small cash last week aside), so I've not had that extra money to help with the bills and I'm really struggling.  If I cut out the poker, I can make ends meet, just about, so it has to be done, but it feels like a part of me has died.

Reading this back it's clear to me that this has become somewhat of an addiction, and it's going to be a tough road ahead.  If anyone has any words of wisdom they'd be much appreciated.  Otherwise I'm hoping that having now made this a public post my pride will stop me turning up at games I can't afford (although I still intend to play some cheapo satellites to bigger games :))

a word of advice.


WIN

build up your bankroll online then when you have enough for say 15/20 buy ins @ £50 then use that only for your live games.It was what i was hoping for until i had to cash out,so I'm back into building it up again.Then its onto the live scene.

Hear what your saying about the western self deal but for £30 on a friday nite it aint bad value even with all the goons that play in it (i pod to block em out??)

Nice to see some honesty, so fair play to you. Do you play cash games at all? If so, if you have no bankroll why don't you try one of the staking sites like Bad Beat or Ed Giddens' one (forget its name) and play with their money?

brave post ... writing things down certainly helps to get things clearer in your own mind, respect to you for being honest enough to admit that you need to stop and re assess your situation.

BUT ... it doesnt have to mean stopping playing, it just means that you need to take stock and look at what you want from the game that you obviously have a passion for.

My advice for what its worth would be .. Have a week or 2 away from the game, yes I know thats hard and it certainly wont be easy ! ... but you need to clear your head and get back to where you were before, by before I mean playing poker for pure recreation and enjoyment, if you win a few quid, happy days... if you donk off its no big deal because you were only playing a small buy in comp that you could afford to lose.

Stick to "social poker" for a while, play a few blonde online comps, rediscover the fun part of the game and who knows, you certainly have the game to spin a few quid up online just through doing that ... and then you will be back on track and will see the bigger live comps as a one off ... or a special treat to yourself if you spin a few quid up.

Trust me, you are certainly not the only one on blonde who would dearly love to play decent buy in live comps but doesnt have the money to play them, there are a lot of us out here ;)

Keep your chin up and get back to basics, play poker for fun and the rest will follow if its meant to be xx

Working up a bankroll isn't so bad once you get your head around it.   

I know you didn't like it, but the Western have dealer dealt tables now and it seems to have improved the atmosphere a bit there and they're a bit cheaper than Luton.  They've also a 50p/£1 cash game now (certainly on Thursdays) which has to be value!

Whatever you do, I hope it works out for you.


+1

Of course it is so tricky. On the one hand you want to play in the bigger games at Luton which is probably where your game should be IMHO and on the other you need the money.
Stop spending your bankroll is probably the tough love advice I can give you. I know, I know it is easy to say but you are not giving yourself a chance. Next wins you have, you have to put into bankroll. Take a small percentage into life and no pressies. Once the bank roll is nice and fat you will notice two things. You are playing with less fear and much more relaxed. Your results will spiral upwards. There will be variance. We all know that but you will be able to play the tournies that you want.............discipline unfortunately is the key. Play the smaller games....muller them and get your 3k together....cos that should be your roll then variance is unlikely to hurt you and wins after that you can put towards life. Thinking about it £1500 may do depending on success rates.

Me I am sticking to playing the open on Sky, cashed twice this week.........oh and most of the Luton fessie, maybe, possibly, probably. Now my fat counsellor might start asking lots of deep questions here but I think we might do that lot by pm if you want..........got to bounce girl. Get up and get going and don't beat yourself up. JFDI

Home games FTW.

Get a group of good eggs together and for a fiver and a few beers/nibbles you can get the same friendly/fun atmosphere of the "big" games without the expense.

You can even stick the stereo on and dance round the living room without giving TK a heart attack at Luton  ;kev;

Not being a Luton-ite, can't say for them, but I'd be pretty sure you'd be missed. From my one meeting with you at Brighton. You are the sort of person that brings the fun into a poker tourney,

Take down the Dirty Dozen $2k jackpot and I'll see you at Luton!

 :cheers: :cheers:

thanks guys.  

CIA - I hear what you're saying, but I really don't enjoy those games. I don't want to be plugged into an ipod when I'm playing poker, I want to enjoy the social side of the game too, with nice people.  I'd rather not play at all tbh.

Online cash - no can do. I am a donk.  full stop.  No self-respecting staking site would take me on, and rightly so!

I hear what you're saying Snat - I've sent you a PM.  Without going in to too much detail on here I'm too heavily in debt to be able to justify to myself having a bankroll of 'poker money' - it just seems so wrong.

I've just got to accept, I think, that in my current circumstances I can't play the poker I want to play.  There are things in my life that are far more important that need my attention - in 6, 7, whatever years I'll hopefully be in a postiion to jump back in - now just isn't the time :)

Think long term.

If you want to stay in these games over an extended period, you need to either be financially well off, or a winning player - in these games.

Take stock of your game - if you think it is good enough then fine, work to get a roll together and have another go.
If not - do something about improving it.

GL.

(BTW, if you want to take another shot at a bigger comp I am sure you would get a good response on the staking board  :))

Hey Claire,

I can really indentify with some of things you have said.  I've played poker about only about 4 times in the last few months purely because I know I have been letting my life slip in the months leading up to that.  When I had my Poker 6 result last summer it changed everything for me.  I hadn't been playing that long as it was, only about 9 months or so at the time.  The win had a huge effect on me.  Up until then the biggest tournament I had played was a couple of £100 freezeouts at the Western, and even that was a big thing for me then.  I was struggling by as a final year student, but after the Poker 6 I had more money than I'd ever had available to me, just sat in my bank account.  I finished my degree, but after than I just played poker.  Just because I could.  I would go down to my local casino and walk home most nights with lumps of cash shoved in my bag, to be hidden in a shoe when I got home.  To begin with I stuck to the smaller tournaments, just playing the £50 freezeouts at my local casino, but I'd had a taste of the big money and wanted more.  When I didn't manage to satellite in to a GUKPT I would start trying to scrape the money together, some of it I got staked for, but some of it was off my own back as well.  

Poker pretty much destroyed my relationship with someone who was very important to me.  I didn't do anything other than live and breath poker.  I was at the casino 6 nights a week, getting in at 6am every morning.  I'd get up at about 4pm and play online for a few hours before heading back to the casino for the night.  My family was worried about me, I hadn't seen any of my non-poker friends for months, and my relationship was dying.  And I didn't care.  

The good run wasn't to last though, and by Christmas I was nearly skint.  I had a small win which got me through the Christmas period and I managed to hang on in January and February.  In early March I had a decent touch when I won the crypto 20k gt, but by this point I was so worn down.  Even after this I kept losing.  They had started having cash games in my local casino, but the players were so bad, and the game so loose that you just had to have a hand.  Bluff and bottom pair calls you in a heartbeat.  The cardroom manager showed me my STT results, and it showed that out of all the players in the casino, I had won the most STTs, so I should have to stuck to that which I knew I could beat, but the appeal of the cash games was too much.  Later in March (or April?) I played the Ladies Poker Tour in Newcastle, and then Manchester GUKPT in the same week.  I took two different cars and broke down on the way to both, and got no where in the comps.  I then went down to my local the next week only to get my flopped top set smashed by a guy who hit runner runner quad 4's.  

I just thought, enough is enough.  Over the last three months I think I have played the local £10 crapshot twice, BB, and a £50 which I got staked for.  I'm going to do my teacher training in September and I've gone some way to sorting my life out.  I think that now, no matter how good a player you are, only some people have the discipline and the control to keep it together when they are losing but know they have to win to pay the bills.  I am not one of those people, at least at the moment.  If you are not playing poker for a living it should be something that you enjoy doing.  If you're not, and it's getting too stressful and it starts affecting your life then you know it's time to slow down.  On the occasions I have played poker over the last few months, even just playing £10 freezeouts, I have enjoyed it.  I've gone up to the casino and had a laugh with my friends, and it doesn't matter whether I win or lose.  I think if I were you I'd maybe had a break for a bit.  Once you've done that you'll find that you start to get a buzz again even just playing little tournaments, without the stress of knowing if you lose that the bills might not get paid.

Just my 2 cents worth anyway.

Some very interesting and honest posts here.

Just as an aside, it amazes me how many people play poker without a proper bankroll and ignoring the rules of bankroll management. I know a lot of good players who play with whatever spare cash they have, I know a lot of serious players who do the same and obviously we all know tons of 'professional' poker players who seemingly have never heard of it. There seem to be a lot of players who have a big tournament win and say something along the lines of 'now I have a bankroll' - what have they been doing before this? I also know a lot of players who use the term 'bankroll management' in inverted commas, as if it is some arty farty garlic bread concept that will never catch on.

Obviously bankroll management is an imaginary wall between money for poker and money for everything else, but for me its the most important and underrated skill in poker (alongside table selection and being really lucky)

Its not a criticism at all, as most of these players are recreational players, but being a bankroll nit myself I always assumed everyone else was too.

These last two, (PocketLady and DaveShoelace) are probably the best poker posts I've read this year

Hi Claire

Great that you can be so honest with yourself and its always tough to have to let something you love doing go....but as a recreational player i suppose you have to put poker money under the heading of luxury money the same as going out for a meal etc etc....

Is there an amount a week you can set aside for luxury and treats or is it all used up with the week to week life expenses ?

As the others say the only real way is to either put aside say on a weekly basis so you can buy into say the £50 freeze out or build from lower stakes.

I've played with you and you have a good solid game that will reap a reasonable result for you in a given amount of time and from there you will have to try and build the ever elusive roll...unfortunately life is full of unexpected twists and at some point there always seems to be something that needs to be paid and you see the money just sitting there doing nothing to a degree and its too easy to use it.

I wish you all the best but i think you have cleared the hardest hurdle in the realisation of your OP.  :)up :)up

I've always been far far from a nit myself and this thread has made me want to give a little insight into what happened to me.

In my last year at School having just turned 18, a friend of mine told me about online bonus abuse playing blackjack. During the following half term we took it in turns to play thousands and thousands of hands to turn over our requirements and cash our our bonuses. Between us we literally played non stop for a week with one sleeping while the other was playing at times. At the end of this week we had made just over 3k, so £1500 each. When most of my friends were slaving away doing minimum wage work in that week for like one fifth of what I'd earnt this was big money for me. I continued to do these scams myself until the summer holidays hit when i literally did them using every family members card I could. I obviously had permission as my dad was explaining to them that we would make money as long as we were patient. I did it with cousins, uncles, friends...and when you're a greek thats a lot of people.

In short, in the 12 weeks before I was due to start uni I was going with £20k english in my bank account. A fair lump for a 18 year old. When I got there things were relatively normal going out getting pissed having a good time until the second term when everyone's student loan seem to have run dry and the going out died down. This is when I decided to start going to the casino and at first all I would play was the touch bet roulette. I was soon hooked and after going through about 13k in a few months I decided to rebuild the roll doing blackjack scams. I made a few grand back but could no longer bear the grind when money was much faster coming and going in the casino.

Poker seemed to be the balance I found but having no respect for money I decided not to play small ball like I should have and after playing only 2 tournies I bought myself into the £500 event at gala Nottingham and eventually came 11th/121. Being knocked out on the bubble after losing a big race to Chris Bruce (who at the time I thought was Julian- and then telling all my mates about the hand I played with the Will Hill pro lol donkaments) I truly got the bug. However by the time I learnt the game well enough to believe I had an edge I had already busted all my cash by playing far too high, against players who, at the time were much better than myself and also never staying away from house games.

In this time my uni course had been completely neglected and Nottingham Uni kicked me out - I didn't fail exams....i just didnt go to any. I had built a barrier to my close uni friends due to the different lifestyle choice I had made being in the casino all the time and then moving away and back home was the hardest thing I ever had to do. My dad was so close to kicking me out altogether but gave me another chance.

I had no choice but to stop all sorts of gambling. After a few months of moping around I got a great opportunity thanks to a family contact and have been working nearly 8 months doing really well. Its sure as hell not as fun as spending all my time playing poker but I guess for a lot of us for various different reasons poker has to take a backseat for a while. Some 10 months later and I reopened my account and started playing occasionally in the evenings and honestly quite a lot at weekends. After my initial £200 deposit and sticking to a 20 buy in system of bankroll management I have made just over £8k (GOD BLESS THE OMAHA DONKS) in 3 months. Everything just seems to be in place again and I believe the break helped me soo much.

I hope and believe for you a break is what's needed. Don't see it that you've lost a favourite hobby, but see it as a time to reflect and get things straight and hopefully like me, when you are ready to play again things couldn't be better.

gl

Make that the last three posts.

agreed

Agreed, great post Cos.

Hi Claire - good thread  :)up

I can empathise totally with you about the buzz at Luton and this 'need' to want to get down there ;-)    I'm very strict with my bankroll and my 'live' games will happen at the beginning of the month - if I cash I get to play more, if I don't I'm online for the rest of the month lol.  I did go a bit mad last month though and went more than I usually would have and boy am I missing it now.

How about some home games???   Anyone else in the same situ that would be interested???

I'd put my name down for those chicka and would be happy to host in my wee small flat (if someone can bring a decent chip set lol).

agree too

Cos it was very hard for all of us watching the way you went down at gala,its great to hear you have turned things around and acting like a grown up,lol.

come up for a visit soon bud just make sure its dtd and not the money black hole other place you come to to see the buds.

What i say is this.

Fuck it. Life is too short. Enjoy urself.

(Red-Dog will be along in a mo to say thats now the best 4 posts he's read this year)

Interesting thread, to say the least.

Claire, you have to decide for yourself. End of.

But I say this. You have the game & the nous to make 1 final in 2 at Luton. It's that simple. Don't bluff, (which is a major part of your game), it just don't work there, & be patient - very patient. Add these to your existing talent, & you will make 1 in 2 Luton Finals. You will. The same 4 or 5 old farts make almost every Final at Luton. You can, too.

But BM is a whole other story. Poker is so addictive, & it can be a slippery slope. Don't go there, stop now if you can't manage. We'll be here when you get back - you know that.

A more contradictory Post (by me) it's hard to imagine, & it won't get added to Red's Top Three!

The same 4 or 5 old farts make almost every Final at Luton

Is that a self promotion ??

Multi-dimensional old farts please

He's right though

Form permitting, even I make 1 in 3 finals and made 1 in 2 in 2007.

Me too apart from the post Vegas car crash im currently involved in...does that mean im also old and farty ??

most definitely, old fart tendencies

You are the exception to the Rule. You just can't play.

But seriously, Claire could make 1 Final in 2 there. Just cut out the bluffs - they are impossible at Luton  - & exercise patience. Almost every player there plays too many hands. Sit quiet early, & wait. It's all about bullet-dodging. Or donk-dodging.

How can you go to a venue and think 'Im not going to bluff once tonight'

you don't, but you know in time those who you don't and those who you might

the default against a random is not to, unless you receive evidence to the contrary.

in Luton.

Hush you. You can't. Just don't tell anyone.

[ x ]. I, Anthony James Kendall, being of sound mind & body, wish to make it clear I never bluff at Luton.

[X] This is true

rotflmfao at the dig at tikay!

Bullet dodging- fine

Donk dodging- This is Claire you know.....

You are the exception to the Rule. You just can't play.

The hole in my game revealed TY Tikay...where would I be without u?

thanks for all the replies and the PM's.  It's not really about 'choice' or bankroll management - I am living beyond my means full stop.  Since I split up with my husband last year and have had to take on a full household's expenses myself I simply don't have any disposable income anymore, therefore I should not be spending any money on non-essentials (and, much as I love it, poker is, let's face it, non-essential).  Trying to maintain a lifestyle I just don't have the means to support is costing me dear and I am getting further and further into debt (I estimate I currently spend about 125% of my income every month - the longer that goes on the worse things will be).  If I cut out the poker I can keep it down to 100%. 

I've always been one to enjoy life for the moment, but I can't do that any more.  My summer holiday this year will be a weekend in Great Yarmouth - gone are the days when I could just swan off somewhere sunny if I fancy it.   It's taking me some time to adjust and tighten my belt, but I'll get there.

I don't want to look like I'm moaning about my financial situation, I'm not and I know there are many people much worse off.  I appreciate how lucky I am to have a roof over my head, food on the table, and the means to pay my bills, as well as the most fantastic little girl in the world and a wonderfully loving boyfriend.

The point of this post was really, I think, to help me to recognise that I cannot continue playing poker as things stand - making it public makes it that bit more concrete.  The hardest part I think is going to be seeing Matt going out to play, and playing online, and feeling a bit envious - it's like trying to give up smoking when your partner smokes I suppose, but hopefully it won't be as bad as I fear :)

thanks again x

cash games are still a wonderful opportunity to make money imo. you could start off with peanuts and especially with rakeback build up a roll over time. it's a tough challenge for sure but as well as making money it will probably also improve your donkament game

 As you said, I would agree about satelliting into the bigger live events.
There is sooooo much going on now, and you would have a lot more satisfaction knowing the $5 tourney leads onto a $100 one, and another step on the ladder to....EPT, GUKPT, Gala, WSOPE,APAT, various TV comps, monthly comps at DTD, Luton,EC,etc.

Freerolls FTW Claire.
As dull as dishwater I know, but more fun than you think. You can play as lag as you like and it's so much fun,especially as you haven't committed anything.
I started playing online about 4 years ago, occasional mtts for micro stakes. Then a couple of years ago i started coming across forums, and of course blonde. From here I actually started to see what games were available and started to do well. Was final tabling regularly and building a bankroll while being able to make withdrawals.
Then 2 things happened. My house got flooded and my partner got pregnant. The bankroll went out the window as had to pay for more important things.
Since my son has been born, and work shifts/responsibilities, I haven't really been able to play much poker, and certainly not with any bankroll, other than what was already in my accounts. What I have always been good at is bankroll management, therefore I had to return to micro stakes.
It's not great as the varience is awful due to the standard of play. If it wasn't for 2 mtt results last year I would have been down for the year.
This year for the 1st 6 months was no better really. However, lately varience has kicked in a bit and 3 final tables has put me well up for the year.
I love playing live, especially the banter and variety of conversation with strangers, and play at higher buyins. Since my son has been born have only played live in vegas, finishing with a healthy profit.
Guess what i'm trying to say is that poker can still be part of your life, but just different to how it has been. I would much rather go down Brighton(nearest casino) and enjoy the banter and take the money, if flushy can down there anyone can :D, but is just more practical to play online, where I can still be round family.
Hope it all works out for ya!!!

Interesting read. I just assumed you had been very successful so you could enter these larger events with a suitable bankroll.

It's funny i am the exact opposite in terms of what I am willing to spend on buyins for poker. The largest online event was the stacked one last week when I was vs you :)

Anyways good luck.

hi best of luck with what you decide. Im not up to alot of your guys standard and have been unemployed since feb even though bombardier say thell take me back when it picks up. I have grinded 1 dollar tournaments and cash loads. Always cashing out when i get good win for family needs. Very hard to play small when you have played higher but enjoyable when you cash even if to pay bills.If you do decide to play small tourneys or cash always play the one ur stronger at . I.e it sounds like ur a good tourney player. you will reap better awards doing what your best at. Always a bit dissapointing when you cant enter a blonde tour u want to, but this forum is a place where most members treat high rollers and small fry like myself the same. Wishing you all the best and hopefully you will stay involved on this site .Your a treasure in ur post to Blonde even if i have not met u in real life.
Steve

If you do the sats on Stars, you can unregister from the sat their for too so you can pick and choose when and what events you play for or simply build up a roll  of T$ or W$.  Some of the sats on Stars are dead soft too.

Another good post :)

I dont think you neccessarily have to pay big bucks to play a decent game and have a good night out.

I discovered the Bristol Meetup group forum a while back but mostly lurked as getting home from Bristol late at night would have involve an expensive taxi. Then I started chatting to Robyn and she invited me along to their monthly £25 mtt which usually has between 25 and 40 runners. I found it was a very tough game but they are all really friendly and I found I really enjoyed it. I like to go as often as I can now (babysitter permitting). I didnt realise till this weekend just how good they all are and am now quite pleased to have actually cash in one :-)

I know London has a Meetup group so maybe you give that a try Claire. You wont make loads of money but home games are cheap and a lot of fun.

Indeed we do...it's HERE (http://poker.meetup.com/89/). Sometimes the 'banter' on the message board gets a little fruity...we can't afford a proper forum or mods, you know. :)

However, Sean Butler (one of our Assistant Organisers) has a game in Ruislip (See HERE (http://www.london-poker.co.uk/hacpoker.php))

This is a perfectly sensible, intelligent thread, full of good advice and support.

Then someone tries to ruin it with lies like that .  ::)

My opinion, fwiw.  I think Claw has got her head screwed on right.  Poker is a luxury.  When we can afford it, play it as much as you like.

But if there are bills to be paid, don't forget about them, and use the money for selfish reasons.

Having said that, I'm not in a dissimilar position, and I stuck £20 ( It wasn't enough to pay any bills, so it was poker or booze ) into Fulltilt which I have proudly built up to £200.  The plan is that when I reach £500 i take it all out, give it to the mrs to spend on 'proper' stuff,  and start again.  The thing is - I don't want to. 

OK - my inner demon has started nagging at me.  Please talk some sense in to me.

As I've already mentioned, I'm in a lot of debt and a significant amount of my monthy income goes towards servicing those debts.  On the other hand, I am showing a profit since I've been playing at Luton.  Is giving up poker really the answer to my problems, or a potentially missed opportunity to help resolving them?

Part of me thinks that I'm in enough debt already that I'd might as well borrow another few grand to use as a bankroll and hopefully continue to play profitable poker, and use the profits towards my outgoings.  The sensible part of me knows that is a foolish idea - I'm supposed to be reducing my debts, not increasing them, and if I have a bad run I'm left in the same position I am in now, but worse, as income from poker is far from guaranteed.  I can have the debts cleared in 6-7 years and start playing seriously again then.

take the inner demon and wring his neck

Hide your credit cards Matt.

not my preferred choice of words.....

Depending on the debt, the level of it, that would be my priority, to clear that ASAP... Disposable income and its luxuries go on the back burner, feeling like you HAVE to win when you sit at a poker brings a whole new dimension to pressure

Only gamble with money you can afford to lose - borrowing more to try and dig yourself out of a hole will only end in more problems

e.g. Marriage, gamble away...  ;)

1 simple question

do you have a big enough sample size @ luton to base a decision on?

The monkey talks sense.  

Agreed. Stop, clear your debts, then start again.

If you're that desperate to play...talk to the monkey about a staking arrangement?

Don't borrow money to play, it's not the way to go.  Start small and build up a bankroll.

Gotta clear the debts first

+1

+2

Yes I definitely agree.  It can be so tempting to think "Just one good night/win and I can solve my money problems"  But what if you lose...especially as that can always seem to happen when the pressure to win is the greatest.  Luton will still be there in a few months time when things are better.

I find it hard to believe some of the answers that are being givien here. There has been talk of freerolls. bankrolls. take  break. Face up to facts. Gambling has got you in to debt. There is only one place for you to go. GAMBLERS ANONYMOUS. The sooner the better of you will be.

gambling did not get her into debt

welcome back mickmoose. we haven't seen you for months since the last time you decided to stir up an argument

Do you know the FACTS?

It certainly didn't get her out of debt lol

Here are the facts. She has been gambling and is in debt. Are they not the facts

Don't borrow money to gamble as it's very difficult to play your natural game when you're thinking of the bills you have to pay, at least thats what i found when i did it. 15k later i realised my errors stopped gambling and paid the debt off over 3 years although it seemed much longer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation)

i think you may need to break it down a little simpler than that for him - i can lend you my wax crayons if you want?

I think chalk maybe the safer option.

peering through my BANoculars and i seeee..........

Play the net- they cater to bankrolls of all size.

Borrowing is not the way to go......

And they say every great player has gone busto at some point and then built their roll back up- hopefully years from now you'll open this thread with a big grin on your face as you prepare to play the final table of the WSOP! (OK maybe a bit optimistic but you gotta have a dream!)

Sorry if I have upset anyone. I apologize. So my advice is like all the other advice you have been given Just carry on as if nothing has happenned.

The advice not to gamble when you need the money to pay off debts is fine. I agree with that.

It was your assertion that she's in debt because of gambling that is incorrect, and yet you state that as a fact. 
 

thanks for the helpful posts mickmoose.

you are right Mickmoose, I do have debts and have been gambling.  How many people on here can hand on heart say they don't have a single debt?  I'm guessing half the people on here at least have a mortgage and/or a personal loan or a credit card.  Should they not gamble?

Here's the situation.  Most of my debt was inherited from my marriage.  We had a joint loan which we had used to buy furniture etc when we moved from a furnished property to an unfurnished one a few years ago, to fund a new car and other stuff you do when you're living in an environment where money isn't such an issue.  We had also borrowed money to pay for our (cheap) wedding, which with hindsight was a waste of bloody money!  At the time, our joint income was more than sufficient to cover our outgoings, including loan repayments, leaving us with lots of disposable income.  When we separated we split the debts in half but between us inherited a whole other household's expenses.  Neither of us could downsize as we have shared care of our daughter, so both need to have two bedroomed properties - they are not cheap to rent in this neck of the woods.  I have built up a bit of further debt on my credit cards over the past few months just on bits and pieces, but also as I have needed to use it to pay large bills.  When I took over my half of the debts from the marriage, I took out a new personal loan in my own name.  In hindsight, I should probably have got the loan out over a longer repayment period rather than choosing the maximum repayment I could afford from my disposable income rather than repaying over a longer period and giving myself a bit more cash available every month.

It has taken me some time to adjust to my new situation, and yes I've been overspending for a few months, including paying poker.  It has been a bit of a culture shock having always worked since leaving school and earning plenty of money.  I've realised I can't now afford (to use a cliche) to carry on with the lifestyle to which I have become accustomed, which includes playing poker - hence this thread - which I would hardly have started if I were a degenerate gambler!!

thanks for the input though!

degen.

:p

You don't have to justify anything, ignore the arse

I know, but I realised the implication was there and just wanted to make it clear.

Oi!  I have feelings you know...

damn, I was hoping you weren't logged on to the forum!  What are the chances :D

Good question.   

lmao

This defo doesnt apply to Claw.

Probs applies to ppl like me and Sunday8pm tho.

The answer is almost certainly no, virtually every live player out there doesn't have a big enough sample size. Yet you can make assumptions that with any any reasonably amount of poker ability (which im sure claw fits into), you will be +ev in live donkaments at your local cardroom. Does this make it a good idea to borrow and spin you way up out of trouble, does it heck. Varience will kill you over 50% of the time.

nail on head.

I'm not going to borrow money to play poker.  If I was seriously considering doing it I wouldn't have posted on here - I'd have just gone ahead and done it, and wouldn't have any need to justify it to anyone but myself.  It's been a difficult day coming to terms with my decision, and that little devil was just nagging at me.  I knew I'd ignore him in the end but, again, making it public makes it more likely I'll stick to my guns.

I've got the apat omaha event to look forward too (if I get a seat) and the blonde bash in september :)

You're spot on there Claire - it does help. Just like a smoker who has just given up and tells everyone so that when they have 'wobbles' the support comes in to stop them having a ciggie.

Keep posting whenever you feel the urge. You never have to justify yourself to anyone anywhere, and most people here know you well enough to know you are just venting your urges so to speak.

 :)up

<Bites tongue>

I'll say it then,


WE HAVE A BOLDIE!!! no more urge posters please

thanks Mich.  I'm almost definitely going to take up your suggestion of hosting a few home games too - it's the social side that I'm going to miss as much as the poker.  For other reasons I don't want to go into on the public forum I've been spending a lot of time alone lately, and getting up to Luton every now and again has been keeping me sane - I don't want my sensible decision not to go and play to end up driving me mad!

I take it you're up for being put on the list of invitees for the first game? ;D

s'ok - I have another forum for that kind of thing ;D

Def  :)up

I'm in the same position as you with regards to the being alone for over 75% of my week - the remainder 25% consisting of mainly Little 'uns social life lol   so going a bit stir crazzzzeeeeee myself.   Working freelance from home has a multitude of benefits but the flip side of the coin can mean a withdrawal from life outside of these 4 walls hence my mad little splurge sessions at Luton last month.

I've never hosted a home game before so I'll get the low down from one of yours then have one here soon afterwards.

I

lol - don't expect anything flash - we'll be sat round my kitchen table timing the blinds with the microwave :)

im uo for that if invited!!!!

good luck with this clare. ur a braver man than me!

of course you're invited - you can be in charge of the microwave :)

OK then - anyone who wants to be stuck on the list for an invite for the opening night drop me a pm.  will be tiny stakes and fun, so anyone wanting a serious game need not apply ;D

Will there be anything in said microwave?

no don't fret - it has a  handy 'kitchen timer' option :)

He wasn't fretting more interested in what was for dinner. must be at least an hour since his last meal....

can't sleep.  Too much in my head.  I think this thread is going to end up as my dumping ground for stuff and some psuedo therapy.

It may surprise some of you to know that I have an incredibly low self-esteem and sense of self-worth - almost non-existant in fact.  Those of you who know me a little better will have already seen the signs.  I rarely take time with my appearance, hardly ever buy new stuff for myself (my mind won't let me justify being worthy of new stuff), and worry far too much about what other people think of me.  I bent over backwards in six years of an unhappy relationship to be who I thought I needed to be, I've been with the same employer since I was 19 (despite being desperately unhappy there) as I've no faith in my abiility to make it elsewhere.

I know that I need help with this.  It's a vicious circle though, part of me doesn't even feel I'm worthy of getting any self-esteem! There are also a lot of demons I'm just too darn scared to face as I know it will have to get worse before it can get any better.

Finding poker was a major turning point for me.  Once I had got to grips with the game I realised this was something I could be good at and it's the one area of my life in which I have confidence in my abilities.  It's also the one thing I've been willing to 'buy' for myself without feeling guilty (but not to the point where I've felt I'm entitled to put winnings towards a bankroll :D).  Hooking up with Matt was another major turning point too - he makes me feel so good about myself, since we've been together it's been like a real rush and I've started to gain a bit of confidence in myself and there are times when I almost feel like a worthy human being :)

That's why I'm finding this all very difficult.  As I've said earlier in the thread, I know that I have to stop playing until I have more disposable income, but when I'm out playing at the casino I actually feel confident within myself and it feels good.  There are so few areas of my life where that holds true it scares the bejesus out of me.

On the plus side, I've been referred for cognitive behavioural therapy to help me with some of this stuff.  I just wish I'd gone through it while I was still playing poker regularly, as I feel it's going to be an even tougher few months ahead now.

I'm sure I'll regret writing this in the morning, but for now at least it's out of my head and on the page and I can hopefully get some sleep.

sleep is over rated anyway ;)

make coffee and surf for porn .... you know it makes sense xx

Hi, you dont know me and I am new to this site.I have read all the thread. Your honesty is incredible. Please dont take this as pub phsyco stuff but if Matt is your ex, why do you say that he "makes"  - not made - " you feel so good about yourself". If I have missed the point completely, please accept my apologies.

Lol you can't tell you are new.

Matt is a regular poster on blonde and is not in the "ex" category AFAIK.

Matt's the new and improved model.  Well, when I say new and improved... and as for model...

Actually down the line with full 20/20 hindsight you'll realise the shorter repayment option was very very much more +ev.

From a purely financial sense yes, but people tend to need more than just finances to maintain a 'life' if not a lifestyle. Most of could save thousands by using all our disposible income on mortgages for example, but would lead to a very boring life.

Uh oh.  That's it, I've got myself started now. Apologies in advance (you can blame tight-lines for the inspiration ;)).

So this is the situation I am in now.  I am working in a place I don't just hate, going there has made me ill.  I am fine when I’m not there, but I breakdown uncontrollably as soon as I set foot in the place.   I can’t go in to too much detail on here as a lot of people know where I work, and if I was seen to be publically slating the place it could cost me my job.

To any ‘normal’ person the answer would be obvious – leave that job, find a new one.  In theory, yes, sounds easy.  In reality, not so easy.  As I said before, I’ve been working at the place since I was 19.  I joined as a secretary and worked my way up, gaining three promotions during my time there.  The job itself is not particularly challenging, and it’s well paid (changing jobs without any experience doing anything else will inevitably mean a considerable pay cut – I think it’s obvious from this thread why that just isn’t an option for me at the moment.)

A few weeks ago I sat and evaluated things and decided that I’d love to do something workwise related to poker.  It seems to make sense – here’s an area where I feel confident and happy.  If I could tie that in with my work and use it to pay the bills, happy days.  Very simplistic – far too much so obviously.  I stuck a post up on the forum asking for advice about getting into the industry – I offered to work for free for anyone who had anything available to give me something to stick on my CV.  Apart from a bit of data inputting here on blonde, nothing came up.  I took that as a knock.  I thought ‘how can i ever expect to get a paid job in this industry if people don’t even want me for free’.  I pulled myself back together and realised the opportunities out there are few and far between, if I want to do something poker-related I need to find a gap in the market and exploit it.  Problem 1 – I have zero creativity or imagination.  Problem 2 – I have zero business nous.  OK, so that’s out  of the window too now.  See how easily I give up?  What would I advise someone else in my position to do?  Approach companies directly, tell them what you can bring to them, tout yourself.  Don’t ask, don’t get.  May not get anyway, but at least you’ve tried.  There comes the next problem, I can’t sell myself – I just can’t.  At a job interview with two candidates left I may well be the best person for the job, but I’ll say I’m ‘ok’ at this or ‘average’ at that whereas the next bloke will say he’s ‘excellent’ and ‘unbeatable’.  Of course he gets the job.  I have an idea what my ideal job would be.  A teeny tiny weeny part of me actually thinks I’d be good at it too.  I’m not going to share that here as you’d all just laugh at me for having my head in the clouds.

The job situation clearly needs sorting at some point though, and I’m hoping the CBT might help me with that.

So back to the poker, a couple of days after making my decision I’m not feeling too bad about it.  I have yet to be tested though – not playing for a few days is nothing new, and as my daughter is with me for the new two weeks I wouldn’t have been going out to play anyway.  I’m going to stick to playing live once a month,  so that’s apat for August and blonde bash for September.  I get paid next week and I’m going to allow myself £50 to stick online and see if I can spin it up playing $5 sngs.  If I lose it, so be it – it’s a lot less than I have been spending on poker of late and it’s a loss I can afford.

Fair do's, totally agree.  But then where possible, absorb your higher rate loans into your mortgage (although I gather claw is renting?) and pay the higher rate loan off ASAP.  This will free up the most of ones disposable monthly income.  

Personal loans are always at a much worse rate than mortgages and as such are dead money.  Necessary evil true at times, but to be offloaded as soon as possible.  If Claw does have a mortgage then I'd def look at the the numbers for a remortgage which we all are used to and comfortable paying over an extended period.  

The danger of course is always that after this gets sorted we yet again increase our outgoing rate and take out another personal loan "for that one big hit" and the cycle can spiral ever faster downward.  Been there, seen it and still wear the T-shirt :)

Regardless of all our 2nd hand advice, the fact that someone airs their fears on a board means to me they have the sense to manage and deal with it.  It's those of us that keep our heads firmly buried in the sand that get a rude awakening when the wheels even begin to wobble!

gl, stoneii

I don't know if you realised while you were typing this.

But this stinks of your self confessed inferiority complex.  Don't rush to post, but when you're ready, start sharing it with a few trusted people, and you'll realise that noone is laughing at you.

BTW I know you don't like the idea of microstakes internet grinding.  But if you are at home getting bored and fretting, there are worse ways to spend an hour or two ( take that from someone who is trying to spend more 'quality ' time with his mrs - whose idea of a fun evening at the moment is to watch BB and then BBLB )

Also, I don't know if this is a stupid idea. 

How about approaching a local pub with the idea of setting up a small stakes game, with a rake.  You get the rake, the pub gets all the extra income from all the booze sold from their added custom. 

You get to play.  You get some pocket money.  You get to teach the beginners, so improving your self worth.  Organising door drops will help it grow.  With growth comes more feelings of success, more self worth, etc.

Once you've got one up and running, then try it with another pub, then interpub games etc. Next year - THE WORLD !!!  MUAHAHAHAHA.

Sorry, got a little overexcited there.

not a stupid idea at all, but there are already poker nights in pretty much every pub round here, so I can't imagine there's any demand.

GL claire


it seems you have lost the entertainment factor in low stakes stuff..( online )

I'm sure you remember the feeling when you 1st took up poker playing very low and discovered you had a talent...

but its the nature of the beast to try higher and higher and then boom...busto

after that it's nigh on impossible to go back to where you started and get that same buzz...this is where im at right now

im trying to get that initial buzz back,,,i withdrew a shitload of my roll 2 years ago online and just havent been able to rebuild to those lofty heights of yesteryear..and its very depressing


Im currently in the process of rebuilding a roll with no major goals except to play good poker and avoid all cash games...always my downfall..always


maybe the lay off will bring that buzz back and a more conservative approach to your roll..even thinking of a long term goal...maybe a nice withdrawal at xmas time or next summer

just my tuppence worth..but gl

Hello Claire,

I've read this thread with my jaw to the floor in parts. I'm sure that, in one way or another, your story resonates with everyone who posts on here. I currently find myself in a similarly interesting (if not entirely similar) situation - which, as a lurker who knows the bare minimum of people on here, I shan't divulge publicly - however, I'm sure I can be of some assistance. I have both industry experience and, er, 'non-poker-related difficulties', so please feel free to PM me if you'd like some advice on either of them.

If not, then I simply wish you the very best in you endeavours and will sign off by thoroughly recommending the $8 20-pays-5 SNGs on Pacific, as a bit of Zen-like patience and one double up will see you in the money. ;)

Stokes

Hi Claire,

 I've not read all of this thread but I know some of the things you talk about have also affected me. I love the game and enjoy playing in good games with good players, however I have not played live since November and online since December. The reasons for this are varied but the main ones are the birth of my daughter which has meant a cut in the money coming into the house, and also the rise in the cost of living in general. I found that I could no longer justify spending money which would be useful elsewhere or my time as I mainly played MTT's on poker, I had to use a chunk of my already small bankroll to pay for necessities and tried to play at lower levels with my reduced funds, but I found the games and players to be totally frustrating. I thought about why the games were going badly for me and I realised that due to my new circumstances, and even though I had a separate bankroll I was playing with scared money, so I decided to stop playing poker and posting on blonde until things become easier for us financially, I don't know how long this will take but I will come back to the game I love and to this forum when I feel I can play my best poker.

 I would imagine that many people are in a similar postion at the moment and its nothing to be ashamed of, you must do whats best for yourself and remember the game will still be there in the future.

Claire, something you wrote in your last post really did remind me of myself last year.  I found myself a bit of a similar situation to you in that when I had to cut back on the amount I was playing poker, I thought about trying to make my money from poker in a way that didn't involve playing it.  I had found myself at a sort of crossroad in my life, not really knowing what I wanted from a career or anything.  I eventually gave up on the idea, but it was in my mind for a while.  I think eventually I realised that yes, although I love playing poker and miss it when I can't, I'm only trying to do this to fill the gap poker has left in my life, as a way to keep myself in touch with it.  It was made even worse by the fact that I now had so many close friends in the game and my boyfriend as well.  It was hard to watch them carry on around me without being able to do it myself as much as I wanted to.  I'm not saying that it isn't for everyone.  Lord knows some very sucessful businesses have been launched off of the game itself, but I realised in the end that it wasn't for me.  I just didn't want to lose poker. 

tldr

BUSTOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

I'm having a really bad day today.  I'd love to offload here, but I can't as I know a certain someone will be lapping it all up and revelling in it and I don't want to give her the pleasure.  Please send happy vibes my way though x

Just remember Claire that we love you and I view a certain lurker with no emotion at all apart from a rare 'what a waste of time and effort, move on' thought.

You are in a far better place than she is. Trust me - the sea of denial and hate is a nasty one, I've been there, and she still enjoys wallowing in it. Leave her to drown in it while you sun yourself by the sea of tranquility, peace and a happy future.

For the record I haven't touched drugs for a long time......I'm just high on life.....xx

I wish I could take just a small pinch of your optimism Trace.  I'm really bad just now and despite having lots of loving friends and family around me I feel so alone.  I've got a million people on hand I can email, telephone, meet for a drink etc, but it's so difficult as no one else can understand or get where I'm coming from.  If I coudl just find someone to talk to that understood it would really help I think.  I'm off back to bed for now to wallow for a bit, will hopefully be brighter when I wake up.

thanks trace x

<<<happy vibes>>>

Ring me you daft bint !

Don't wallow too much it will still all be there when you awake. All you will have done is wasted valuble hours that you could have cracked on with what needs doing to make improvements. It is all so very easy to put one's head under the covers but trust me it don't help any.There is only you that can make you feel better again.

Like my very good friend on here told me recently, You've just got to get on with it. It was the best advice he could have given me tbh.

{{{{{{{{HUGS}}}}}}}}

I can feel my resolve slipping.  I've had a bad day, and my daughter is with her dad for the night.  I want to go out and play.  does anyone know of any cheap games on tonight within easy access of Middlesex?

Happy Vibes!

xx

Sky poker. Rumour has it a really old person is presenting....and his granddad Tikay will also be there.

Join me Claire - I'm winning it tonight.

I really fancy getting out of the flat to be honest, but will bear it in mind!

Mr Orford's Solicitor will be in touch.....

sky poker spot prize comps are so rigged!  I couldn't possibly have sent the correct answer in quicker, but didn't get a mention :(