My D-Day has arrived...advise please

[suzanne]

I have been playing online poker for a few years now and to be honest I havent been to serious about it. I played for entertainment, set myself a max of how much I could afford a week (sometimes went over it) but as I dont get out much I considered it to be my "fun" time.

I turned the corner just before Christmas last year and havent deposited since then but I now feel the time is right to move on.

To be honest i really hoped this day wouldn't come as I feared I would not enjoy the game anymore if I took it too serious but........its here.

I need....hope....want to improve my game so all advice will be carefully studied.

First of all I need to learn pot odds etc, I previously didnt want to go down this road as I quite like going allin now and again with a bizarre hand and outdrawing someone with AA but I realise now that I need to learn them. Listening to snatty at BB3 and "At it" at the p4c game the week before and would you believe Flushy has made me realise that it is essential to know them. So can someone please advise me on the best (simplest) book to buy.

Many of you who have played with me will know I am very readable. I tend to play very tight and when I do try to make the odd steal I fall flat on my face..so what am I doing wrong? Whenever I try to vary my game I end up losing half my chips, comments from blondes who know me would be appreciated here. BTW can I just add that I do rather well on sit and gos when the table is full of unknowns but dread a reconized name coming to the table. I have read Wardonkeys article which I found very helpful but I still lack that edge I feel.

I would like to play more mtts. I gave up on these a while back as I had made 10 second places and have still to win one which I know probably means that I need to improve my HU game (true) rather than my mtt skills however the games I have played were either freerolls or very cheap ie $2 games. I seem to struggle in mtts, I can survive forever as mrs low stack but always seem to bust out pre bubble if I have chips. I would like to move up stake wise and find a better level of game but I lack the self confidence to do this. Any advise on which book to read?  PS Ive read Harringtons.

Finally I dont know if its etiquette to ask this but would anyone like to share what notes they have on me?

I feel I am stuck in a rut where im doing okay but not improving so any advise would be appreciated.

Im going back to bed for a while as I only had 2 hours kip before getting up for the kids  Look forward to reading your replies later.

[boldie]

Well, I 've never played with you but would recommnend Supersystem. It is top notch for all forms of poker (Supersystem two now only costs 16£)

I am mainly playing HU games online at the moment as most people don't know who to play HU and you can clean up very nicely on them. I would recommend to give you some experience HU play some HU online for a 5'er or tenner.

As I've said I've nevber played with you so can't give you any advice on how to improve your play..but the best of luck to you and I@m sure if you put the effort in the rewards will be of equal or greater amount.

[Sheriff Fatman]

Pot odds are less relevant in no-limit poker than they are in limit.  Implied odds played a much higher factor in no-limit poker.  Consequently most of the literature on no-limit poker, such as Harrington, don't really cover odds as much as you would like.

If you really want to get a better feel for pot odds and 'the maths' of poker then I suggest you play a bit of limit holdem, which is a much more mathematical game than no-limit and one in which you have to face these decisions frequently.  There are also far more good books covering limit poker than no-limit, so it should be easier to find something to meet your requirements.

I'm not suggesting that you switch to limit poker permanently.  However, if you dip your toe into some low-limit games you will find that it changes the way you think about the game (I went the other way, from limit to no-limit, and went through a similar experience).  One benefit is that you will have to make decisions on every street, something which rarely happens in no-limit, and it will give you a better 'feel' with regard to the vulnerability of hands, etc.

As for book recommendations, I would suggest one of the following, depending on how simple you want things to be:

Getting Started In Holdem - Ed Miller (beginners book, reviewed here.  Covers pot odds and implied odds during the LHE section.
The Theory Of Poker - David Sklansky.  This is the 'classic' book covering poker theory and was the first one to define many of these terms.  However, its not an easy read and is dry in style.  Probably best as a follow up book if you've any doubts about your level of understanding of the basics.
Weighing The Odds In Holdem Poker - King Yao.  A very good book on limit poker with a lot of detail on pot odds and counting outs.  Some sections are a bit 'mathematical' but its not overwhelming and there's a lot of good information in there.

Sheriff

[Claw75]

i'm certainly not qualified to give you any advice Suzanne - not picked up a poker book myself yet!

just wanted to wish you the best of luck!

[Graham C]

Edited as I didn't read the post properly

Good luck with your game

[Sheriff Fatman]

Its mentioned in her post that she's read the Harrington books already.

Sheriff

[tantrum]

'Hold'em on the Come - Limit strategy for drawing hands ' by Rolf Slotboom and Dew Mason is a great book on learning how to count outs and calculate odds. Although it is for Limit, but it will make you very proficient in looking at draws and assesing if it is worth for you to stay in the pot after big raise.

Learning Omaha will improve your board reading skills (but try to learn for free as I have lost a lot of money on learning how to play this game)


If you want someone to tell you how to play ask your friend to shadow you for a game, and they can write a report on you.(what hands do u call with/raise fold and so on)

[M3boy]

Pay more attention to what your opponents likely holding is, rather than what you are actually holding. This I feel is what alot of "ok" players do not do enough of. This will give you a better chance of taking down pots uncontested.

Pick on week players, and dont be scared to play down the streets, look for weekness and THEN take the pot.

What you are actually holding becomes less important the deeper into a tourney you go.

What Sherrif says about "implied" odds is very true. ie if you hold a small pp against someone holding AA - when you hit your set, you are going to get "paid" off because they cant let go of AA.

Pot odds, a simple way is to multiply your "outs" by 3 and this gives you the %age chance of hitting your card on the turn. - that should get you started. You can work out the rest by just playing around with numbers. After a while it will become second nature of what your odds are of hitting your card/cards.

[Tonji]

sounds like your making good progress in your game suzanne.

I come from the school of learning by playing. I never read a Poker book, but do read the hand analysis threads on forums. For me too much information harms my game. So I play at a level where my mistakes are not too costly & I can slowly learn & improve (I hope). I agree that playing Omaha has helped my NL game. I find also playing PL cash fairly regularly keeps my game sharper & focused. This approach is working for me. I have not reloaded for 2 Years now (oh no probably bokked myself). I play for fun, to win of course, but the aim is still to build a bankroll that enables me to improve by gradually moving up levels.

I have played with you a few times, but hardly ever take notes (a mistake I know), but I seem to remember your dangerous when well chipped up.

Many better & experienced players than I will have more insightful advice.

Good Luck Suzanne.

[totalise]

Pot odds, a simple way is to multiply your "outs" by 3 and this gives you the %age chance of hitting your card on the turn. - that should get you started

so if you have 15 outs, multiply that by 3, and you are a 45% chance to hit your card on the turn? no

[M3boy]

My Bad, maybe it was a little confusing.

When I said "on the turn" I meant AFTER the flop (ie turn and river)

Apologies

(and its over x3 to hit turn and river, just over x2 to hit the river)

[matt674]

I come from the school of learning by playing. I never read a Poker book, but do read the hand analysis threads on forums. For me too much information harms my game.

Just ignore any advice given by anyone who thinks  is an all-in reraising hand pre-flop...............

 

[The Rivercard]

The best advice I can give you is to play some live games. It sharpens your game and because it is slower gives you more time to study other players moves. Even if it is a £5 buy in at your local casino I believe that live poker makes you a better on line player.....Good luck

[M3boy]

Here are 2 pages that may help you :

http://www.pokertips.org/strategy/drawing.php - an article on odds

http://simulator.pokertips.org/odds.php - a pot odds calculator

[Ginger]

Hmmm, I have always worked on x4 for the turn and x2 for the river.

15 outs actually works out to roughly 51.5% (so stick em in!)