Suppressing Your Inner Donkey

[elblondie]

Wow ... maybe I'm wrong then. The way I think is...
Maybe he has KK with spade king...dont wanna give free card
Maybe he has AK with no spade and will make a bad pass...I have seen it done in this coupe.
more importantly...
Maybe he has KK QQ JJ and either he or the button moves all-in... I just can't call with this hand now. If I might be just on a flush draw, I wanna stick my chips in first...it changes the percentages
...
There is also a certain amount of equity in being called by the button on a worse hand and/or worse draw.
I've seen this coupe a few times and I've always pushed...rightly or wrongly
Interesting though.

[Royal Flush]

Maybe he has KK with spade king...dont wanna give free card

I don't see him checking this hand, nor do i see him passing it.

Maybe he has AK with no spade and will make a bad pass...I have seen it done in this coupe.

Yes this is possible, however the chances he has AK is already quite slim given there are alreay 2x A's out and the fact it is very unlikely he is passing given the pot size.

Maybe he has KK QQ JJ and either he or the button moves all-in... I just can't call with this hand now. If I might be just on a flush draw, I wanna stick my chips in first...it changes the percentages

Why can't we call if 1 of them moves in? We probably have the best hand, and when we don't we will have the best draw. I don't  understand how it changes the percentages aswell.

There is also a certain amount of equity in being called by the button on a worse hand and/or worse draw.

This is true but i think if it gets checked to him he checks an A very rarely, i don't see him calling off on a draw if we push unless its the nut draw.


That's how i see it anyway.

[totalise]

Maybe he has AK with no spade and will make a bad pass...I have seen it done in this coupe.

maybe, but its a long shot.

Your push lets them play better then checking does.. KK? fold.. QQ? fold... KK with a spade? they might call, which is ok (i think looking at the pot)

Maybe he has KK QQ JJ and either he or the button moves all-in... I just can't call with this hand now. If I might be just on a flush draw, I wanna stick my chips in first...it changes the percentages
...

but if you are going to push in this spot, then you have decided to commit your chips to the pot, so it doesn't matter if you push, or if you call, as long as you stick to your guns, the chips are going in. It also does change the percentages if you push, it takes a lot of hands out their range that might bet. It reduces your equity against his range... becase you dont give him the chance to put chips in the pot badly, and he is very rarely folding hands that you like, out the pot.

I dont doubt that pushing here is +ev, but i think that checking and letting someone else bet has a superior expectation.

[elblondie]

hmmm...it seems that I am outnumbered here, but my instincts will always make me push my chips in first.
My last attempt at justification...
Forget the hand strategy think about tourney strategy. This is not a cash game.

If I am in a cards on the backs all-in called situation 5 times in a comp I will probably be out even if I am 75-25 favourite every time. Grabbing chips without risk of elimination is a MUST. especially in a coupe like this where there aint nuffin you can have dominated. i dont like check call here.
 

[Royal Flush]

Grabbing chips without risk of elimination is a MUST.

Couldn't agree more, that's why i re-pop pre flop.

Once we are in this situation though we are not facing a "lets avoid a showdown" situation. We crush the 'bluffing hands' so badly, nowhere near 75-25, more like 90+

[kinboshi]

auto fold for me

that's an auto push.

hehe

I think you're both right here.  Depends on lots of things, but I think calling is definitely the last option.  With the blinds as they were, I think I'd lean towards Flush's choice of the push, but knowing the other players and the situation, a fold could be the right choice.

After the call, it's very difficult.  A feeler bet and then react?  Not sure really.  Good to hear people's thoughts though - good hand Raindogs!