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OT: Saddam Hussain
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Topic: OT: Saddam Hussain (Read 20897 times)
MadYank
Rezident Farang (Yank Flavour)
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Posts: 272
Sawat Di Khrap!
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #45 on:
December 30, 2006, 07:11:09 PM »
BLAH BLAH MEOW CHOW!
That's what I think about this debate.
Saddam = Evil
Execution = Correct on any moral scale.
Talkamongstyaselves!
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www.madyankyakburger.blogspot.com
kinboshi
ROMANES EUNT DOMUS
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We go again.
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #46 on:
December 30, 2006, 07:13:50 PM »
Quote from: MadYank on December 30, 2006, 07:11:09 PM
BLAH BLAH MEOW CHOW!
That's what I think about this debate.
Saddam = Evil
Execution = Correct on any moral scale.
Talkamongstyaselves!
Fair enough.
Bush next?
Logged
'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
Indestructable
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Posts: 6482
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #47 on:
December 30, 2006, 07:15:25 PM »
Yes please.
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moritzey
Sr. Member
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Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #48 on:
December 30, 2006, 07:32:05 PM »
By employing capital punishment one simply lowers oneself to the level of those punished. I don't see how executing someone (anyone) could in any way be a good starting point for a new nation. It utterly contradicts concept of human liberty, rights and dignity.
That said, yes, Saddam probably was an evil dictator, but for that matter there are a couple more of those around, and no, killing him did not make Iraq any more secure, safe or democratic than it is now. Prison would have been a far more suitable alternative, and even that is very disputable.
I for one, agree that it is good we got rid of Saddam, but as far as everything is concerned that happened
within
Iraq, under his rule, it is very difficult to hold him for those things accountable on a legal basis, using a Western legal system. After all, he was the ruler of that place, so if he decided to kill some people in their, how exactly can you disallow him to do so. Westphalia 1648, anyone? Technically, all he did was put himself into the same category as any US governour signing a death sentence in their respective court?! ... OK, that paragraph was a little blasphemous.
Anyway, a couple of points, probably some already mentioned before:
- Civilised countries should not (and usually do not) extradite people to places where they are threatened with the death penalty. Shame the US seemed to apply different rules in this case
- Ten commandments, anyone? Thought the US called themselves a Christian nation of some sort?
- Lowering oneself to someone elses standards is just plain stupid. The best way to demonstrate the superiority over 'new Iraq' over 'old Iraq' would have been to not execute Saddam, but instead afford him what everyone deserves. A
fair
trial (it's not exactly fair when your lawyers keep getting shot, is it? and there's a fair few other reasons, too, but no need to go into detail, I think), a just sentence and hopefully a lifetime to sit in prison and not be able to sleep at night because of your bad conscience. Death just seems like the easy way out for everyone involved ..
- As far as Ian Huntley and co. are concerned, the same applies. Furthermore, I'd rather have 20 brutal rapists, murderers &c pp. in prison and costing the state money than one innocent person executed, just because of some missing piece of evidence that only turned up a couple of years later (If anyone's interested, google for exonerees or innocently executed in the US, it's long, long lists. One link:
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=6&did=110
...)
'nuff said
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CelticGeezeer
Sr. Member
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Posts: 909
Viva la Quinta Brigada
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #49 on:
December 30, 2006, 08:02:24 PM »
Wasn't Saddam a great friend of America, didn't he attack Iran with American support. When he was gassing the Iranians with chemicals bought from Britain and the USA nobody appeared too concerned.
Hypocrite: the man who murdered both his parents... pleaded for mercy on the grounds that he was an orphan. ~Abraham Lincoln
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"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why the poor have no food, they call me a communist." - Dom Helder Camara
The Baron
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Posts: 9558
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #50 on:
December 30, 2006, 08:07:38 PM »
Quote from: MadYank on December 30, 2006, 07:11:09 PM
BLAH BLAH MEOW CHOW!
That's what I think about this debate.
Saddam = Evil
Agreed but it's amazing he wasn't executed 20 years ago when he was actually committing the crimes! Back then he was our buddy.
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kinboshi
ROMANES EUNT DOMUS
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We go again.
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #51 on:
December 30, 2006, 08:10:12 PM »
Quote from: moritzey on December 30, 2006, 07:32:05 PM
By employing capital punishment one simply lowers oneself to the level of those punished. I don't see how executing someone (anyone) could in any way be a good starting point for a new nation. It utterly contradicts concept of human liberty, rights and dignity.
- Civilised countries should not (and usually do not) extradite people to places where they are threatened with the death penalty. Shame the US seemed to apply different rules in this case
The US has the death penalty, so it would be highly hypocritical if they didn't extradite people to places where they could be punished by the death penalty.
Not saying I agree with the death penalty, or if the US is a civilised country, but just highlighting the point.
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'The meme for blind faith secures its own perpetuation by the simple unconscious expedient of discouraging rational inquiry.'
thetank
Hero Member
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Posts: 19278
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #52 on:
December 30, 2006, 08:39:39 PM »
Quote from: Claw75 on December 30, 2006, 06:51:14 PM
Quote from: CelticGeezeer on December 30, 2006, 06:43:36 PM
Are the ten commandments just guidelines ?
I hope so....my neighbour has one fine ass
POTW!!!!!
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neeko
Hero Member
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Posts: 1759
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #53 on:
December 30, 2006, 08:45:34 PM »
Personally i am against the death penalty - full stop - it does not matter what the person has done.
I think i read somewhere that the death penalty actually works out more expensive than the life imprisonment. it takes about 10 years to execute someone in the States and once you include the appeals, the appeals of the appeals, and dozens of lawyers its cheaper to just lock them up. (the criminals that is not the lawyers that is
.)
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There is no problem so bad that a politician cant make it worse.
http://www.dec.org.uk
thetank
Hero Member
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Posts: 19278
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #54 on:
December 30, 2006, 08:58:59 PM »
Quote from: moritzey on December 30, 2006, 07:32:05 PM
- As far as Ian Huntley and co. are concerned, the same applies. Furthermore, I'd rather have 20 brutal rapists, murderers &c pp. in prison and costing the state money than one innocent person executed
Gotta agree there.
For me, the most ludicrous argument in favour of the death penalty is that it's cheaper to execute people than punish them by other means.
If that is the grounds on which we are basing our desicions to, as a state, take a human life from this world, it would be dangerous precendence indeed.
Quote from: moritzey on December 30, 2006, 07:32:05 PM
- Ten commandments, anyone? Thought the US called themselves a Christian nation of some sort?
This doesn't sit well with me though, for a mulititude of reasons.
- The US is not a Christian nation. That is made quite clear by their constitution.
- The Ten Commandments are Old Testament doctrine, Christians are more into the New Testament. In one of the Gospels of the New Testament, (can't remember which one) Jesus pretty much spells out how much they don't matter anymore. Loving your neighbour as you would love yourself was the jist.
- Not far away from "Thalt shall not kill" in the holy book is the old chestnut "an eye for an eye"
- The first five books of the Old Testament (in which Moses got his commandments form Mt. Sinai, also documented about 40 other crimes that were punishable by death.
- For the above reason, the translation of the commandment "Thalt shall not kill" is probably more accurately "Thalt shall not murder" I need not point out the fundamental difference between the two.
Don't get me wrong, I'm very against the death penalty. I just don't think that invoking religious doctrine into the argument does either side any favours. (Claw wouldn't have made me laugh with her neighbour's ass joke if we didn't though, so I'll let you all off)
«
Last Edit: December 30, 2006, 09:02:06 PM by thetank
»
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snoopy1239
Hero Member
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Posts: 33034
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #55 on:
December 30, 2006, 09:00:23 PM »
Look at the Shawshank Redemption. Thank God they didn't execute poor Andy!
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thetank
Hero Member
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Posts: 19278
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #56 on:
December 30, 2006, 09:05:07 PM »
Quote from: kinboshi on December 30, 2006, 07:13:50 PM
Quote from: MadYank on December 30, 2006, 07:11:09 PM
BLAH BLAH MEOW CHOW!
That's what I think about this debate.
Saddam = Evil
Execution = Correct on any moral scale.
Talkamongstyaselves!
Fair enough.
Bush next?
pwned
Logged
For super fun to exist, well defined parameters must exist for the super fun to exist within.
Indestructable
Hero Member
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Posts: 6482
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #57 on:
December 30, 2006, 09:10:37 PM »
My view is that some people don't deserve to live. Some mistakes will happen, but correct me if I am wrong the stats on those incorrectly hanged are very low. I would rather they hang 10,000 and get one wrong than to let 10,000 rapists/killers live.
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mex
Sr. Member
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Posts: 765
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #58 on:
December 30, 2006, 09:16:55 PM »
Funny how the chinesse leaders can murder 10,000's and we sign agreements with them.
lets face it Saddam died because the west wants/needs Oil, we didn't go to oust him for the good or saftey of the iraqi people we did it for personal gain.
We play cricket with countrys lead by mass murderers.
We stand by and watch ethnic groups be 'cleansed', then wonder why they stand together and fight back.
We sat cowering at the prospect of the Islamic Bogey man.
I would of been a damm sight happier today if certain western leaders had been punished for the crimes against humanity they have committed in the name of 'freedom' and (their) God.
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thetank
Hero Member
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Posts: 19278
Re: OT: Saddam Hussain
«
Reply #59 on:
December 30, 2006, 09:25:35 PM »
Quote from: Indestructable on December 30, 2006, 09:10:37 PM
My view is that some people don't deserve to live. Some mistakes will happen, but correct me if I am wrong the stats on those incorrectly hanged are very low. I would rather they hang 10,000 and get one wrong than to let 10,000 rapists/killers live.
So we're killing the rapists? Ok
The 19 year old guy who sleeps with the 15 year old girl has commited statutory rape. Is he getting hung too?
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