Ivey the hustler?

[ariston]

exactly- the round wouldve cost 1.5 million total when you've been cheated. Just pay up and sever all ties to a man you will have to sit across the table with week in week out eh? If someone has blatantly lied when asked a direct question about his handicap he not only shouldn't get paid he shouldn't get another round for high stakes.

[byronkincaid]

I know nothing about golf so can't comment as to whether or not it is cheating, but I'm a bit surprised that 1 mil is so much to ram. he plays 200/400 NL online right? So 1 mil is like 25 buy ins? I would have thought you'd want to have 100 buyins minimum bankroll for those kinda stakes.

[BrumBilly]

I can't afford to lose a million hence there'd be no bet to be cheated on!!!

I live by a very simple personal code and I don't tailor it according to economic cost. And I'm not saying you or anyone should pay up in those circumstances. What I am saying is that I pay up when I lose. I lose what I can afford. When people don't pay me I'm not interested in their reason as I'm still 'down'. If you can't honour a bet then don't gamble. If you make a MUG bet then pay up and try not to make MUG bets in future.

[I KNOW IT]

Does anyone know the exact amount of shots Ivey was given for that SPECIFIC round and he previous round they played together? These guys play enough golf together so they should have a fair assessment on Iveys game.
I know hes had 3 months of coaching but that realistically would probably take 2  -  3 shots off his handicap if hes lucky.

   

[ACE2M]

I know hes had 3 months of coaching but that realistically would probably take 2  -  3 shots off his handicap if hes lucky.

  

22 shots sounds high but 10 -15 shots off in 3 months of playing with coaching everyday is very plausible.

[I KNOW IT]

I know hes had 3 months of coaching but that realistically would probably take 2  -  3 shots off his handicap if hes lucky.

   

22 shots sounds high but 10 -15 shots off in 3 months of playing with coaching everyday is very plausible.

Absolutely no chance, if you had been playing 1 month maybe. Ivey has been playing for over a year regularly so the improvement factor reduces greatly because hes at a certain level already, albeit a poor one.
Unless Ivey was shooting 130+ a round

[ripple11]

 
Friends or not,millionaires or not, playing for that sort of money is stupid,and highly likely to end in tears.

[ACE2M]

they said 100/1 on him to break 50 for 9 holes so assume 120+ a round

[marcro]

Didn't Negraneau make a comment that every time he played for money his opponents had the best round of their life?  Seems a theme here with poker players on the golf course?

[ariston]

I played for years and got down to an 11 handicap. To not be able to break 50 then suddenly shoot 39 over 9 holes should tell you all you need to know. I do believe in paying up on silly bets if I lose but if I had been blatantly cheated and lied to on the question that was used to set his handicap on the day I wouldnt only not pay I would probably give a little dig for the cheek as well. The stakes these guys play with the press in effect means even if he had been truthful when asked the question he would still have cleared 200k off ram and marc. By cheating he has done himself out of that 400k. He has also done himself out of any future games so all the lessons and hard work will have been wasted. If he had played poker with a marked deck against these 2 guys and won 1.5 million by cheating would they be expected to pay?

[Sark79]

If they don't pay up, won't other gamblers feel afraid to take on bets with them because of this ?   I don't know about these sorts of things, I am not really into betting.  I have read numerous times that if a player doesnt pay up then they are viewed badly by others


Some people feel it is cheating and others don't.  What is the general feeling in Las Vegas amongst Ivey's American friends?

[ariston]

The comments I have heard from other players (household names) on this affair seem to be in agreement about the guys being cheated and they wouldnt pay. At first I thought maybe the guys would come off bad for not paying but it seems the players who play for that sort of money regularly are more against Ivey for his actions.

[RobS]

I don't play golf, but I don't understand why these poker players want to play a very high stakes gambling game where by definition every player in the game has an EV of zero (unless someone has 'cheated' by having a lower handicap than they should).

So what's the point?

Also, and I have no idea what the answer is to this, what would be the variance on a round of golf between three players where the handicaps have been fairly decided? In football, for example, two teams of equal ability, it is definitely possible for either team to win 4--0 on any given day. Could jet-lag be a factor in Mark/Ram playing worse than normal, or the change from arctic to warm weather conditions?

Might aswell flip a coin for $50k per flip, and if you go 9-2 down refuse to pay up becasue it's rigged. Saves on time also.

Sounds like a joke to me, if you want to play for $50k per hole in a game with an EV of zero just so you can boast about playing golf for that much per hole, when you lose give the man Ivey his money!

[byronkincaid]

I don't play golf, but I don't understand why these poker players want to play a very high stakes gambling game where by definition every player in the game has an EV of zero (unless someone has 'cheated' by having a lower handicap than they should).

So what's the point?

Also, and I have no idea what the answer is to this, what would be the variance on a round of golf between three players where the handicaps have been fairly decided? In football, for example, two teams of equal ability, it is definitely possible for either team to win 4--0 on any given day. Could jet-lag be a factor in Mark/Ram playing worse than normal, or the change from arctic to warm weather conditions?

Might aswell flip a coin for $50k per flip, and if you go 9-2 down refuse to pay up becasue it's rigged. Saves on time also.

Sounds like a joke to me, if you want to play for $50k per hole in a game with an EV of zero just so you can boast about playing golf for that much per hole, when you lose give the man Ivey his money!

most of the match is played before a club is ever picked up. if you can negotiate a good deal you win before you play,

[tantrum]

Insert Quote
I don't play golf, but I don't understand why these poker players want to play a very high stakes gambling game where by definition every player in the game has an EV of zero (unless someone has 'cheated' by having a lower handicap than they should).

So what's the point?
!

These are guys who are rich, they like to gamble and this gives them pleasure of some sort...they can afterwards bragg about their losses and wins, which is much easier then showing off their houses/wifes/cars and cocks... while playing at the casino

For poorer guys this can be equivalent of who is stronger/ burbs loudest /knows most jokes/ have most birds..../have bigger car ....