This is a bad beat and i cannot fathom why the guy was in the pot??

[Newmanseye]

PokerStars Game #8869363663:  Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2007/03/12 - 16:42:17 (ET)
Table 'Sibylla II' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Boz2301 ($7.35 in chips)
Seat 2: Govfrt ($17.05 in chips)
Seat 3: newmanseye ($8 in chips)
Seat 4: Cheynus ($5.65 in chips)
Seat 5: roy_viktor ($7.30 in chips)
Seat 6: LG87 ($13 in chips)
Cheynus: posts small blind $0.05
roy_viktor: posts big blind $0.10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to newmanseye [ ]
LG87: folds
Boz2301: folds
Govfrt: folds
newmanseye: calls $0.10
Cheynus: calls $0.05
roy_viktor: checks
*** FLOP *** [ Ah ]
Cheynus: checks
roy_viktor: checks
newmanseye: bets $0.30
Cheynus: calls $0.30
roy_viktor: calls $0.30
*** TURN *** [ Ah ] []
Cheynus: checks
roy_viktor: checks
newmanseye: bets $0.40
Cheynus: folds
roy_viktor: calls $0.40
*** RIVER *** [ Ah ] []
roy_viktor: bets $1
newmanseye: raises $6.20 to $7.20 and is all-in
roy_viktor: calls $5.50 and is all-in
*** SHOW DOWN ***
newmanseye: shows [ ] (a straight, Four to Eight)
roy_viktor: shows [ ] (a flush, Ace high)
roy_viktor collected $14.30 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***

I push in on the river because i think that no one in their right mind has the flush and a straight would hav eplayed out differently.  So immagine my surprise when he calls with the flush, I admit i should have ended the hand sooner but wanted a customer with some legitimate draw to pay me a little, how can he stay in on the flop ??

Can anyone see a good argument for his play here?

[tantrum]

yes

it is 0.05/0.10;)

when he bet you on the river, after flat calling you, it probably meant he was ahead;)

[matt674]

yes i agree his call wasnt very good on the flop - but on the plus side you can keep your 50p as i dont think it was a bad beat.

You put 5% of your chips in on the flop with the best hand (even if it wasn't that strong 3 handed).

You put 6% of your chips in on the turn with the best hand but now your opponent has picked up a draw and your bet is hardly big enough to force him to pass.

You put 89% of your chips in when your opponent is holding the nuts.

Anyone who calls me on the flop to hit runner runner goes straight on my friends list but maybe if you look how you played it rather than just blaming your opponent for playing it badly, perhaps you could have raised more on the turn? Perhaps you could have raised less on the river and passed to an all in reraise?

[Newmanseye]

I totally aggree that my push on the river is a silly one, however I simply could not see how he could have had the flush, calling for a runner runner, I actually thought i was ahead here and hence the reason for the push, Perhaps its a denial thing on my behalf??

I know I played my hand badly, i could have got away from that hand very cheap, I just fail to understand the calling for a "bingo" runner runner mentality.

Perhaps i should have let the steam off before posting.

[matt674]

I totally aggree that my push on the river is a silly one, however I simply could not see how he could have had the flush, calling for a runner runner, I actually thought i was ahead here and hence the reason for the push, Perhaps its a denial thing on my behalf??

I know I played my hand badly, i could have got away from that hand very cheap, I just fail to understand the calling for a "bingo" runner runner mentality.

Perhaps i should have let the steam off before posting.

I've called many a bet when i hold absolutely nothing if i feel that my opponent isn't that strong - then if they check on the turn i bet out and try and get him to lay down his hand. If he doesnt then i might get lucky and pick up a draw and a further way to win the pot.

I doubt that is what your opponent is doing here and if all the money went in on the flop then i would agree that it was a bad play - but without the power of ESP we'll never know the real reason why he played it the way he did.

[Muahahahaha]

Can anyone see a good argument for his play here?

Well.   TBH.     Being a terribly fishy guy at this level .

This is the kind of play I make quite often ( Far too often, I know )

The logic behind the thinking goes something like :

On seeing the cards :  Nice, KQ sooted, I've got possibilities here.
On seeing a free flop : Well I don't like the A, but if it does go somewhere, I've got nut possibilities.  I'll check & hopefully I'll see a free card.
After your bet : Hmm.  Well he's not very convinced, is he.  He could well be bluffing just trying to take it down cheaply.  I don't think he's got an A.  Shall I reraise & push him off it.  No, that might get expensive, but he's giving me 3/1 oddsl, so I'll call & see what happens.  I can always put it down on the turn.  It's only 30cents ffs.
After the turn card :  Now that is nice, if this hits, how can I get him to pay me off.  Bloody hell, he's only charging 40 cents, thats 4/1.  That's proper odds that is. I'm in !!!

I'll let you work out the rest.

Now I know this isn't great poker thinking.  But it's honestly the sort of thing that goes through my mind at these micro levels.  Because the stakes are so low, & the actual cash is so meaningless, it's often a case of finding excuses to play, rather than excuses to fold.  Because to be honest, after paying 30 cents, which is meaningless, he's got a very good logic for hanging around, & there's a hell of a lot of cheap flops he can see with your $7 or so.

[boldie]

Can anyone see a good argument for his play here?

Well.   TBH.     Being a terribly fishy guy at this level .

This is the kind of play I make quite often ( Far too often, I know )

The logic behind the thinking goes something like :

On seeing the cards :  Nice, KQ sooted, I've got possibilities here.
On seeing a free flop : Well I don't like the A, but if it does go somewhere, I've got nut possibilities.  I'll check & hopefully I'll see a free card.
After your bet : Hmm.  Well he's not very convinced, is he.  He could well be bluffing just trying to take it down cheaply.  I don't think he's got an A.  Shall I reraise & push him off it.  No, that might get expensive, but he's giving me 3/1 oddsl, so I'll call & see what happens.  I can always put it down on the turn.  It's only 30cents ffs.
After the turn card :  Now that is nice, if this hits, how can I get him to pay me off.  Bloody hell, he's only charging 40 cents, thats 4/1.  That's proper odds that is. I'm in !!!

I'll let you work out the rest.

Now I know this isn't great poker thinking.  But it's honestly the sort of thing that goes through my mind at these micro levels.  Because the stakes are so low, & the actual cash is so meaningless, it's often a case of finding excuses to play, rather than excuses to fold.  Because to be honest, after paying 30 cents, which is meaningless, he's got a very good logic for hanging around, & there's a hell of a lot of cheap flops he can see with your $7 or so.

excellent post.

[Moskvich]

Also, when he bets into you on the river, the flush isn't necessarily that unlikely - he could have had absolutely anything to start with, so it's perfectly possible that he's hit a bit of the flop, say middle pair, called with that and then backed into the flush.

[Newmanseye]

Can anyone see a good argument for his play here?

Well.   TBH.     Being a terribly fishy guy at this level .

This is the kind of play I make quite often ( Far too often, I know )

The logic behind the thinking goes something like :

On seeing the cards :  Nice, KQ sooted, I've got possibilities here.
On seeing a free flop : Well I don't like the A, but if it does go somewhere, I've got nut possibilities.  I'll check & hopefully I'll see a free card.
After your bet : Hmm.  Well he's not very convinced, is he.  He could well be bluffing just trying to take it down cheaply.  I don't think he's got an A.  Shall I reraise & push him off it.  No, that might get expensive, but he's giving me 3/1 oddsl, so I'll call & see what happens.  I can always put it down on the turn.  It's only 30cents ffs.
After the turn card :  Now that is nice, if this hits, how can I get him to pay me off.  Bloody hell, he's only charging 40 cents, thats 4/1.  That's proper odds that is. I'm in !!!

I'll let you work out the rest.

Now I know this isn't great poker thinking.  But it's honestly the sort of thing that goes through my mind at these micro levels.  Because the stakes are so low, & the actual cash is so meaningless, it's often a case of finding excuses to play, rather than excuses to fold.  Because to be honest, after paying 30 cents, which is meaningless, he's got a very good logic for hanging around, & there's a hell of a lot of cheap flops he can see with your $7 or so.

Great post mate, Thats the sort of thinking i was after, Like i said I accept the beat as my fault as i could have taken the pot at any time up till the river and could havegotten away cheap on the river I chose not to. 

[johnbhoy76]

PokerStars Game #8869363663:  Hold'em No Limit ($0.05/$0.10) - 2007/03/12 - 16:42:17 (ET)
Table 'Sibylla II' 6-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: Boz2301 ($7.35 in chips)
Seat 2: Govfrt ($17.05 in chips)
Seat 3: newmanseye ($8 in chips)
Seat 4: Cheynus ($5.65 in chips)
Seat 5: roy_viktor ($7.30 in chips)
Seat 6: LG87 ($13 in chips)
Cheynus: posts small blind $0.05
roy_viktor: posts big blind $0.10
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to newmanseye [ ]
LG87: folds
Boz2301: folds
Govfrt: folds
newmanseye: calls $0.10
Cheynus: calls $0.05
roy_viktor: checks
*** FLOP *** [ Ah ]
Cheynus: checks
roy_viktor: checks
newmanseye: bets $0.30
Cheynus: calls $0.30
roy_viktor: calls $0.30
*** TURN *** [ Ah ] []
Cheynus: checks
roy_viktor: checks
newmanseye: bets $0.40
Cheynus: folds
roy_viktor: calls $0.40
*** RIVER *** [ Ah ] []
roy_viktor: bets $1
newmanseye: raises $6.20 to $7.20 and is all-in
roy_viktor: calls $5.50 and is all-in
*** SHOW DOWN ***
newmanseye: shows [ ] (a straight, Four to Eight)
roy_viktor: shows [ ] (a flush, Ace high)
roy_viktor collected $14.30 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***

I push in on the river because i think that no one in their right mind has the flush and a straight would hav eplayed out differently.  So immagine my surprise when he calls with the flush, I admit i should have ended the hand sooner but wanted a customer with some legitimate draw to pay me a little, how can he stay in on the flop ??

Can anyone see a good argument for his play here?

Don't take this the wrong way but I think you need to look at your own play here first.

playing A6 in the first place is just rubbish. Limping with it is even worse.

the guy was in the big blind so there's no point in moaning about him being in the hand when you didn't have the balls to raise it up.

on that flop he probably thinks you don't have an Ace due to you not raising pre flop.

To be honest I don't really have any problems with his play